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Q: Loss of body odor in middle aged guy ( Answered,   0 Comments )
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Subject: Loss of body odor in middle aged guy
Category: Miscellaneous
Asked by: bigvalleytim-ga
List Price: $40.00
Posted: 17 Dec 2002 07:11 PST
Expires: 16 Jan 2003 07:11 PST
Question ID: 125966
I'm 53, male. I exercise quite a lot, keep the calories down, have
excellent health habits. Nevertheless, I'm moderately fat (210 lbs,
5'7" -- I'm somewhat muscular, though) and I've had type 2 diabetes
for about six years. I maintain good blood sugar control with insulin.
(I could be on oral meds, but prefer insulin.)

For the past year or so, I haven't had any body odor. It probably
decreased gradually, but I don't know when the decrease began. I know
I had the usual male underarm odor from adolescence through early
middle age. Now, I have no underarm odor at all. I never use a
deodorant -- no need. When I go to the gym I might sweat a lot if I
work out hard, but my T-shirt doesn't smell bad the next day. I can
wear the same sweaty T-shirt to the gym for a week and it doesn't
smell bad.

Low testosterone seems like the obvious explanation. However, I'm
fairly muscular when I don't work out, and I get more muscular when I
do regular strength training. (Loss of muscle mass and inability to
regain it are probably the most common signs of low testosterone.) My
endocrinologist says I have low normal testosterone, but he says my LH
levels are normal, so my endocrine function is fine.

It could be autonomic neuropathy, but I doubt it. I seem to sweat
normally, and I have no other signs of autonomic neuropathy that I
know of.

I've checked the "andropause" sites but found no mention of this
phenomenon.

I wonder if loss of body odor in a male is a normal phenomenon of
aging. I wonder if it is a sign of low testosterone which my
endocrinologist should reconsider. I take several blood pressure
medicines -- this is usually necessary in type-2 diabetics. I wonder
if this is a side effect of some blood pressure medicines. I can't
find any confirmation of this theory.

I also take Neurontin, an anticonvulsant with various miscellaneous
psychiatric uses. I use it to sleep normally. Otherwise, I can't. A
psychiatrist prescribes it for me. We couldn't find any other answer
to my sleep disturbance.

I've done the obvious google searches but came up with nothing.

My question: Why would this be happening -- i.e., what would cause it?
Is it a normal age-related phenomenon in middle aged men?

Request for Question Clarification by kevinmd-ga on 17 Dec 2002 12:12 PST
Hello,
Thanks for asking this interesting question.  I am an internal
medicine physician and have some ideas.  What is likely happening is
not so much the decrease in body odor, but the decrease in sweating
that subsequently causes body odor (called anhidrosis).  I will be
happy to research the causes of decreased sweating for you if this is
acceptable.

Thanks,
Kevin, M.D.

Clarification of Question by bigvalleytim-ga on 17 Dec 2002 14:23 PST
Hi, Thanks for your concern. I don't have anhydrosis, or if I do, it's
only partial. If I spend 60 minutes on the elliptical trainer at the
gym, at a pulse rate of 125-130, I get increasingly sweaty after the
20-30 minute mark, and the gym is not warm. My shirt is pretty wet
when I leave. But the wet sweat doesn't seem to contain any of the
usual stuff that makes sweat smell bad. If I hang the shirt out to
air-dry... no bad smell the next day.

In any case, even if I had anyhdrosis, I think I'd have some degree of
underarm odor.

Actually, come to think of it, I have attended two or three daytime
meetings or office parties in crowded rooms in on warm summer
afternoons. I was embarrassed by how sweaty my face and neck got.
"Sweaty fat guy" and all that.

I know that anhydrosis is a common symptom of autonomic neuropathy. As
far as I can tell, I don't have that either.

I hope you'll continue to consider my question. Feel free to ask for
more clarification.


BVT

Request for Question Clarification by kevinmd-ga on 17 Dec 2002 15:22 PST
Hi BVT,
Thanks for your clarification.  I briefly looked at the following
websites:

http://www.health911.com/remedies/rem_bodyo.htm
and
http://health.discovery.com/diseasesandcond/encyclopedia/3190.html

Some specific causes of body odor is caused by bacteria, poor oxygen
metabolism, dietary imbalances (i.e. magnesium deficiency), and
constipation.

It would be logical to think that anything that reverses the above
causes (i.e. change in bacterial flora, changes in diet, improving
oxygen metabolism via exercise) would result in a decrease in body
odor.  Diabetes in particular is associated with gastric neuropathy
(leading to constipation and body odor), which would slowly reverse
with improved diabetes control.  Again, recent antibiotics would also
change the bacterial skin flora, affecting body odor.

As you have mentioned, the sweat glands are affected by the secretion
of sex hormones:

"Sweat glands under the arms and in the groin secrete a substance that
is the major non-food/drink related cause of body odor. This
substance, often secreted by a surge in sex hormones caused by tense
moments or emotional stress, is quickly attacked by bacteria, causing
odor."
http://www.health911.com/remedies/rem_bodyo.htm

Thus, low testosterone (male hypogonadism) can definitely play a role
in this.

Anyways, I will now open this question up to the other Researchers for
further research.  If you are interested, I will be happy to discuss
the issue of age-related decline of testosterone.

Thanks,
Kevin, M.D.
Google Answers Researcher
Answer  
Subject: Re: Loss of body odor in middle aged guy
Answered By: umiat-ga on 20 Dec 2002 11:06 PST
 
Hello, bigvalleytim-ga!

  I found your question so intriguing that I couldn’t help but search
for an answer. After all my research, I have come up with a different
perspective pertaining to a reason for your lack of body odor.

 Instead of wondering what may be wrong with your body because it has
no odor, have you stopped to consider what you are doing right?

 It seems that several conditions contribute to the general lack of
body odor. Good daily hygiene, increase in age, control of disease
symptoms and eating the right foods are all factors in keeping body
odor to a minimum.

 “Technically, sweat glands do not produce body odor. Both types of
glands produce sweat that is mainly water. The characteristic smell of
body odor does not occur until perspiration comes in contact with
bacteria present on the skin's surface.” UAB Health System at
http://www.health.uab.edu/show.asp?durki=8508

 Controlling the bacteria is the key to controlling odor. Somehow, you
have been successful in keeping the odor-causing bacteria to a
minimum.

 First, some background on the sweat glands and cause of body odor
(which you probably already know!)
*****************************************************
  “Body odor, with the exception of bad breath, originates from the
skin. The body produces two types of sweat from two types of sweat
glands (eccrine and apocrine). Most body odor is a result of bacteria
that thrive on secretions from the apocrine sweat glands. These
glands, located primarily under the arms and in the pubic area, begin
to function during puberty. They react to most anything -- heat,
stress, anger, nervousness, sexual excitement, fear, etc. When sweat
is excreted from these glands, skin bacteria begin to multiply as they
digest the sweat and the dead layer of skin. It is this decomposition
process that produces the odor.

  **”The best way to eliminate that is through good hygiene”.*** 

 “Other causes of body odor are the result of an overall unhealthy
body, including gastrointestinal problems. An aluminum-like odor to
the body can be caused by bacteria. Such skin infections as athlete's
foot are also responsible for body odor. Metabolic problems, as in the
case of eating too much protein or fat, contribute to body odor.
Eating whole foods, less protein and fat, and consuming friendly
bacteria will go a long way in remedying any unpleasant body odor.”
Read “Bacteria: Normal Body Flora.” Microorganisms at
http://www.innvista.com/micro/bacteria/normal.htm

 “The interplay of two different kinds of sweat glands and surface
bacteria are responsible for the production wetness and odor. Eccrine
sweat glands, located all over the body, produce a sweat that is
nearly 99 percent water in which a variety of inorganic salts are
dissolved. The production and evaporation of eccrine sweat is an
important part of the body's natural thermoregulatory system, i.e. the
system responsible for regulating body temperature. Less numerous, a
second type of sweat glands, known as apocrine glands, produce a
thick, cloudy sweat that, in addition to a high water content, is
composed of protein and carbohydrate waste materials. These glands are
typically located in the armpits, groin areas and around the nipples.
Although their precise function remains unknown, in evolutionary
terms, they are believed to play a role in sexual attraction.”
 “Both eccrine and apocrine sweat is odorless when produced. But what
happens next is critical. Surface bacteria, capable of breaking down
the organic materials in the apocrine sweat, give rise to the
by-products responsible for body odor. Although they cannot do this
with the largely watery eccrine secretion, eccrine sweat nevertheless
indirectly contributes to odor production by providing the necessary
moisture to support bacterial growth and proliferation and afterward
to wash the odor by-products over a larger surface area. In men,
armpit hair further contributes to the problem by acting as a pooling
site for apocrine sweat and a fertile breeding ground for bacteria.”
Read “It's Really No Sweat -- Controlling Wetness and Odor 
by Nelson Lee Novick, MD, FACP . New York County Medical Society
(8/13/2001) at http://www.nycms.org/article_view.php3?view=156&part=7

 You mention that you obviously secrete apocrine sweat, since you say
that your underarms get sweaty and your shirts are wet after exercise.
However, since apocrine sweat only smells when it comes in contact
with bacteria and produces by-products during breakdown, it is
possible that you are simply doing all the right things to prevent the
odor from forming in the first place!

Factors affecting the production of body odor and it’s elimination
*****************************************************
 “…how much you sweat and even the way your sweat smells can be
influenced by your mood, certain foods and beverages, some drugs and
medical conditions, and even by your hormones.”
Read “Body Odor and Sweating.” Mayo Clinic Health Information.
(7/19/2002) at http://www.walgreens.com/library/topics/Sweating.jhtml

 “If you bathe regularly and have an odor, something is wrong. The
most common cause of body odor is a skin infection. Sweat doesn't
smell when it first reaches your skin. The odor comes only after
bacteria or fungus on the skin's surface break down the fat in sweat
to form chemicals that smell.”
Read  “Body Odor,” by Gabe Mirkin, MD. (1/10/2000) at
http://www.drmirkin.com/morehealth/8831.html
 
 “The main reason why people stink is that some don't bathe
enough…..An overactive bacterial fauna on the skin is also a possible
cause of B.O. Some people have more bacteria on them, others less, but
again, it all comes down to good hygiene.” Read “Eliminate Body Odor
for Good,” by Joshua Levine. AskMen.com at
http://www.askmen.com/sports/health/43_mens_health.html
  “Blaming a B.O. problem on a more active bacterial fauna on your
body is oversimplifying things. Just shower more and you will have
fewer critters running around on you.”
 “Cutting down on caffeine reduces B.O. Coffee, cola, chocolate, and
other caffeine aliments contribute to odor because they stimulate
apocrine sweat glands (you know... that fatty sweat that bacteria love
to munch on).
 “Drinking plenty of fluids keeps eccrine sweat glands active; this
dilutes apocrine perspiration, which reduces body odor.
“Eliminate Body Odor for Good,” by Joshua Levine. AskMen.com at
http://www.askmen.com/sports/health/43_mens_health.html

 “The efficiency or otherwise of our internal detoxification processes
are commonly affected by nutrient imbalances - for example the
micro-element zinc has been reported by Professor Derek Bryce-Smith,
of Reading University, England, as being deficient in people with body
odour.”
(referenced from Bryce-Smith D Hodgkinson L The Zinc Solution Century
Arrow 1986) in “Body Odor: Recent Research Shows it can be a Serious
Problem,” by Leon Chaitow. HealthWorldOnline at
http://www.healthy.net/asp/templates/article.asp?PageType=Article&ID=495

Decline in body odor with age
*************************
 “The apocrine glands decrease in size and function with age.
Clinically these changes do not appear to have an effect except
possibly a decline in body odor.”
“The Merck Manual of Geriatrics.” Chapter 122. Aging and the Skin.
Contributor: Barbara A. Gilchrest; Noel Chiu at
http://www.merck.com/pubs/mm_geriatrics/sec15/ch122.htm
 “The 3 million sweat glands on the body also begin to disappear or
stop functioning with age, providing one of the benefits of growing
old: less body odor.” From “Muscle,” by Jeff Kunerth. The Orlando
Sentinal (7/16/2000) at
http://www.holyzoo.com/word/collection/age.html
 
 Diabetes Control
*******************
 Taking medicines as prescribed and monitoring blood glucose levels at
home can prevent many cases (of body odor) due to uncontrolled
diabetes. Read “Body Odor,” by John Riddle. Diseases and Conditions
Encyclopedia at http://health.discovery.com/diseasesandcond/encyclopedia/3190.html

Here is a question and answer you can relate to, posted on
IVillage.com.
  Q: Please explain why my husband, 39, never has to wear deodorant.
He sweats worse than anyone I have ever seen but has no odor. -- R.S.
 A: Sweat and oil glands, particularly those under the arms and in the
groin, are the principal causes of body odor. They contain volatile
fatty acids whose aroma is anything but pleasant. *****Your husband's
glands might not have those substances.*****
 Bacteria add to the odor by digesting oils and sweat and emitting an
equally offensive odor.
From “Daily Health Headlines.” Paul Donohue, MD. (12/17/2001) at
http://magazines.ivillage.com/goodhousekeeping/hb/news/article/0,13708,bhsuper_2002_11_29_TUL_0000-7930-KEYWORD~Missing~ew~xml,00.html

Additional Reading
  For a somewhat amusing experiment done by a creative individual to
test axillary armpit odor and skin infection, read “Axillary Malodor:
Sell the Product or Solve the Problem,” by Georgiy Kuznetsov at
http://www.killbo.com/H/
  I find it extremely interesting that underarm odor differs from race
to race. In Japan, for example, underarm odor is extremely rare.
“Odor,” by V. Vemuri at http://my.engr.ucdavis.edu/~das/rao/Odour.html

 It is evident that you are on top of things when considering
possibilities for you recent lack of body odor as relating to
medication, diabetes and low-testosterone. However, since your medical
exams seem to indicate that all these conditions are under control,
you might consider the above research as evidence that you are
actually doing everything right!

 I hope this gives you some good insight! Thanks for your interesting
question!

umiat-ga

Google Search Strategy
Loss of body odor in old age
perspiration +without +odor
absence body odor
sweat with no odor
lack of axillary malodor
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