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Q: Career help: CIA FBI Psychology Counseling ??? Which, what, how, why? ( Answered 5 out of 5 stars,   0 Comments )
Question  
Subject: Career help: CIA FBI Psychology Counseling ??? Which, what, how, why?
Category: Reference, Education and News > Job and Careers
Asked by: stressedman-ga
List Price: $100.00
Posted: 07 Nov 2002 20:05 PST
Expires: 07 Dec 2002 20:05 PST
Question ID: 102398
Alright. I have an important question. I'm 22 years old. 2k in debt -
Be -0- debt in about 6 months. I am seeking a career but not sure what
all is out there. I want to help others but being a doctor is out. I
don't like it. I'm looking for a career, a profession. Something I can
spend my life working at and enjoying. My interests, FBI, CIA, law,
Problem solving, crime fighting, explainging the unexplained etc...
But what I'm looking at are either the
above stated or related to fields. I'm highly intellegent. I want to
know what a career in this area holds as far as pay, education needed,
retirement and that sort of thing. What all do people in these areas
do? I've also looked into the fields of psychology and counseling.
Could you tell me the same on these fields? Pay, education needed,
retirement, related fields etc? And if you can think of any more fun
and interesting ways I could spend my life helping others and making a
very good living at it, throw that in to will ya? I'm also interedted
in astronomy, star, moon that sort of thing. See, I've made my mind to
dedicate myself to a career rather than working my 8 dollar job for
the rest of my life. I'm asking for direct, solid and helpful
information that could help me make a decision on which filed to go
into, how much money I could make at it, what exactly it would take to
get there and that sort of thing. Thanks!
Answer  
Subject: Re: Career help: CIA FBI Psychology Counseling ??? Which, what, how, why?
Answered By: politicalguru-ga on 08 Nov 2002 04:20 PST
Rated:5 out of 5 stars
 
Dear Stressedman, 

Thank you for your question. First of all, I hope you're not *that*
stressed as your name might suggest. Wanting to do something in your
life, and knowing about some things that interest you, is a great
start. Some people don't even have that! You should be also happy for
the fact that you're "only" 22. I recently had a woman who was 34 and
in the same position as yourself, including more debts. Setting her
life on track would be much harder.

It is a widely known fact, that the more intelligent you are, the more
you worry about things (because unlike the "stupids" who don't think
about these things, you do), but it doesn't mean that you have to live
your life depressed and stressed. Actually, depression and stress is a
recipe for *not* doing anything with yourself, and remaining in the
same position.

I'll refer to your question in parts. Later, if you have any more
comments of you'll need clarifications, feel free to ask (through "ask
for clarification"). Some of my comments depend on variables you have
not mentioned, and if you think you have to add on them, feel free to
ask.

I'll begin with your debt. 2K debt is not a lot, but it's better to
start over - especially if you may have to relocate - with a clean
sheet. You should first think of ways to eliminate, or at least ease,
this debt. This is not going to be easy, but actually, a couple of
month of hard working and less spending could solve the issue. There
are several highly required jobs where you can earn a nice sum in a
short period. Among them: Working on fishing ships in Alaska; working
in tourist resorts (where you'd be paid, but could eat and sleep at
the resort); Snow shoveling; escorting and caring for old or sick
people. Christmas is also around the corner, and many shops require
extra help. Carpe Diem (sieze the day) and go for it. Most of these
jobs would also teach you a bit about yourself, and what you want.

Now, for your second question, regarding jobs. You have several
expectations from a job:
(1) It should be high-paid, at least relatively to the market in
general.
(2) You prefer to have contact with people and to help them. 
(3) You prefer to think, not only to do something like a robot. 
(4) You find "action" jobs, such as working for police, FBI, CIA,
interesting.
(5) You don't want to start at ground level position. 

Some of these expectation, I hope you won't mind me saying, are a bit
unrealistic, and seemed like you might have watched a bit too much
television. I have worked for a certain organisation, similar to those
mentioned before. Most people there work very hard, spend long hours
in office, and although they do a very interesting and exciting job
(and they help people), they are not the Jodi Fosters and Alac Baldwin
you see on the movies. One of my best friends works for the police. He
solves crimes. However, he also works long hours, not paid enough for
these hours (although, of course, the salary in both cases is not
bad), and he has to deal with all kind of dirty, petty, criminals. Not
every criminal is Hannibal the Cannibal - most of them are homeless
alcoholises who robbed and murdered an old woman for the next drink.

So, if you go for this kind of jobs, you have to prepare yourself for
a very challenging and interesting work, but also very tough one, and
maybe also underpaid if you compare it to the long hours. You should
also bear in mind that most "high paying" jobs require higher
education - that means, graduate school, law school, etc.

In the "action" sector, you might want to consider gong stright to
officers' course, where it is possible. For example, in the military
you could become an officer, making better salary, helping people and
having "action". In the FBI and CIA it is also possible to begin as
the equivalent of an officer, although it has less meaning. It should
be mentioned that all these jobs require education, physical fitness,
and other terms.

"Police and sheriff's patrol officers had median annual earnings of
$39,790 in 2000. The middle 50 percent earned between $30,460 and
$50,230. The lowest 10 percent earned less than $23,790, and the
highest 10 percent earned more than $58,900. Median annual earnings
were $44,400 in State government, $39,710 in local government, and
$37,760 in Federal Government.
In 2000, median annual earnings of police and detective supervisors
were $57,210. The middle 50 percent earned between $43,630 and
$70,680. The lowest 10 percent earned less than $34,660, and the
highest 10 percent earned more than $86,060. Median annual earnings
were $74,070 in Federal Government, $57,030 in local government, and
$53,960 in State government.

In 2000, median annual earnings of detectives and criminal
investigators were $48,870. The middle 50 percent earned between
$37,240 and $61,750. The lowest 10 percent earned less than $29,600,
and the highest 10 percent earned more than $72,160. Median annual
earnings were $61,180 in Federal Government, $46,340 in local
government, and $43,050 in State government.

Federal law provides special salary rates to Federal employees who
serve in law enforcement. Additionally, Federal special agents and
inspectors receive law enforcement availability pay (LEAP)-equal to 25
percent of the agent's grade and step-awarded because of the large
amount of overtime that these agents are expected to work. For
example, in 2001 FBI agents enter Federal service as GS-10 employees
on the pay scale at a base salary of $36,621, yet earned about $45,776
a year with availability pay. They can advance to the GS-13 grade
level in field nonsupervisory assignments at a base salary of $57,345
which is worth almost $71,681 with availability pay. FBI supervisory,
management, and executive positions in grades GS-14 and GS-15 pay a
base salary of about $67,765 or $79,710 a year, respectively, and
equaled $84,706 or $99,637 per year including availability pay.
Salaries were slightly higher in selected areas where the prevailing
local pay level was higher. Because Federal agents may be eligible for
a special law enforcement benefits package, applicants should ask
their recruiter for more information.

The International City-County Management Association's annual Police
and Fire Personnel, Salaries, and Expenditures Survey revealed that 84
percent of the municipalities surveyed provided police services in
2000. The following pertains to sworn full-time positions in 2000.


Minimum annual base salary Maximum annual base salary 
Police chief $62,640 $78,580 
Deputy chief 53,740 67,370 
Police captain 51,680 64,230 
Police lieutenant 47,750 57,740 
Police sergeant 42,570 50,670 
Police corporal 35,370 43,830 
Police officer 31,410 43,450 


Total earnings for local, State, and special police and detectives
frequently exceed the stated salary because of payments for overtime,
which can be significant. In addition to the common benefits-paid
vacation, sick leave, and medical and life insurance-most police and
sheriffs' departments provide officers with special allowances for
uniforms. Because police officers usually are covered by liberal
pension plans, many retire at half-pay after 20 or 25 years of
service."

(Source: US Government, Police and Detectives
<http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos160.htm>).

As for working in the CIA, you can contact them at
http://www.cia.gov/cia/employment/ciaeindex.htm, their job range
includes the Clandestine Service; Scientists, Engineers and
Technologists; Analytical Positions and Professional Positions, as
well as language positions. Most analytical jobs require a graduate
degree (as most high paying jobs in general).

The FBI also have a vacancy page, where you could see your
possibilities: http://www.fbijobs.com/

In the armed forces, jobs could include civic professions such as the
care professions (social worker, psychologist, teacher, correctional
officer), but also other professions that might be fascinating and
full of "action" (Combat speciality occupations). You could read about
these jobs and the average salary here:
http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos249.htm

The best paying entry level jobs are probably in the information
technology (IT) field, and in life sciences (doctors of biology,
chemistry, etc.). These jobs were not mentioned by you, but you should
consider them. You mentioned that "being doctor is out". I don't know
if it is because you scored a low MCAT ,that you don't want to go
through the hassle and hard work of being a doctor, or if you feel
that "you don't have the head for sciences". If the last is not true,
and you have some touch in science and technology, you may want to
consider these posts - they are well paid, you deal with interesting
stuff, and you have the chance to vary yourself, in the private sector
(where you develop new medications, or new technologies to help
people),or in the public service (labs, research for the government
and the military). There are also many grants in these fields, for
those who want to seek a graduate career. In Utah, for example, "The
typical average salary of a high-tech position
in Utah is $48,000. Overall salaries average only $27,400"
(http://www.utah.gov/governor/newsrels/2000/newsrel_091100.html), see
also http://www.bchs.uh.edu/Bioscope/BioscopeFeb00.pdf "What job can I
get with a Biology or Biochemistry degree?" - "Lab director typically
requires a Ph.D.: Starting salary is $55,000. Average salary for
senior lab heads - $150,000". You have mentioned your interest in
astronomy, and this could mean that some education in that field:
aeronautics, space engineering, astro-physics - could help you get a
great career. However, that could be great only if you are capable of
studying these scientific issues. See also NasaJobs
http://www.nasajobs.nasa.gov/

If you are more interested in being "people centred" and having
contact with people, you should consider social work, teaching,
psychology or law. The last two might also insure high paying
positions in the future, but are usually more tense. All of those jobs
require specialised education.
Read here about a career as a lawyer: "According the United States
Department of Labour, the average salary of a lawyer six months after
graduating law school is $51,500"
http://www.du.edu/~tcurran/cpaper.doc ;
http://www.du.edu/~tcurran/cpaper.doc
Psychologist: http://www.teenadvice.org/articles/psychologist.html 


Other possibility, not mentioned: 

U.S. Peace Corps
================
"This is possibly the best (and best-paying) entry-level job...

Eligibility: U.S. citizens only; generally for those with at least a
bachelor's degree; two-year commitment. Peace Corps pays all expenses
plus over $6,000 ("resettlement allowance") at the end of service.
Full training and support is provided. Educational loans can be
deferred and some partially cancelled. Some tuition support is
available for later graduate study.

Contact the headquarters at: Peace Corps, P.O. Box 948, Washington DC
20526, (800) 424-8580, www.peacecorps.gov "

Other sources
-------------
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/business/slf-2002hotjobs.story - hot jobs
of 2001
http://www.fathom.com/feature/122177 - choosing the right career. 
http://www.educationmatters.ie/careers/car110101.htm How to choose the
right career for you by Gerry Berry
http://www.students.gov/ - with advices on career development
http://www.doi.gov/octc/ - Career Manager 

Books: 
=====
100 Best Careers for the 21st Century, by Shelly Field

America’s Top Jobs for People without a Four-Year Degree, by J.
Michael Farr,

Career Information Center

Careers and Occupations, Looking to the Future

Do What You Are: Discover the Perfect Career for You through the
Secrets of Personality Type, by Paul D. Tieger

Finding the Hat That Fits: How to Turn Your Heart’s Desire into Your
Life’s Work, by John Caple

Helping Your Child Choose a Career, by Luther B. Otto

How to Choose the Right Career, by Louise Welsh Schrank

Job Strategies for People with Disabilities, by Melanie Astaire Witt

Joyce Lain Kennedy’s Career Book, by Joyce Lain Kennedy

Love Your Work and Success Will Follow, by Arlene S. Hirsch

Street-Smart Career Guide: a Step-by-Step Program for Your Career
Development, by Laura Pedersen

Careers for Legal Eagles & Other Law-And-Order Types, by Blythe
Camenson

But What if I Don’t Want to Go to College?: A Guide to Success through
Alternative Education, by Harlow G. Unger

The Off-The-Beaten Path Job Book: You Can Make a Living and Have a
Life!, by Sandra Gurvis

My search strategy was to look for each career path, and its average
salary, description, etc.

I hope that helps. You have plenty of opportunities. You have to
decide what is the most attractive to you - also time wise and money
wise, and how much you are willing to dedicate to the further
education required. Please contact me if you need any clarifications.

Request for Answer Clarification by stressedman-ga on 08 Nov 2002 18:21 PST
The information on the officer aspect of the question is superb and
will help me a great deal in my search. You mentioned other fields in
the sciences. Yes I'm well up to the challenge to bio sciences and
that sort. Thanks for the extra information there. A doctor - That's
out for the moment because of the hassle :) However. Clarification.
The psychology and counseling part. My last major in college was
Counseling/Speech a double major. That interests me just as much as
the officer part. I was hoping for a bit further information in those
specific areas. Such that I would counsel individuals in metal issues,
life problems etc. You mentioned that it seems I may have watched to
much TV. True. My mind works with a fantasy aspect but I'm well
grounded in the real world of things as well. I like to over
exaggerate. Which brings me to the point that I've seen counselors on
TV who work in hospitals counseling patients. That seems very
interesting to me. As far as my goal in salary. 50 to 60k in the long
run of thing would be sufficient. I currently make 20, 25k without an
education. summarizing. I'm looking for a little more detail in the
psychology and counseling area. And one last thing - As far as being a
Federal Agent. What sort of a degree would that require? I really do
appreciate your help in this. I'm finally getting good information.
Thanks!

Clarification of Answer by politicalguru-ga on 09 Nov 2002 07:55 PST
Dear Stressedman, 

Thanks for your clarification, it sure makes things even clearer. 

There are several very interesting jobs that could be related to your
interest in counselling and in the field of communication/speech.

First and foremost, you may want to consider being an audiologist or a
speech therapist of some kind. There are many different and
challenging jobs in that realm, and according to the US Dept. of
Labour, "Employment of speech-language pathologists and audiologists
is expected to grow much faster than the average for all occupations
through the year 2010." It also fits your profile of salary. Speech
therapists work in various settings - from private (they have their
own clinic) to organisations such as hospitals and schools. Speaking
of TV, you may remember that Marlee Matlin played some kind of sign
language instructor.
Read more about this job here http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos085.htm 

There are also many psychologists and other therapists (not all of
them actually psychologists, some are social workers, for example),
who work in hospitals:
- counselling those who have a sick or dying family member, how to
deal with it.
- counselling those who are sick themselves with the same issues
- working with patients who have mental problems. 
Psychologists usually have PhD, but not all therapeutic professions do
- rehabilitation counselors have masters (or lower) degree.
You can read about psychologists here
http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos056.htm
And about rehab counselling here http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos067.htm 
Please ask me if you need more info on these occupations. 

Regarding that second question: FBI Agent (or "special agent") is a
cover name for many different professions (law, accounting, languages,
technics). In all of them you must be physically fit and have a BA (or
BSc) degree. Later, you must pass the Academy training (just like Jodi
Foster ;-)

Special Agent job description:
https://www.fbijobs.com/jobdesc.asp?requisitionid=368

You can also go to their Job Fair, if you happen to be next week in
the DC area:
"The FBI announced today that an FBI Employment Job Fair will be held
Saturday, November 16th from 10:00 a.m. to 4:00 p.m. at its FBI
Headquarters located in Washington D.C. The FBI has a critical need to
hire specialised Professional Support Employees to help the agency
continue meeting the challenge of global terrorism and homeland
security. The FBI is seeking highly competitive candidates to fill the
following critical positions:

INTELLIGENCE OPERATIONS SPECIALISTS GS 7-13: 

Must possess a bachelor's degree in any discipline. Specialized
experience in the collection, analysis, program management, and
dissemination of information and trends pertaining to foreign and
domestic areas which directly or indirectly affect the national
security. Salary ranges from $31,397 - 86,095.

INTELLIGENCE RESEARCH SPECIALISTS GS 7-13: 

Must possess a bachelor's degree in any discipline. Specialized
experience in the collection, analysis, program management, and
dissemination of information and trends pertaining to foreign and
domestic areas which directly or indirectly affect the national
security. Salary ranges from $31,397 - 86,095.

INTELLIGENCE ASSISTANTS GS 7/8: 

Experience in administrative or clerical procedures and operations
peculiar to the collection, production or dissemination of
intelligence information. Salary ranges from $31,397 - $45,206.

TECHNICAL INFORMATION SPECIALISTS GS 11/12: 

Experience that demonstrates direction, administration, development,
coordination, or performance of work involved in processing and
transmitting scientific, technological, or other specialized
information. Salary ranges from $46,469 - $72,400.

MANAGEMENT & PROGRAM ANALYSTS GS 12/13: 

Experience in the substantive nature of agency programs and
activities; agency missions, policies, and objectives, management
principles and processes; and analytical and evaluative methods and
techniques for assessing program development or execution and
improving organizational effectiveness and efficiency. Salary ranges
from $55,694 - $86,095.

MANAGEMENT ASSISTANTS 5/6/7: 

Experience in clerical, administrative and technical work in support
of management. Salary ranges from $25,347 - $40,818.

VISUAL INFORMATION SPECIALISTS GS 11: 

Experience which includes planning the preparation and use of
photographs, illustrations, drawings, and other art work, charts,
diagrams, dioramas, maps, slides, overlays and other kinds of visual
material for use in communicating information through visual means.
Salary ranges from $46,469 - $60,405.

FINANCIAL ANALYSTS GS 11/12/13: 

Experience performing financial analysis and evaluation work requiring
a comprehensive knowledge of corporate finance and any specialized
fields of finance such as public finance, securities, international
finance, money and securities markets, investments, and banking.
Salary ranges from $46,469 - 86,095. "
(https://www.fbijobs.com/JobFair.asp). 

Good Luck!

Request for Answer Clarification by stressedman-ga on 09 Nov 2002 09:02 PST
Okay. With the references listed this has come to be superb
information. I had one very last question. No great detail needed. But
seeing I priced this at 100.00 I was hoping you wouldn't mind. Quantum
Physics (A Hobby of mine), Could you list a few links to jobs related
to this area? From what I understand most careers in Quantum Physics
are in being a college professors and their funded research or private
research. I was just hoping for something to clarify my understanding.
Thanks. I hope this isn't too much I know it isn't in my original
question but it's still a career related option that I forgot to add
in there. I don't think I have any more hidden questions. I do
appreciate your detailed help and accurate information. As far as my
nick name. Hehe. I tend to always overly stress some. However it's
motivation for me to excersize. My stress releife. But with
information like this I can start acting on my desire for higher
education and a better life.

Request for Answer Clarification by stressedman-ga on 09 Nov 2002 09:25 PST
I'm so sorry I forgot one thing. This is important to me more than the
physics. Public speaking was the speech part of my college education.
I was a Youth director for a church in my area where I fell in love
with it. I'm not asking for a great deal of in depth information but
maybe some links to good information. I'm aware of church related
speaking opportunities just seeking to find what else would be
available. This is way more important to me than my physics question
if I'm hitting my limit on responses. But I do love to speak as you
probably can tell lol. Thanks! This would be greatly appreciated.

Clarification of Answer by politicalguru-ga on 11 Nov 2002 08:02 PST
First of all, no - I wouldn't mind at all, and you can keep asking
until you feel "satisfied".

Regarding Quantum Physics careers: 
According to the University of Manchester Institute of Science and
Technology website, "High demand from high technology industries,
together with careers in other areas requiring a high degree of
mathematical skill and logical insight" and Academic research are the
top vocations for someone who had studied quantom physics in the
graduate level (see: UMIST - University of Manchester Institute of
Science and Technology, "Physics with Theoretical Physics Full Time
MPhys (Hons) (4 Year) 2003"
<http://www.umist.ac.uk/prospectivestudents/undergraduate/courseinfo/fulldetails/00000101.htm>).

In other words, yes - most jobs are in the academia and many others
require an advanced degree, but there are jobs out there also for
those who don't have an advanced degree. Also see the following:
Careers using Physics - http://www.spsnational.org/cup/home.html 
Current vacancies in Physics - http://physicsweb.org/jobs/ 

As for your other comment - a rhetorical ability is something great,
whatever career you choose. In soem careers it's a must - a teacher,
an advertiser, a speechwriter (see:
http://www.jobprofiles.org/govfspeechwriter.htm Speechwriter job
profile; Making it count -
http://www.makingitcount.com/jobscareers/careers/cc_mims.asp), a
lobbyist (see http://www.alldc.org/career.htm "Lobbying as a Career"),
a fundraiser http://cdc.richmond.edu/multimedia/careerminute/developmentfund.html
and many other jobs. In other fields, such as the therapeutic field or
in police and related agencies, this is a sometimes essential and
always helping skill. In other words - this is very good in most
career choices, but in some careers it a must.

Request for Answer Clarification by stressedman-ga on 11 Nov 2002 12:56 PST
By any chance, would you know how I could contact a psychologist who
would speak with me career wise? and or a counselor? Maybe even a
federal agent? This has really helped me narrow my decision making. I
just want to speak to someone directly now in those fields.. I guess I
could use a phone book :) PS What do you do? Just out of curiosity..

Clarification of Answer by politicalguru-ga on 12 Nov 2002 03:30 PST
Thank you for your kind words and rating. 

Meeting people who deal with most professions in pretty easy. For
example, if you contact a clinical psychologist, they'll be more than
happy to share information with you, and excited that someone is
interested in the field (usually, because you always have the people
who think they are "too busy" to talk with someone). With FBI agents,
the best thing to do is to go to the job fair the FBI holds, since it
is unlikely that you'll just "meet" a special agent. However, this
interview in the Princeton Review sheds some light: 
http://www.princetonreview.com/cte/articles/cresearch/profileFBI.asp

Request for Answer Clarification by stressedman-ga on 13 Nov 2002 11:16 PST
On psychology. Could you post a link to what it takes to obtain a PHD?
I've looked on the net searches and I keep getting colleges and
schools but nohting showing the requirements of botaining a PHD..

Request for Answer Clarification by stressedman-ga on 13 Nov 2002 11:21 PST
Never mind, found what i was looking for at Arizona University..

http://seamonkey.ed.asu.edu/~gail/programs/spychk.htm

Clarification of Answer by politicalguru-ga on 14 Nov 2002 03:43 PST
Okay, 
Good luck :-)
stressedman-ga rated this answer:5 out of 5 stars
I have to rate this a five stars. The information given to me has been
exceptionally superb. My main interests were pay and service to
others. He pointed out those aspects in each answer very clearly.  As
well as he did a fantastic  job of intuitively figuring out my
personality and designed answers to fit me personally. He also gave
clarifications on questions I asked that were not specifically in my
first question and has done an awesome job on providing sources for
further reading and understanding. Also was willing to answer all
questions until I had a satisfactory understanding and direction. The
only thing that wasn't offered was the money to attend college lol.. I
guess some things you have to do on your own.. Excellent answers!

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