I'm looking for a comprehensive list of companies that provide
software development outsourcing offshore.  The companies should be in
South America, Latin America, Mexico, or Canada.  No other global
regions please.  Please give company names, URLs, more info email
addresses, country, city.

The ideal companies are ones that you partner with from your U.S.
company.  They become your 'offshore development team'.  Typical
'consulting' companies are not ideal, as they are for short term, high
cost projects.  I'm looking for long term, low cost, development.

As an example of an ideal company that fits this description, see:
http://www.impetus.com/  This company is exactly what I'm looking for,
except they are in India.  (Nothing against India, it's just that I
want to have the time zone similar to where I am now.)

$20 is the base price.  I will add a 'tip' for the completeness of the
research.

(Please remember, some countries have alternate spellings (Brazil,
Brasil), making it harder to find the companies).

Hi Eric,

Good day and thanks for your question. I have done a thorough research
on the internet and have derived the following list. I have come
across hundreds of outsourcing companies but I have shortlisted the
very best for you, since you are looking for long-term projects.

Brazil
------
Brazil has good infrastructure and communications. The average IT
programmer salary in Brazil is higher only than that of India and
Russia, thus making it the 'cheapest' country in your region. However,
language is a major barrier, and English proficiency on the whole is
poor. Major companies including GE, Goodyear and Xerox have partnered
with Brazilian outsourcing companies. Government laws are fair, and
the total workforce is estimated to be around 80 million. Application
development and maintainance is the speciality of Brazilian IT
programmers. The main cities/centers of outsourcing are Rio de Janeiro
& Sao Paulo. The National IT organization is the Sociedade de Usuários
de Informática e Telecomunicações
[ www.sucesusp.org.br ]

The major providers in Brazil are


CPM Systemas
http://www.cpm.com.br (English Version - http://www.cpmusa.net/)
This company hasn't given their address, but has given an e-mail form
at http://www.cpm.com.br/includes/home.php?destino=enviar_amigo&secao=
Partners include Microsoft, IBM, Oracle


G&P Projectos e Systemas
http://www.gpnet.com.br
Partners include GE and Xerox
R. Dr. Cesário Mota Jr., 614
Vila Buarque - CEP: 01.221-020
São Paulo - SP
Telefone : (11) 3218-4700
Marketing Dept E-mail: mkt@gpnet.com.br
Full contact information at
http://www.gpnet.com.br/faleconosco/faleconosco.shtml


Proceda
http://www.proceda.com.br
São Paulo
Av. Maria Coelho Aguiar, 215 - Bl. E - 7° andar
Centro Empresarial - São Paulo
05804-900 - São Paulo/S.P
Tel.: (11) 3741-7775
Fax.: (11) 3741-6611
proceda@proceda.com.br

Rio de Janeiro
Av. Rio Branco, 1 - sala 1809 - Centro
20090-003 - Rio de Janeiro/R.J
Tel.: (21) 2550-8653
Fax: (21) 2550-8651
filial_rio@proceda.com.br



Vetta Technologies
http://www.vettatech.com
Clients inclde Webmind, Inc, Proteometrics & Exxceed
E-mail: info@vettatech.com
Phone/Fax: +55 (31) 3293-6516
Vetta Technologies Ltda.
Av. Raja Gabaglia 4453, sala 1
Belo Horizonte, MG - Brazil - CEP 30360-670



Canada
------
Canada is a world leader in IT outsourcing. Infrastructure &
Communications are good. The major plus point is the goodEnglish
proficiency. Labor costs work out to be quite high - $28,174/year;
$22-$37/hour. But its still cheaper than the US. The Pros are low
risk, high quality, similar time zones, and compatible cultures. You
won't save a lot of money, but you will reduce the number of potential
headaches. The laws work in your favor. Nafta provides for free trade
market in IT services, and the government grants favorable tax
treatment for software development and maintenance companies.
The Cities/Centers of outsourcing are Halifax, Montreal and Toronto.
The National IT organization: Information Technology Association of
Canada (www.itac.ca). Total labor force is about 16 million. Areas of
expertise include application development, application maintenance,
e-business, call centers.

Major providers (could not get addresses from most of their websites)
:

CGI Group
http://www.cgi.ca
Contact page at http://www.cgi.com/cgi/web/jsp/MainPage.jsp?Params=N.US.92001.0

Fujitsu Consulting
http://ca.consulting.fujitsu.com
Contact Form at http://ca.consulting.fujitsu.com/en/contact/


Keane Canada
http://www.keane.com
Clients include Toyota, British Airways, 3M
Cogswell Tower, 2000 Barrington Street
Suite 300
Halifax, NS B3J 3K1
Phone: (902) 422-6036
Fax:      (902) 422-6059
Email:   info.hal@keane.com



March Networks
http://www.marchnetworks.com
Corporate Headquarters :
March Networks Corporation
Tower B, 555 Legget Drive
Ottawa, Ontario
Canada
K2K 2X3
Toll Free: 1-800-563-5564
Local: 613-591-8181
Fax: 613-591-7337
info@marchnetworks.com


Unisys Canada
http://www.unisys.ca
Contact page : http://www.app1.unisys.com/ContactUs/ContactUS.asp



Mexico
------
Infrastructure/Communications are good, they are the strongest in the
country's three technology parks. English proficiency is poor.
Aaverage IT programmer salary : $1,400/year. Costs are typically 25
percent to 45 percent less than in the U.S., and distance isn't an
issue. Mexican programmers are not exactly members of the intellectual
elite when it comes to engineering skills. The language barrier can
also be a problem (though some companies send their programmers to
English boot camps). Right now, Mexico may be suitable for low-level,
high-volume projects. Make sure you evaluate language skills at your
vendor. President Vicente Fox is leading a software development
initiative to strengthen capabilities and promote them abroad so the
laws are good. Cities/Centers of outsourcing are Guadelajara, Mexico
City & Monterrey. The National IT organization - Asociación Mexicana
de la Industria de Tecnologías de Información (AMITI;
www.amiti.mx.org). Total labor force is an expected 41.9 million.
Areas of expertise include application development, application
maintenance, data center outsourcing. Major customers are Coca-Cola,
GE, P&G

Major providers:

Expert Sistemas Computacionales
http://www.expert.com.mx
Contact Page (Mexican) : http://www.expert.com.mx/cont.htm
You can get an approximate translation of the page at
http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=es&u=http://www.expert.com.mx/cont.htm&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dhttp://www.expert.com.mx/cont.htm%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26oe%3DUTF-8


Grupo Qualita
http://www.gqualita.com.mx
E-Mail : mzinser@gqualita.com.mx


Hildebrando
http://www.hildebrando.com.mx
México
  5242-0300 Ext. 3300
  silveral@hildebrando.com.mx
Guadalajara
  (013) 630 3133
  javierh@hildebrando.com.mx
Monterrey
  (018) 3473303
  avilaj@hildebrando.com.mx



Softtek
http://www.softtek.com.mx
Blvd Diaz Ordaz Km. 333
Plaza Leona, CP 66210
Garza Garcia, Nuevo Leon
Ph (52 81) 81-53-2000
E-Mail : mercadotecnia@softtek.com
Clients include Microsoft, Intel




Argentina
---------
Geopolitical risk is high. Infrastructure/Communications is Fair. But
telephone system frequently grounds out during storms, even in Buenos
Aires. English proficiency is Fair. Argentina has one of the most
educated populations in South America, and the devalued peso makes
Argentineans very affordable employees. However, they have minimal
exposure to the U.S. market, highest salaries in South America,
limited access to growth capital, lack of intellectual property
protection and political instability. Argentina has had plenty to cry
about-from political corruption to economic collapse. But there is
still outsourcing potential here. Major customers include BankOne,
Citibank, Principal Financial Group. The national IT organization :
Cámara de Empresas de Software y Servicios Informáticos
(http://www.cessi.org.ar). Areas of expertise are application
development, application maintenance, call center.

Major providers:
(Note: None of the sites worked. However, they are listed in Google)

BitX
http://www.bitx.com.ar

Buenos Aires Software
http://www.bsa.com.ar

Technisys
http://www.technisys.net



Venezuela
---------
Venezuela isn't recommended.....

Geopolitical risk is High. Infrastructure/Communications are Fair.
Modern and expanding telecom and IT infrastructure. English
proficiency is very poor. The government says it wants to get involved
in a different kind of offshore development-supporting growth in the
IT sector in order to reduce the country's dependence on the oil
industry...but hasn't done much yet. The government is in a state of
flux. The term "offshore" here still conjures up images of oil rigs
and black gold.
Insider tip: Check back in a few years to see if any progress has been
made. Cultural compatibility is Poor. Government support/laws is Poor.
National IT organization is the Venezuelan Chamber of IT Companies
(http://www.cavedatos.org.ve)


Chile
-----
Chile isn't recommended either

The geopolitical risk is moderate. Infrastructure/Communications are
Good. State-of-the-art infrastructure, including network
digitalization, fiber optics and satellite equipment. English
proficiency, however, is poor. The pros are the high level of
education, low costs, high-tech infrastructure. Chile is the most
European community in South America.Cons : Chile may lack the
entrepreneurial zeal it needs to become a real offshore player. Chile
is a little more expensive than Brazil but relatively competitive in
other ways. The National IT organization is the Information Technology
Association of Chile (http://www.acti.cl)



I hope this answers your question. If you have any clarifications at
all, please don't hesitate to ask

Thank you for using this service and have a nice day.

Warm regards,
aditya2k

Search Strategy :
IT outsourcing south america
it outsourcing "brazil OR brasil"
it outsouring canada
it outsourcing mexico

---

Request for Answer Clarification by eric123-ga on 24 Nov 2002 19:11 PST

Hello,

Thank you for the excellent research.

I am slowly and methodically going through the sites you have
provided.  I am wondering if I could clarify a few things and get your
thoughts or expansion on the answer.

Many of the sites you have listed provide "IT outsourcing" which may
or may not include "software development" and/or "programming".  I am
only interested in those that do.  IT infrastructure, hosting,
internet connectivity, eCommerce store setup, management of
mainframes, and most other IT services are not interesting to me.  I
will be providing the majority of design and architectural work
through our U.S. software architects, who will feed designs and
provide technical leadership to the offshore development team we are
partnered with.

Could you help me narrow down the list to just those that provide
software development and programming?

I also very much appreciate your thoughts about which countries I
should focus on.  Based upon this, I would like to focus on Brazil,
Mexico, and Canada.  Please feel free to disregard other countries
from further research.

If you could re-review the original list of companies you found and
select some more companies in these countries that focus on software
development and programming, this would be great.

Thanks again. The depth of your response is definitely going to earn
you a big tip!

Also, could you clarify the cost a bit?  For instance, you wrote that
Canada was $28,174/year; $22-$37/hour.  However, $22-37/hour would
turn out to be $44,000 - $74,000/year (appoximating, using 2000 hours
in a year... there are actually 2080).  For Mexico, you wrote
"$1,400/year", but I think you might have meant per month, which
equals $16,800/year.

One last question... I am having some trouble with translation on some
sites to English.  Are you reading the sites in Portuguese or Spanish?
 Or are you translating using an online service?  What service?  I'm
trying babelfish.altavista.com.

---

Clarification of Answer by aditya2k-ga on 25 Nov 2002 05:28 PST

Hi again Eric,

Let me systematically answer your clarifications

Hello,

Thank you for the excellent research.

>>>>>>>>>> Many of the sites you have listed provide "IT outsourcing"
which may
or may not include "software development" and/or "programming".  I am
only interested in those that do.

Re: The companies I have listed deal in all sorts of outsourcing and
they are the leading companies in their regions. I have gone through
their websites and they do provide software development. I may have
missed something if otherwise.


>>>>> Could you help me narrow down the list to just those that
provide software development and programming?

Re: Sure....its at the end of the clarifiation

>>>>>> Also, could you clarify the cost a bit?  For instance, you
wrote that Canada was $28,174/year; $22-$37/hour.  However,
$22-37/hour would turn out to be $44,000 - $74,000/year (appoximating,
using 2000 hours in a year... there are actually 2080).  For Mexico,
you wrote "$1,400/year", but I think you might have meant per month,
which equals $16,800/year.

Re: I have sourced this information from the November 15, 2002 issue
of the CIO magazine. They have even mentioned that the minimum salary
for a Brazilian programmer was is $1,308/year (which is more than
India and China). $1,400 for Mexico is possibly the minimum. As far as
Canada is concerned, they must have considered 1,000 hours instead

>>>>> Or are you translating using an online service?  What service? 
I'm trying babelfish.altavista.com.

Re: I used the google translate service
(http://translate.google.com/translate_t)


Coming to the list of some more companies for Software Development
outsourcing :

In Brazil,

* Cincom Systems Para Computadores Ltda
Av. Brig Faria Lima, 1739 - 7th floor
01451-001 Sao Paulo - SP- Brazil
Telefone: 55-11-3097-9555
Fax: 55-11-3097-8484
E-mail: cincombr@cincom.com




* Politec Ltda
(This company has a number of offices in Brazil)

Goiania - GO
Av. Republica do Libano, 838
Setor Aeroporto
CEP: 74075-020
Tel: (62) 212-3222
Fax: (62) 225-4139

Brasilia- DF
SEPN 513
Bloco "D" Ed. Imperador
2 andar
CEP: 70760-545
Tel: (61) 348-6800
Fax: (61) 272-2505

Recife - PE
Av. Abdias de Carvalho
1.111 conj. 206
Pado
CEP: 50830-000
Tel: (81) 227-5591
Fax: (81) 227-5644

Sao Paulo - SP
Av. Queiroz Filho, 527
Bairro da Lapa
CEP: 05319-000
Tel/Fax: (11) 3021-4003

Salvador - BA
Avenida Tancredo
Neves 3343
Sala 1307
Bairro Pituba
CEP: 41820-021
Tel: (71) 340-6920
Fax: (71) 341-6118

Rio de Janeiro RJ
Avenida Rio Branco 123
Sala 2106 - Centro
CEP: 20040-005
Tel: (21) 221-0850
Tel: (21) 221-0809
Fax: (21) 221-0670



* Apyon Technology
Apyon Technology has an innovative framework for custom application
software development (Apyon Studio) and related life cycle services
that speeds the process at least 30% and reduces the total costs more
than 40%.
Number of employees: 30
Contact Info: João Luis Cumerlato - CEO
joao.cumerlato@apyon.com
Av. Maria Coelho Aguiar, 215 – Bloco G – Piso Jardim
São Paulo – SP
Zip Code: 05805-000
Phone: 55 11 5853-2321
www.apyon.com


* Grupo TMS
www.grupotms.com.br
Phone: + 55 11 3188-4000
Rua Líbero Badaró, 377 – 25° andar
São Paulo – Brazil
01009-000


* CTIS
Brasília
SCN Qd 04 Sala 204 2º andar - Centro Empresarial Varig
Asa Norte - Brasília/DF
CEP: 70.714-900
Tel: (61) 328-7168
Fax: (61) 426-9138
E-mail: serviçosti_df@ctis.com.br

São Paulo
Rua Luigi Galvani, 146 - 6º andar
Brooklin Novo - São Paulo/SP
CEP: 04.575-020
Tel: (11) 3371-1400
Fax: (11) 3371-1419
E-mail: serviçosti_sp@ctis.com.br




Mexico
------
Amiti
Montecito # 38,
piso 21,
oficinas 1 y 2,
Colonia Nápoles.
Código Postal 03810,
México, D. F.
Tel : (52) 5488-3169 y 70.
Fax : (52) 5488-3171.
amiti@amiti.org.mx


Grupo Internacional de Tecnología
Vasconcelos 1507 Pte.
Despacho 204
San Pedro Garza García
Nuevo León
México
Teléfono: (8) 3 38 35 35
Fax: (8) 3 38 30 99
info-gint@gint.com.mx


It isn't very easy searching through Spanish pages. I searched for
"software development outsourcing" (in Spanish -  outsourcing del
desarrollo del software) among Mexican sites (.mx sites)


Canada
------
Luckily and thankfully, the Canadian websites are in English. Makes
life easier trying to navigate through these sites.

The companies :

*Think Tank Technologies Inc

Lower Mainland Office
Suite 235-2906 West Broadway
Vancouver, BC V6K 2G8
Tel: 604.742.0411
Fax: 604.742.0422
Toll Free: 1.888.828.1191

Interior Office
Box 427 Station Main
Kamloops, BC V2C 5L2
Tel: 250.554.1545
Fax: 250.554.8766
Toll Free: 1.888.828.1191

Email: info@ThinkTankTechnologies.ca



* Mindfirst Inc.
71 Garfield Avenue
Toronto, ON  M4T 1E8
CANADA
416-440-0448 Phone
416-440-0234 Fax
Henry Vehovec - henry@mindfirst.com


There are a number of companies listed at
http://www.scguild.com/cgi-bin/keyword.exe?cpy=on&keywords=_Canada&heading=Canada,
most of which would match your requirements



I hope this answers your clarification. If you have any further
clarifications, please feel free to ask.


Warm Regards,
aditya2k

Fantastic and thorough response!

Just a comment on Argentina:

Yesterday there was a major blackout through the country: 12 million
inhabitants had no electricity. Biggest in (Argentinian) history.
Hence the sites were not working ( among other -more important-
things).
Blackouts are not usual at all.

Telephone system was terrible, until 10 years ago. Now works very
well.

Highest salaries in South America ? Old news pal ! Since one year ago
foreign exchange rate more than tripled, and salaries kept the same,
so make your math again. As an example, minimum wage is roughly USD
100/per month. Not that us, independent software developers earn USD
100 per month, but it gives you an idea...

High quality software is being exported more and more each month for
the last year since the conditions changed encouraging this kind of
biz.

I'm a bit worried about the biased, outdated and erroneous reply from
aditya2k, which could make eric123-ga overlook a good and serious
opportunity.

Curepi

This question is old but I found it interesting.

I'm a Mexican programmer and NO ONE is going to work for US$1400 a
year that's a fact not a point of view! I earn like US$1000 per month
and I graduated one and half year ago. There is a minimum salary in
Mexico which approximates to US$1400 a year, but take my word, even
the worst programmer in my school won't take the minimum salary, after
all $1400 is just the cost of a good computer. I took the time to
answer because that salary is just... silly (and because I have no
much work right now:) ).

About English, uhmm, I don't know I have a lot of friends who speak
English, a limited English most of them but they can understand you, a
certain level of English is requiered to get your diploma in IT in
most Mexican universities (at least all that I know require it).

If you want translations from Spanish just ask! (or hire me but please
offer more than $1400 ;) )

eric, i'm not looking for the $ but the info on Canada is way off

If "The major plus point of Canada is the goodEnglish proficiency"
then I'm asusming aditya isn't from Canada. We have excellent English
proficiency in Canada... that IS what we speak here (except Quebec and
you won't find inexpensive resources there).

aditya's statement... "Labor costs work out to be quite high -
$28,174/year; $22-$37/hour."   I'm not sure where these came from but
there are very few places in Canada that pay that low. Victoria and
Kelowan are of the lowest in Canada and for good IT people you will be
looking at $30-50/hour for employees but if you are looking at
contract staff you are looking at $40-80 for good contractors.

"Nafta provides for free trade" this was aditya's best call, this
makes it much easier and cheaper to work with us. We work with a
Seattle company and it is much easier now than it has been in the
past.

"The Cities/Centers of outsourcing are Halifax, Montreal and Toronto."
I'm not sure where they came up with this information but that's way
off. Those may be some of the largest centres but they are also the
most pricey. I would suggest staying to the west if you want good
people at good prices. Toronto and Montreal are very over inflated and
very pricey, Victoria is probably the lowest priced major IT area in
Canada right now. People take far less money to live in Victoria
because it is also the nicest part of Canada year round.


on the list of Major providers, if you are looking for good people at
decent prices then I suggest that you avoid all of these as they are
all very very pricey, typically $100+/hour

CGI Group
Fujitsu Consulting
March Networks
Unisys Canada
IBM
Sierra Systems
Accenture

for some good information on the Victoria IT market check out http://www.viatec.ca