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Q: Inclusion in the next reindex ( Answered 5 out of 5 stars,   1 Comment )
Question  
Subject: Inclusion in the next reindex
Category: Business and Money > Small Businesses
Asked by: robbyb-ga
List Price: $50.00
Posted: 07 Nov 2002 08:41 PST
Expires: 07 Dec 2002 08:41 PST
Question ID: 101210
Greetings Google!  I'm writing a question because I'm curious about
reindexing of two websites I submitted during the 3rd week of
september.  These websites are www.motorcycleseating.com and
www.motorcyclecommunications.com .  My question is, based on the date
I submitted them, when are they due inclusion within the google search
engine?  (I asked this question last month for $5 and was told I would
be included in the next index, so I've spent a bit more money this
time to find out where exactly my sites are in line at and so on) 
Thanks!

Request for Question Clarification by sgtcory-ga on 07 Nov 2002 09:29 PST
Hello Robby,

Whoever told you that you would be added during the next index should
have told you how Google works. Google does not automatically accept
every site submitted.

The Answers program is a seperate entity within Google; offering
answers to questions that people can not find on their, or need help
with. When it comes to questions like this, about the Google search
engine, we 'usually' can not give definite answers.

With that said, we can offer advice on how to ensure your site
increases it's chances of being indexed. I can offer insight on how
the process works, and where else you should consider listing your
site.

Would you like this type of information?

I have several sites listed with Google, and I often help ensure the
success of others that have quality sites like yours that do deserve
to be indexed.

Let me know what you would like to do, and I'll do my best to help.

Thanks -
SgtCory

Request for Question Clarification by sgtcory-ga on 07 Nov 2002 09:39 PST
The above should have stated :

"...that people can not find on their own, or need help with."

I apologize for any confusion :-)

Thanks
SgtCory

Clarification of Question by robbyb-ga on 07 Nov 2002 11:21 PST
"With that said, we can offer advice on how to ensure your site
increases it's chances of being indexed. I can offer insight on how
the process works, and where else you should consider listing your
site."

That will be great if you can offer advice on getting
motorcycleseating.com and motorcyclecommunications.com included in
google, and any other sites you can recommend submitting to are also
very appreciated.  Thankyou.

Request for Question Clarification by sgtcory-ga on 07 Nov 2002 13:32 PST
Great! I will do this when I return later tonight at about 10pm EST. I
have a few errands to run, but your are the first question I will
address upon my return.

Fellow researchers : Save this one for me if possible.

Thanks again!
SgtCory
Answer  
Subject: Re: Inclusion in the next reindex
Answered By: sgtcory-ga on 07 Nov 2002 14:38 PST
Rated:5 out of 5 stars
 
Hello Robby,

First thing to do is take note of the comments made below by Robert.
Once again he and I are on the same sheet of music. While I don't
agree with all he said, these points are valid :

- Same Content
- Quantity of pages
- Quality of pages, with concern to HTML size and verbage count
- Links pointing into your site

Indexing your PHP files should be no problem. Google prides itself on
the fact that it does indeed include dynamic pages such as these. A
case in point would be to point out one of my dynamically driven
database sites :

- It is indexed each and every month (99% of the pages are PHP)
- There is a mix of static content, with highly relevant information
(No Spam)
- Over the last three days, hundreds of dynamic pages have been
indexed


Google - Indexing checks and balances
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Many people will attempt to tell you they have the answer to getting
indexed in the major search engines. There are many flaws with the way
'techies' are approaching the 'rules and regulations' that Google has
for inclusion in their index. I want to break some of the most common
rules down, and show you comparatively what you would want to do with
concern to your sites, and how the data is often misunderstood.

Data from Google's Do's and Don'ts Page
://www.google.com/webmasters/dos.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Google says do NOT :

Participate in link exchanges for the sole purpose of increasing your
ranking in search engines.

This does not mean do not participate in, or create a highly relevant
link exchange. Your site is about motorcycles. If you build quality
link exchanges with the top sites in this field, your site will almost
certainly be indexed. The common mistake by most people offering
advice in this area is that they tell people to not participate in
these exchanges at all. This is definitely a bad strategy. It is also
not a bad idea to swap links with sites that offer comparable services
in other fields - i.e. car seats.

What to do         :

Send out some friendly emails to sites that complement yours and are
in the same general area of sales (not to include competitors). Swap
links as often as possible. When you can, get links put on the front
pages of the sites, or on a page that has high visibility to search
engines. You can also build your own link swapping area with some of
the free scripts available from HotScripts:

http://www.hotscripts.com/PHP/Scripts_and_Programs/Link_Indexing/

Essentially these are scripts you place on your site, that allows
people with similar sites to add a link on your site. In return, ask
for a favorable link on their site. You would be suprised at how well
Google accepts highly relevant links, and sites that have return
links.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Google says do NOT :

Set up pages/links with the sole purpose of fooling search engines.

Using alot of keywords is a bad idea. Using keywords in general on
pages that you have created is smart. When I say 'keywords' I am
referring to describing your site accurately, and often. Here is a bad
example (The keywords are just obviously over-used.) :

"We are the number 1 motorcycle seat provider. Our motorcycle seats
are seats for motorcyles. We can custom make motorcycle seats too!"

 
What to do         :

Here is a better example of placing appropriate 'keywords' within your
site. Only use the ones that fit, and keep the description honest. If
you have pages with no description, you may want to add one to each.
It can only help end users understand what the page is all about, and
offers a great window from, and for search engines.

"Our motorcycle seat selection is vast. Leather or vinyl, we carry it.
If you're tired of your current seat, or simply need a new one, you
have come to the right place. We make custom motorcycle seats as
well!"

I recommend reading some of the data available on keyword density :
http://www.webmasterworld.com/forum3/3654.htm

Also see this helpful article :
http://www.websitekeywordsubmission.com/google-search-engine.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now I want to offer some more of my own tips and advice :

- Add your site to the DMOZ. It is probably one of the most important
places to be listed, as it's data is used in every major search
engine. If your site is listed with them, then you'll likely see a
listing with Google. Google uses a modified version of this whole
directory, and gives a higher relevance rating to sites within. Here
is the DMOZ site :

http://www.dmoz.org

Simply surf to the appropriate category and add your site. Inclusion
in this engine can take months, but is well worth the wait. Lycos,
Hotbot and hundreds of other sites use this database too.

- Link, Link , Link. This is by far the most important. Build a trust
with others in your general site theme area. Explain to them the
benefits of swapping links, even referring them to this question if
needed.

- Once again visit the DMOZ site. Find sites that are listed in
categories relevant to your site, and try to exchange links with them.
Most of the sites are already established and are a good launching pad
to get your site going.

I hope that gives you enough food for thought. I want to note that I
will be back with more information in the form of comments as they
come along. This question is very important, and I'm glad I was able
to answer it.

I didn't use much search strategy to help with this answer. I have
several sites, and hundreds of pages in the Google index, so most of
my answer is first hand working knowledge. Should you need
clarification, please ask before rating this answer, as I would love
to offer more insight.

Thanks for the great question!
SgtCory

Clarification of Answer by sgtcory-ga on 07 Nov 2002 15:02 PST
I should note that I was really not finished :-) I just wanted to give
you a chunk at a time.

Take a look at this diagram, and you will understand (in very simple
form), how Google looks at your site with regards to links. Site Y is
found (already in the index), and Google travels through it's link to
your site. The crawler then checks it's own index for a link back to
the site that links to you. If this link is found, and the keywords
and site theme match according to Googles specs (indexing algorithm),
your site will stand better chances of being indexed. In short, most
sites are found through link partnerships such as this. Of course this
is a very simple explanation, and there are more factors to take into
consideration. This method does work when used legally to benefit all
web users, and not just the webmaster :-)

Your site = x  Partner Link site = y  Google = G  Direction of travel
= < and >




G ->->->->->->->->->->->->->-[y]->->->->->-<-<-<-<-<-<-<-<-<-<-<-[x]
      (A)                    (B)                                 (C)

A - Crawler comes out to play
B - Hits site 'Y', and finds a link to your site.
C - Comes to your site, and finds a link back, giving more cause to
index it.


This is why I say, you should make sure the 'y' sites are highly
regarded in the Google index. Once they see that you are establishing
credibility with these sites, they consider your site to be highly
relevant.

Thanks again -
SgtCory
robbyb-ga rated this answer:5 out of 5 stars
Thanks for your help.  That was very thorough!

Comments  
Subject: Re: Inclusion in the next reindex
From: robertskelton-ga on 07 Nov 2002 12:01 PST
 
Hi Robby,

It is hard to give a definitive answer to a question like yours, and
seeing as I didn't notice this the first time I looked at your sites,
I'm posting this as a comment, and giving other researchers a chance
to answer the question.

A possible problem is the About Us and Contact pages. They use the
same text as the sites already listed by Google: airrider.com &
gelpad.net. While it makes sense for you to design your sites in this
manner, the Google software might use this to determine that your
sites are an attempt to spam the Google index.

At a guess, the use of .php, which allows dynamic page creation, could
be an additional factor.

The Google software might be thinking to itself... 

1) Same content
2) Dynamically generated

...I've seen this pattern before!

I suggest changing the text of these pages to make them individual,
then resubmitting. Also increasing the amount of original content at
each site. At present, http://www.motorcycleseating.com/ for example,
has two pages with the same text as other sites, and only the index
page which is unique. Google software might have some kind of ratio
criteria going on.

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