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Q: PDA Storage capacity ( Answered,   1 Comment )
Question  
Subject: PDA Storage capacity
Category: Computers > Wireless and Mobile
Asked by: nlewis8-ga
List Price: $4.50
Posted: 11 Dec 2002 12:48 PST
Expires: 10 Jan 2003 12:48 PST
Question ID: 123229
I've recently started looking for a PDA, and have a question.  Why is
it that PDAs don't use any kind of hard drive?  Look at the IPOD, for
example.  It's about the same size as a PDA, and it holds 20 gigs.  I
don't need 20 gigs, but I would like more than 128mb.
So my questions are:
What's holding PDA companies back from using the same type of compact
storage found in MP3 players,
Are there alternatives out there that I may not know about that
already have this, and
Would it be wise to get a cheap PDA (like the Palm Zire) and wait for
this kind of future functionality to emerge?

Thanks.
Answer  
Subject: Re: PDA Storage capacity
Answered By: supermacman-ga on 11 Dec 2002 14:02 PST
 
Hello nlewis,

PDA's do not use hard drives because the large storage capacity of a
hard drive is not needed. Most PDAs store contacts, addresses, a few
text files and at most a graphic. They do not need 5 GB of hard disk
space, and it would be a waste of money and space to include so much.

Hard disks also use a spinning platter. This creates noise and
increases the risk of breakdown as moving parts are involved. As well,
hard disks as small as those in the iPod are costly because 1) the
cost of packing so much storage into a small space is high; 2) the
cost of including an ATA controller for the input/output of data from
the hard disk is expensive. Finally, hard drives are physically large
and heavier, while Flash Memory chips (weighing two grams) are tiny.
This is why the iPod weights 6.5 oz, while Palm's Zire weighs just 3.8
oz. Consumers generally desire lighter PDAs - one of the reasons hard
drives are not used.

There is also less physical space in PDAs because they use a more
complicated operating system (capable of reading Word files,
PowerPoint files, displaying images, surfing the web) and because PDAs
have a large LCD display. All of these take room within the chassis of
the PDA, which gives less room for a hard drive. In comparison, the
iPod only includes a basic contacts manager, a small LCD and chips
capable of reading MP3s. These components take up less physical space,
which gives more room for a bulky hard drive. Also, the iPod is a
remarkable feat of engineering - which is why it's on the expensive
side compared to PDAs (the cheapest iPod, US$299, is more expensive
than the Zire, US$99).


To address your question about PDA storage:

Using Palm's top-of-the-line Tunsten T as an example, that PDA has a
SD/MultiMediaCard Expansion slot. This allows expansion of storage
capcity, as SD/MM cards can hold a lot of data. From CanadaComputers (
http://www.canadacomputers.com/memory.html ), a 64 MB SanDisk
MultiMedia card (MMC) costs only CAN$66 (approx US$43). Higher
capacity (but more expensive) Secure Digital (SD) cards are available
in sizes up to 256 MB. A 128 MB SD card costs CAN$92 (US$60) and a 256
MB SD card costs CAN$219 (US$142.4). As you can see, expansion options
do exist for PDAs.

I made a search of the Palm Knowledge Library ( http://kb.palm.com/ )
and there was no mention of compatibility problems with very large SD
cards. You can be assured that these high capacities will work with
the Palm you buy.

As the Tungsten T is a bit expensive (US$499), know that the Palm
i705, m515, m500, m130 and m125 all have SD/MMC expansion slots.
Expansion slots are also not limited to Palm's PDAs. Ccompetitor
Handspring also makes PDAs with SD slots, such as their Treo 90.

As I mentioned before, the difficulties of using a hard drive in a PDA
(weight, controller, moving parts, overkill capacity, cost) are why
manufacturers still use Flash memory and RAM, rather than using a hard
drive.

No other PDAs use a hard drive. A list of other PDAs you can peruse
may be found here:
http://computers.cnet.com/hardware/0-2645869-8-20542449-1.html?tag=st.cn.1.ld.2645869-8-20542449-1

Note that none of the PDAs use hard drives.

The only alternative to using Flash memory PDAs is purchasing an iPod
or other hard drive-based MP3 players. These devices offer only a
fraction of the functionality of a PDA - as an example, the iPod can
only play MP3s and store contacts. A list of good MP3 players (many
with hard drives) are reviewed here:
http://electronics.cnet.com/electronics/search/0,10126,0-6342420-1302-0,00.html

Finally, to address your last question: a cheap PDA (like the Zire)
provides many of the basic features of the latest and greatest PDAs at
a fraction of the cost. To compare, I will list some of the features
that the Tungsten T has that the Zire does not.

Tungsten: Wireless internet, Colour screen, SD slot, 14 MB more RAM,
backlighting
Source http://www.palm.com/products/family.epl

Despite the lack of these features the Zire can still do most of the
things that a PDA can be expected to do, such as keep track of
contacts and appointments. If that is all you need, then the Zire is
the way to go. Keep in mind that the Zire costs US$99 - 20% of the
cost of the Tungsten T. Purchase the Zire, and then wait two years and
you can probably buy a PDA with the functionality of the Tungsten at a
fraction the cost.

The Tungsten T has many nice features, like the ability to read Word,
Excel and PowerPoint files, a colour screen, and wireless internet.
Alas, it costs a lot more. If you need this type of functionality now,
then invest in the US$499 Tungsten T.

I hope this answers your question!


Additional links

Prices were obtained from The Apple Store ( http://store.apple.com/ )
and the Palm Store ( http://store.palm.com/ ).

Specs for the Tungsten T were obtained from:
http://www.palm.com/products/handhelds/tungsten-t/specs.html

Handspring
http://www.handspring.com/

Information about SD cards in general
http://www.sandisk.com/consumer/sd_card.asp


Search strategy

Mostly my brain and my bookmarks file  - I remember these sites.

Google search keywords:
Secure Digital cards

Request for Answer Clarification by nlewis8-ga on 12 Dec 2002 08:21 PST
Thanks for your very thorough response.  
One thing that I should have been more clear about, part of my
motivation in asking this question and waiting to purchase a PDA is
that I would like to have an all-in-one PDA/MP3 player.  Storage space
seems to be the only thing holding this back.  No one really wants to
carry an IPOD and a Palm.
Someone posted a comment with a link...check this out.  
http://www.storage.ibm.com/hdd/micro/overvw.htm
This microdrive sounds like a possible solution (although it's a
little expensive).  Do most PDAs have CF+ Type II slots?  Do most of
them have headphone jacks?
And does this idea of mine make sense to you?  Thanks again for the
great answer.

Clarification of Answer by supermacman-ga on 12 Dec 2002 13:33 PST
Hello,

Palm does not cell PDAs with CF slots. Palm's Tungsten T does have a
stereo headphone jack, which in conjunction with a large SD memory
card, can make the device a MP3 player. Only the Tungsten T has a
headphone jack - none of Palm's other PDAs have such an output.
However, no MP3 player exists for the Palm OS. Only when one is
released will the Tungsten T will be able to play MP3s. If you needed
to play MP3s on the Tungsten right now, third-party utilities are
available, such as Pocket Tunes:
http://www.pocket-tunes.com/

See the article about MP3s on the Tungsten here:
http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,3959,757796,00.asp


Another PDA operating system, Microsoft's PocketPC (
http://www.microsoft.com/mobile/pocketpc/default.asp ), offers the
built-in ability to play MP3 files. PocketPCs also offer features
similar to Palm's PDAs, such as a contacts manager, schedule, and the
ability to read Office documents. Many PocketPC compatible PDAs have
CF Type II slots.

IBM's Microdrive website has a list of PDAs (mostly PocketPCs) that
support the MicroDrive:
http://ssddom01.storage.ibm.com/hddt/situdtest.nsf/vwWebCHandheld?OpenView

Microsoft also has a list of PDAs that use the PocketPC operating
system. You can browse and choose the ones that have CF Type II
support:
http://www.microsoft.com/mobile/pocketpc/learnmore/hardware/americas.asp

Basically, your best bet if you wanted a PDA/MP3 player combination is
to buy a PocketPC with MicroDrive support so you could store many
MP3s. PocketPCs (such as Casio's Cassiopeia PocketPC E-200 or
Toshiba's PocketPC e740) also generally have headphone jacks. A
PocketPC would be the perfect device for you!

For more information on the E-200:
http://www.casio.com/e200

For more information on the e740:
http://www.toshiba.com/ , then hit Products & Services, then PDA's,
then Toshiba PocketPc e740 See All Models.

Do note that a PocketPC is expensive. The E-200 costs US$599 and a 1
GB MicroDrive costs US$268. The costs add up for the convenience of a
PDA+MP3 all-in-one.

To buy a Microdrive online:
http://www.d-store.com/d-store/microtech/ibm_micro_drives.htm

Hope this clarifies things! And yes, your idea makes sense with
PocketPCs (but not with Palm!)


Search terms

CF PDA
MP3 Palm
Comments  
Subject: Re: PDA Storage capacity
From: robertg-ga on 11 Dec 2002 14:17 PST
 
IBM sells a Compactflash microdrive (check Amazon) that can store up
to 1 gig.  If you wanted to watch movies on your Pocket PC
(http://www.productivepc.com/pocketpc/pocketpcmovies.shtml) , you
could store 3 or 4 on it!

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