This is a repost of a puzzle question I asked over the summer, and now
some researchers claim to have found the solution to the original
puzzle.  If so, please use this question to post your answer.  The
original puzzle is listed at:

https://answers.google.com/answers/main?cmd=threadview&id=50956

If you'd like to take a crack at this, please read the puzzle
description, clarifications, etc at the URL above.  Good luck.

---

Request for Question Clarification by mork-ga on 19 Sep 2002 08:11 PDT

The previous posting of this question left several unanswered
questions.

1) How is this 'puzzle' presented to the staff?  [word for word!] 
i.e.  is there some sort of sign above the postage stamps explaining
the 'contest'?

2) Is this actually a 'puzzle' or is it a 'game'?  A game to _find_
this list (who cares what it is)?  Or a puzzle, whereby the list has
some sort of meaning - a sequence of states which is not random, but
ordered by some property?

3) Is the picture of the postage stamps been made available yet (as
previously mentioned)?  Can you think of any reason why postage stamps
are being used?  Do you believe they are in fact part of the puzzle
itself?

I happen to completely agree with the comment shananigans-ga added
below.  The same thought occured to me the first time I read this
question.

Clearly, with only 1 or 2 states I could win the 'game' by finding a
list like that which had some meaning.  However, with a growing number
of states on the list the 'game' becomes increasingly harder and thus
so does the reward.

Please post this question exactly as it was posted to you.

Also, is there any strong reason to believe USA Today really has
anything to do with this aside from the fact he reads that
publication?  "lots of colorful pictures" in association with a list
of states sure implies ATLAS to me!

For the record, I liked what quirked-ga said in his comment in the
previous posting of this Q.  Although, since I (and he) are clearly in
the minority, I will continue to give it some thought.

Looking forward to your responses!

---

Clarification of Question by patricknichols-ga on 29 Sep 2002 09:34 PDT

I'd just like to clarify the conspiracy theories surrounding this
question.  First off, I'm not a full time MS employee -- I worked
there last summer as an intern, and hope on returning next summer. 
Secondly, its possible that the puzzle is some sort of hoax --
assuming that our group leader enjoys wasting the time and energy of
the people in the group.  For any number of reasons (including the
fact that he's a nice guy), I find this unlikely.

---

Request for Question Clarification by gnovos-ga on 02 Oct 2002 17:50 PDT

This may be the order in which states passed LLC acts, but I do not
know where to find a list of the order in which they were passed.  I
might help clarify some if we knew more about the asker of the
question.  If he is an engineer, the kind of questions he might ask
are different than if he were a business man or a dentist, etc.

Could it be the order in which the States gave up slavery? The order
in which the British settled the US? I have no idea, I'm Australian...

Interesting...
First link I got was
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0763770.html
which obviously wasn't it ;-)

"(this comment made me suspect USA Today, and the puzzle
creator in fact gets a daily subscription to USA Today.  This might be
circumstantial evidence ...)"
is the article Available on the web.? or was it in print?

Is it possible that the added clues don't make the puzzle 'easier',
and that's why the prize money goes up? For instance, with just one
state you can find on the internet the order in which a variety of
things happen, starting with that state. But when there are more
states added, the list becomes more specific and harder to find...

From the FAQ...

How do I sign up to become a Researcher? 
Because of an overwhelming response by qualified candidates, we are
temporarily not accepting additional applications. Please check back
with us again, as we likely will begin accepting applications again in
the near future.

Even if someone has the answer, they may not be able to post it
"officially."

Two possibilities that we might be overlooking.

The troublesome clue to me is that the answer could be 48 or 50
states.  Now, when most of us hear this we think automatically of the
continental US and assume the exclusion of Hawaii and Alaska,

But, what if this is not the order in which an event _occurred_  but
is the order of an ongoing process,  Thus, only 48 of the 50 states
have done this thing so far, i.e. elected a black senator or something
like that?

Or, if the answer takes the Dakotas and Virginia/West Virginia as
single territories  at the time they participated in the event, even
though they were later divided?

I am not an official researcher yet, but Ihave been breaking my brain
for weeks over this thing.  I hope someone comes up with an answer
soon!

Ed

Is there any hope of additional clues - beyond the 21st state to be
revealed?  The problem that I, and I am sure others, have is that
there is not enough data to narrow the search.  For all we know this
could be the order that the Manfranjansen family established homes in
the US.

Seriously, if the boss would give any kind of direction it would help.
 Is it a legal/governmen event?  Related to commerce (the order in
which the states got A&W Root Beer shops)?  Sports?  Anything that can
help narrow the focus would be great

I was wondering if a picture of any of the state flags the boss uses
to identify the states has ever been posted on the internet?  I
thought perhaps the way he announces the next state is a clue.  Why
does he use flags, and where does he get the flags?  Are they pictures
cut out of a book (encyclopedia, text book???), stamps, stickers, or
printed pictures off of the internet (on-line encyclopedia???)?  Maybe
he is posting them in the order the flags are in the book he is
cutting them from (I am sure the book would have them in some
meaningful order though), or the order the stamps were issued.  I do
not have anything to back this up, I just thought it was strange to
use a flag...why not just write the name of the state on the poster
board?

Maybe I didn't catch it, but have there been any new states listed? 
I've been away for a month so there should be a new one by now, no?

Doesn't it seem likely to others that this "puzzle answer" is just an obscure 
list of states based on some obscure criteria? With this many people spending 
so much effort on this puzzle, it seems like someone would have figured it out 
by now if it was a legitimate puzzle.  Just a thought.

An ordering that I thought of was official state visits by President
Clinton. He visited the 50th state (Nebraska) in December 2000,
shortly before this question was posted (and was a newsworthy item).
However I am unable to find a list with the order of states. Just a
suggestion.
  --Maniac

Re maniac-ga's comment on the order of Clinton's visits:

The idea is a good one, and it was suggested by asbestosman-ga in an
August 28 comment to the original question.  However, katiemay-ga's
comment in response suggests that this is not the answer.

any word on what the 21st state is? are the states released on the 7th
of each month? If not, what dates are they released,and who has
authority over those dates? I thinking that maybe August 7 (when
Patrick released Maryland) could have something to do with a specific
event that happened on August 7, of some year in Maryland, and then
say on Sept 7, that event happened in the 21st state, etc

Patrick, it looks like the puzzle was started January 2001. Can you
give us the dates each of the states was released?

This game seems to have a nice little reward at the end, it's run by
some muckety muck at Microsoft, it's been running for almost 2 years.
One would think there would be something on the internet about this,
you know gamers talking strategy, gamers sharing info. There's
nothing. I also did a seach on Patrick Nichols, and can't locate
anyone by that name working for Microsoft, though I have found several
references to a person by the same name refusing a job at Microsoft,
to take a job with another company.   Now just because I can't find
anyone by that name working at MS, doesn't mean anything, most folks
aren't going to be found on a Google, but the fact that there is no
chat on the internet about this game, makes me wonder if it's not a
hoax visited on exuberant researchers by a couple of guys laughing at
our expense.

Patrick, Is there a 21st state yet?  Please let us know asap.  Thanks.

"I also did a seach on Patrick Nichols, and can't locate
anyone by that name working for Microsoft, though I have found several
references to a person by the same name refusing a job at Microsoft,
to take a job with another company."

It only took me two minutes to find Patricks (old) Microsoft email
address, as well as his current email address using google.  (I was
who contacted him mentioning two individuals claimed to have solved
it, as well as noting that the 'solvers' inability to figure out how
to contact him suggested they probably were wrong...)

I suppose I could figure out who his ex-boss was as well, and contact
him to see if he would be willing to answer some questions, but since
his boss has not posted or suggested his willingness to be questioned
(although he has read our posts on the other thread), I'm reluctant to
do so.

LetterRip

So Letter, you're saying Patrick no longer works for Microsoft? Does
that mean he's no longer privvy to game info?

Hmmmm. I didn't find his info, but it could be because I tried too
hard, and through in a bunch of extra search terms.

maybe it is national geographic, they have many colorful pictures.

it is definitely not the order in which states got a krispy kreme franchise.

I thought it may be the order that the states appear on the US
monopoly board but i can't find a monopoly board that has all the
states as different squares, you'd think someone would have thought of
making that board wouldn'tcha ?

SO, we are saying the question's originator no longer has access to
the data?  That makes this a dead question, in my opinion.  It might
go down as the one that got away

E

Patrick -- 

Please post the names of the 21st and 22nd states (they both should
have been declared by now).  If you're too busy to keep up with the
puzzle on a regular basis, let me know and I'll help.

But please post these two states asap.

Thanks

Joe

Interesting ... Even as I ponder over the possibility of answering
this, there are a couple things of general note that may prove useful
to you or my fellow researchers in providing an answer.

First, as you may know by now, this list is not predicated on the
order of admission to the Union, nor is it seemingly determined by
historical settlement. Yet, the text of the challenge tends to
indicate some geographic variable. The problem indicates that the
completed list will consist of 48 or 50 states. That suggests that the
creating variable will involve the 48 contiguous states, but may or
may not involve Alaska or Hawaii in a way that would require their
listing as well.

That's what I can offer thus far. Forgive any ground I might have
retread upon needlessly.

I hope this helps,

Brettquest

OK now I am intrigued.  
I don't care if I find the answer or someone else does.  I just want
to know the answer!  I've spent the morning trying a variety of
things.
Here are some ideas:  
1.)  This could be a reverse ordering.  i.e Delaware is 48 or 50.
2.)  Patrick posted that one or two of the ideas were on track
according to the puzzle creator prior to August 15, 2002 - going back
through that the item that stands out is sports.
3.)  another huge hint that it is not a ranking..."the order in which
something happened" according to Patrick.  Finding a list of Delaware
Famous Firsts might be useful OR a list of famous lasts!
4.)  We must assume that this information was published before the
contest started.
5.)  The puzzle creator says the information can be found on the
Internet.  Obviously, this information was not published in list form.
 Perhaps we are looking for a map of the US with numbers on it. OR it
could be helpful to check out Invisible Web sites - those are sites
that are not crawled by search engines.
6.)  Another idea is that the information comes from Microsoft in some
way shape or form.  Like number of operating licenses sold by state. 
Or something having to do with the history of Microsoft sales.
7.)  The answer might be on Microsoft's INTRANET not Internet.
8.)  Try searching AlltheWeb.com - they index entire PDFs.  If the
information was past the 18th page of a PDF - Google does not crawl
it.
9.)  The problem with searching web sites and other sources like
LEXIS-NEXIS and others is that rarely do they include charts and
graphs in their indexes.  So colorful publications would have to be
searched by hand. :(
I ran a NEXIS search to see if the information or list was printed in
any publication indexed on NEXIS - the answer is no.  I also ran a
search through RDS Tablebase with no result.
10)  I ran a  search on Microsoft's web site to no avail.  It is not
the number of partners in each state.  I don't know the answer to this
but did all 48 or 50 states sue Microsoft in the Anti-Trust case?  If
so, maybe it's the order in which they filed suit?

Just some ideas...

I hope someone finds the answer.  Would love an update on the missing
states as well!

Celeste

Anyone's got the colorful Microsoft Encarta anywhere?

LetterRip or anyone else -- Can you find a way to contact Patrick or
his  Microsoft Group Manager to find out what's happening with the
puzzle and what are the 21st and 22nd names?  I've tried
unsuccessfully to find Patrick.  Let me know -- Thanks.  Joe

Just found this thread, very interesting.  A few things to cross off -
it's not largest city (alphabetically or by population), altitude of
highest point, date of adoption of current state flag, number of U.S.
Presidents born there, or number of bordering states.

I think the key to this puzzle may be Arizona.  Many of the states
listed are eastern states and states that joined the Union reasonably
early on, while Arizona is the western most state (so far) and was the
48th to join.  So, assuming this is based on 'the order in which
something happened', it has to be something that happened unusually
early in Arizona, in order for it to be listed earlier than many
states that were states earlier.  Either that, or we're looking for an
'event' in relatively recent times, such that the ages of the states
doesn't really matter.

I emailed Patrick on Saturday, asking him if he could update us on the
status of the States.

No word back yet.  Updates as warranted...
LetterRip

If I have my facts straight, then my guess is that:

State # 21 is Pennsylvania.
State # 22 is Georgia.

But you are all spending a lot of time on something you won't be able
to solve without knowing the puzzle creator.  And he probably won't
tell you anyway--this was originally intended as something to raise
money for charity.

My suggestion:  go work on a better question.  Come back in 2 years
when all 48 (or 50) states are listed and see what the answer is then.

TheCooker,  would I be correct in surmizing that your first name is
also Pat? (if so I figured either you or John R. were the puzzle
originator, and more likely you).

The reason many of us have wasted far too much time is our compulsive
puzzle solving and not knowing the answer is a slow form of insanity
<grin>.

No mention was made that it was for charity.  (each wrong answer was
donated I presume?).

Anyway, thanks for the additional States and clue,

LetterRip

Nascar P****** or Baseball *** (or a related title...)?
Am I close?  (That was the only 'personal' information I could think
of that a coworker would know about their boss...)
LetterRip

48 or 50 might mean that at the time of the riddle there were 2 states
that did not fit into the puzzle.  For example, there are only 2
states in the US that still do not have a state lottery.  Utah and
(Georgia?) I read the other day are the last 2 lottery-free states. 
However, I read an article the other night that stated that Utah will
soon be the only state remaining without a lottery. <:)>  My
suggestion is that the reason the riddle states 48 or 50 is because
the answer can (or will) change by the time the riddle get's answered
(given it's current lifespan)

Just my 2 cents worth.  Hope someone gets it, because I dream about
this dang riddle now.  Hehe.

i've been a casual observer only, and wonder if the question was
reposted since this last expiration?  keep it up ya'll.  your comments
to each other are great.  good teamwork for strangers --

AJILLIS

Sorry, but NV also does not have a lottery.  Georgia will be getting
one soon, though

I'm trying to keep up with this puzzle because I'm stumped but I hate
giving up.

Has September, October and November been listed, yet?

Is there a remote possibility the flags on the posterboard could have
been misidentified?

Have any of the months been skipped?

A question for Google:  Is it possible to add a function to this where
we can select "last comment" order?  The only way I found this
question was by selecting the highest paid column to see what
questions would be asked for $200.00.  Of course, there's a column for
last question asked, but then the commented ones that are old get
buried in the pile.  Er...going to find a feature request link to send
this to them now.

Hawaii doesn't have a lottery either.

-Coach-

Patrick who asked the question originally is no longer responding to
email, and appears to have lost interest in the puzzle.

The puzzle originator (Mr. P. Cook aka thecooker), has clearly stated
that we need personal information about him in order to solve the
puzzle.

The only information which I would expect to be known by his
subordinates that I could find on the net was his previous place of
employment, which was also a games software company.

They made the software titles Nascar Pinball, Baseball '94, and
others.  This suggested to me that it might be the order of states in
which you raced at the tracks in the game of Nascar Pinball, or the
states of the oppoenents played in baseball 94'.

It might be worthwhile to check those games (as well as other sports
games by the same company).

At anyrate, since additional clues are not forthcoming it would be
rather futile to proceed.

LetterRip

Thank you, Letterrip.  I'll just erase this puzzle from my
memory...assume the answer is 'the order the states introduced the
internet' (I know...wrong answer, but in my brain, it's correct to
allow closure) and move on. *smile*

For the month of November 2002 is:   Kentucky.

Some of the comments here are very amusing, thanks.   If you took the
right parts from the right comments you would have the answer.   Some
people are closer than they think.   Others are, well, very amusing.

If you want more history of the "puzzle" then ask Lexnet--he has the
real story.

I just emailed Patrick N. with my guess and to throw in the towel, and
you go and post another state - curses! <grin>
I just emailed joe to get 'the complete story', I guess I'll waste yet
a bit more time before deciding I don't want to play anymore...  - I
hate the idea of a puzzle beating me...
LetterRip

Here is a summary of every previous comment

1)n/a
2) history buff? strange pattern?
3)USA today? Chart?
4)not constitution ammendment
5)not date flag adopted, not flower, nor census state rankings
6) order electorals reported for pres. election.
7) not 6
8) national geographic? other pub?
9) olympic torch path
10) not postcard trip
11) not state quarter, not alphabeical of state trees, birds, flowers
- teacher salary? state property taxes?
12) n/a
13) not zipcode number order, not area code number order, not hwy
number, order of univesity founded? , not NASA satellite passovers,
not map connectedness, not population, letter ending?
14) gun fatalaties? 
15) n/a
16) not 14
17) not math of letters
18) n/a
19) n/a
20) n/a
21) letter ending?
22) geographical clustering?
23) geographical clustering?
24) n/a
25) in Sports Illustrated?
26) not most murders, not best teacher salary, not most populus, not
largest city, not safest city, not best education, not best hospitals,
not best state for kids, in a publication for kids?
27) not letter ending..
28) not in state fact finder
29) baseball - yankee conference? other sport which states are strong?
30) population per square mile?
31) not 30
32) n/a
33) ratio?
34) not Gross state product.. number of scientists and engineers?
number of patients per 1000 workers? number of office jobs? number
imported fresh fish?
35) freedom train (after time of hint)
*********
36) n/a
37) not tobacco lawsuits
38) highway tolls?
39) sports college rankings?
40) n/a
41) n/a
42) n/a
43) n/a
44) west nile virus?
45) n/a
46) not 44
47) not when football/basketball program stated at univesities, not
school official start of nickname and mascots
48) not battleships or submarines, not historical order
49) number of corporations registerd?
50) n/a
51) tour order? sport adoption by a high school? first appearance of
'barnstorming sport team'? spear of a franchise?
52) streets on a map?
53) Census abstracts?
54) n/a
55) bush or gore tour? convention order? 
56) not average CEO salary
57) not NFL #1 draft, not NBA #1 draft, not Heisman winners
58) not compensation of employees, and related, not number of house of
reps per state,
59) not a DC map street order
60) n/a
61) recap of nots
62) square dancing?
63) n/a
64) order of seats were acclaimed for pres/congress/senate? order
polls closed/opened? order of primaries?
65) not pres or congress primary dates, not order which got a
newspaper, not order of dennys.
66) n/a
67) state vowel ordering?
68) not delaware destroyer tour
69) n/a
70) n/a
71) not Naders campaing tour
72) n/a
73) Title IX compliance?
74) states visited by Clinton?
75) n/a
76) n/a
77) n/a
78) n/a
79) n/a
80) not order clinton visted states
81) not tour order ? n/a
82) n/a
83) n/a
84) dictionary order? magazine spread?
85) my recap
86) n/a
87) more of my recap
88) Microsoft litigation?
89) not MS litigation.
90) order of signatures somewhere? The last state to become a state
first? The order of population of a certain race? order of internet
capability?
91) n/a
92) n/a
93) order of auto race tracks?
94) n/a
95) n/a
96) n/a
97) n/a
98) n/a
99) n/a
100) n/a
101) release or event date?
*******
1) states gave up slavery? british settled US?
2) n/a
3) n/a
4) n/a
5) n/a
6) n/a
7) legal/govenment? commerce relate? sports?
8) related to the source of flags?
9) n/a
10) n/a
11) clintons state visits?
12) not 11?
13) n/a
14) n/a
15) n/a
16) n/a
17) n/a
18) from national geographic?
19) not krispy kreme franchise
20) monoply board order?
21) n/a
22) n/a
23) geographic variable related?
24) a recap
25) from Encarta?
26) n/a
27) not largest city, not highest altitude, not date of state flag,
not number of US presidents, not number of bordering states.  Key is
Arizona?
28) n/a
29) state update from Mr. Cook - tells us we probably need to know the
puzzle creator to solve it.
30) n/a
31) Nascar or Baseball software related?
32) lottery related?
33) n/a
34) not 32
35) n/a
36) n/a
37) n/a
38) n/a
39) state update - right parts from the right comments would give the
answer.
40) n/a

So, something within the first 34 clues is "on the right track", it
occured to me that Mr. Cook is head of the racing and sports division
of MS, ergo he probably has an interest in racing as well as other
sports.  So track may have been a clever hint.  However, instead of
NASCAR race track, which was what I was thinking - it might also be
track and field events, horse, dog, or motorcycle, or truck track
racing.

I'm thinking it might be the order that states established
international speedways, but can't confirm that yet.

LetterRip

I think the prize money goes up in order to encourage politics and
make this a game of chance.  Even when someone figures out the answer,
he'll become greedy and try to wait as long as possible to claim his
prize, as the prize grows as time passes.  You see, computer
programmers like seeing gaming theory in action.

maybe this is a list of the states where your boss is committing a
serial crime...   does he take long road trips?   does he keep an axe
in his car?  shovels?
 
HMMmmm...   ;-) 
 
tpo 
___________________________ 
01001111011000000100100001100001011011000110110
00110111101110010011000010110111001100000011100
11001000000100111101100000010100000110000101100
11101100101001000000010000001110111011101110111
01110010111001110100011100000110111100101110011
011100110010101110100

Up-to-date info is online at www.Lex.Net/puzzle -- which includes an
animated list of the order in which the states were added.  MOST
informative.

The complete list of states is now:

1. Delaware 
2. Connecticut 
3. Massachusetts 
4. Rhode Island 
5. New Jersey 
6. Illinois 
7. Wisconsin 
8. Texas 
9. Arkansas 
10. Louisiana 
11. Indiana 
12. Ohio 
13. Iowa 
14. Arizona 
15. Alabama 
16. Mississippi 
17. Florida 
18. Minnesota 
19. West Virginia 
20. Maryland
21. Pennsylvania
22. Georgia 
23. Kentucky 
24. North Carolina 
25. Tennessee
26. Virginia 
27. South Carolina