I am looking for overseas (or otherwise price competitive)
manufacturers of light emitting diodes, capable and experienced in the
process of integrating custom application specific integrated circuits
(ASICs) into the physical lamp body.
Examples of this type of product can be found within the following two
commercially available devices:
·Brookstone Microbeam Multicolored LED Keychain Flashlight
(http://www.brookstone.com/shop/product.asp?product_code=MICROBEAM&search_type=search&search_words=led)
·QuasarPen (http://www.quasarpen.com/quasarStore/ShoppingCart/home)
Upon careful examination of these products, you will find that the LED
in each includes an ASIC built right into the lamp itself. This is my
primary requirement. Although my ASIC will be different than either
of these, any manufacturer with the capability of producing this type
of product should be able to work with my design.
I will pay $150 for at least three such manufacturers. These
companies must have English-speaking representatives, and preferably
have some type of sales office within the United States. I will pay a
bonus of up to $50 depending on the quantity and quality of the
information.
Please do NOT respond with any manufacturers incapable of integrating
ASICs into their products. I have already wasted a great deal of time
working with companies who 'say' they can do this, but really cannot.
I will be happy to contact any serious researchers with additional
details. If you would like me to do so, please respond here with your
preferred method of contact.
Thanks,
Josh Bussert |
Clarification of Question by
joshbussert-ga
on
26 Apr 2003 11:47 PDT
I noticed that this question was locked fairly quickly. Please
confirm your answers before submitting them, and explain your method
of confirmation. I have personally had to call companies in order to
receive any significant level of confidence in their capabilities, and
I would be very curious as to how effective clarification could be
made over the weekend.
That said, I appreciate the prompt interest in my query and look
forward to the responses that I hope to receive.
Josh Bussert
|
Request for Question Clarification by
ragingacademic-ga
on
27 Apr 2003 12:41 PDT
Josh -
A question is locked when a researcher is working on it - it may be a
while before you see an answer posted. That said, we do have our
ways, you know! :-)
ragingacademic
|
Clarification of Question by
joshbussert-ga
on
27 Apr 2003 13:29 PDT
Point well taken. I respectfully await your collective input.
Thanks,
Josh
|
Request for Question Clarification by
pafalafa-ga
on
27 Apr 2003 17:38 PDT
Hello Josh,
This is a difficult question, as you are clearly already aware.
I'm struck by one comment you make in your question: "any
manufacturer with the capability of producing this type of product
should be able to work with my design".
If it were just a question of identifying such manufacturers, I
believe I can help out -- I've included a link to one such
manufacturer below, who makes a microprocessor-controlled LED
mini-light similar to the one you referenced in your question.
However, I have no capacity for evaluating such firms, either in terms
of their technical capabilities, or their price competitiveness. Nor
can I imagine any researcher offering such an evaluation, short of
actually beginning to engage the firms in a dialogue on specifications
and costs.
Anyway, have a look at this link. If it would be useful to you to
have links to a few more manufacturers with these types of
capabilities, I can probably provide you with several. Whether that
information, alone, would constitute a satisfactory answer to your
question is entirely up to you.
Good luck in your venture.
----------
http://www.xgen.com.sg/
E T Light
item no: xgn-etl
Water resistance
4 Ultra-Bright White LEDs
Visible over 3 miles/ 5.55km
Up to 700 hours of burn time
Microprocessor-Controlled Signalling and power management
|
Clarification of Question by
joshbussert-ga
on
27 Apr 2003 18:54 PDT
Pafalafa et al,
Thanks for your initial investigation into this question. You are
correct that this will be a somewhat challenging question to answer.
That said, there are a few points that should make your search a bit
easier.
First, I am looking for a manufacturer of the LED/ASIC itself, as
opposed to a company that utilizes pre-fabricated LEDs.
Second, the ASIC needs to be build right into the LED lamp body rather
than attaching externally. Any company utilizing microprocessors is
most likely attaching both the processor and the LED to an external
circuit board due to the inherent size of the processor.
Please refer to the following link as it might visually clarify my
requirements:
http://www.bussert.com/sample/lamp.jpg
Although there are no dimensions marked on the image, the lamp
depicted is 8mm across its horizontal axis. Also, while there are
three LED elements depicted, this is not necessarily a requirement.
Finally, the component labeled "IC" represents the ASIC from my
previous description.
I hope that this helps in your quest. Please feel free to ask as many
clarifying questions as needed. That said, I will be traveling Monday
during the day and then again on Tuesday evening until late Friday
night. Please understand if I am unable to respond quickly.
Thanks again,
Josh Bussert
|
Request for Question Clarification by
pafalafa-ga
on
29 Apr 2003 12:28 PDT
Hello again.
The added information helped, but I'm still not clear on the "built
right in" part of things. Are you looking for a copmany that
manufactures an ASIC/LED combination AND that also manufactures
flashlight housings AND somehow builds the ASIC/LED right into the
housing rather than mounting it on the housing?
It seems likely to me that the housing would be manufactured
elsewhere, perhaps with an area machined-out to insert the ASIC/LED,
and then assembled, perhaps even by a third party.
I guess a bit more of a description of just what you mean here (and a
detailed picture would be an immense help -- your schematic got me
part way there) would possibly help me to move forward on this.
You might also tell us a bit more of your experience to date speaking
with potential manufacturers. Where precisely, are you finding a
roadblock in your efforts to have something manufacturered.
I'll look forward to hearing from you on this.
pafalafa-ga
|
Clarification of Question by
joshbussert-ga
on
29 Apr 2003 16:53 PDT
I am only looking for the single component described at:
http://www.bussert.com/sample/lamp.jpg
I do not need any “flashlight” body or other external assembly. I am
simply looking for a manufacturer who has the capability of building
the LED with an ASIC as part of the discrete LED assembly (as shown in
my drawing).
That is the sum total of what I am looking for. If they can produce
the device described in my drawing, I am satisfied.
As shown, my drawing describes a single device, measuring ~8mm in
diameter. It has three leads, a positive, a negative, and a signal.
It has an LED element (actually, it has three LED elements… but this
is not required). Finally, it has an integrated ASIC. This entire
assembly is housed within a single epoxy head measuring ~8mm in
diameter. From all external appearances, it looks like a LED with
three leads. You would only see the ASIC if you destroyed the device.
I hope that this is sufficient. If not, please reply with an
alternate contact method. I’d be glad to call any researcher who
needs further info.
Thanks,
Josh Bussert
|
Request for Question Clarification by
pafalafa-ga
on
29 Apr 2003 18:06 PDT
OK Josh, thanks for hanging in there with me -- although English is
NOT my second language, it sometimes seems that way. When I re-read
your initial posts, it suddenly all made sense.
By the way, Researchers can only communicate with customers here, via
this process. It's against the rules to post personal contact
information, I'm afraid.
Now to business...please have a look at this site below and tell me if
it seems to be on the right path. They seem to have some detailed
technical documentation of their LED products, but unfortunately, I
couldn't succesfully open up their PDF files...perhaps I can resolve
this shortly. These might be on the mark, or they might actually be a
bit *too* integrated (too small?) for what you need.
Let me know what you think. Thanks.
pafalafa-ga
----------
http://www.aot.com.tw
Advanced Optoelectronic Technology Inc. was founded in 1999 in Hsinchu
Taiwan R.O.C.by a group with nearly fifteen years of highly innovative
specialists in optoelectronic product. AOT is now a high-tech
manufacture of surface mount chip LED in Taiwan.
AOT is ISO -9001 certificated, and has approximately 100 employees,
including a quality control department and R&D department dedicated to
serving customers needs. We are professional SMD LED OEM/ODM factory.
Our standard product line includes diverse SMD LED, which have created
great turnover and the confidence of our customers. We work
efficiently, professionally, aggressively and happily together to
achieve the needs of our clients....
AOT can offer Custom-designed SMD LED modules by Customer's request
and the smallest commercial SMD LED are 1.0mm X 0.5mm X 0.4mm
|
Clarification of Question by
joshbussert-ga
on
01 May 2003 18:21 PDT
Pafalafa,
I also had some difficulty opening their PDFs, but I assume that was
due to my lack of Chinese character support for Acrobat. That said, I
probably couldn’t read it if I could open it. :)
AOT seems to be only a manufacturer of LEDs. AOT does make one
statement that leads me to question whether they could address my
need. In their content, they state, "To further meet customer's
requirements, AOT has not only alliance with wafer/chip supplier but
also SMT subsidiaries and mobile phone makers."
One might assume that with such relationships they may be able to
address my need. But then again, their are hundreds of companies with
such relationships who do not have this capability. My question
remains, "who can definitively do this?"
Without a US agent, one could try to engage them via e-mail regarding
this project. It has been my experience that through e-mail, people
are very fond of saying 'yes' regardless of what the reality is.
AOT seems to be a source of SMD LEDs, but the ASIC question remains.
Will you (Pafalafa, or another Google researcher) continue to
investigate this, or should I resume calling manufacturers? Please
don't take my tone (in text???) to sound harsh. It is definitively
not intended to be that way. But the fact is that this is the point
where I left off some days ago. I can find numerous manufacturers of
SMD LEDs. I just have been unable to locate manufacturers with the
required additional capabilities concerning the ASICs. This is the
challenge that I present to the Google community.
Are you up to it?
What's that I hear? A resounding 'YES!"??? Wonderful! Then I say,
"Go forth and kick some information butt! HOORAH!"
Josh Bussert
BTW, you can never be too small when it comes to this stuff!
|
Request for Question Clarification by
pafalafa-ga
on
01 May 2003 18:29 PDT
Josh,
I'm going to keep plugging away at this one, and it could very well be
the case that there are other researchers pursuing it too (but don't
put all your eggs in the Google basket yet...you might want to pursue
some contacts on your own as well).
You can probably tell from my earlier messages that I'm climbing the
learning curve here, and I think I'm at the point where I can make
some meaningful judgements about what would or wouldn't be useful to
you.
I'll bring you up to date as I learn anything new. Let's wish both
ourselves luck in the quest.
pafalafa-ga
|
Request for Question Clarification by
pafalafa-ga
on
05 May 2003 14:25 PDT
OK...I've got one reputable company that says they *probably* can do it, but:
(1) you would have to supply the ASIC
(2) minimum run is 500K units
We haven't gotten to the point of costing anything out.
Are these workable conditions for you? How would you like me to proceed?
|
Clarification of Question by
joshbussert-ga
on
07 May 2003 06:28 PDT
The 500k quantity is not a problem. In all probability our runs will
be 2x~10x larger. Regarding the ASIC, I need the manufacturer to
provide the part or at least have a relationship with a third party.
Basically, I need to source the finished part. You know, one invoice,
one throat to choke, etc.
Good job so far!
Josh
|
Request for Question Clarification by
pafalafa-ga
on
07 May 2003 13:19 PDT
I've got another company that thinks they *might* be able to do this,
but the guy's asking me for the specs/schematic on the ASIC.
Can you post a link to it? Or do you want to pick up the ball from
here with the two leads I can give you, even though I haven't (and may
not be able to!) fully scope out their capabilities.
Let me know what makes the most sense to you.
|
Clarification of Question by
joshbussert-ga
on
11 May 2003 19:56 PDT
Sorry so long in getting back to you. I've been traveling with work,
and my dial-up has been giving me fits.
Regarding the schematics, I cannot supply these until after I have
negotiated a nondisclosure agreement with the manufacturer. As a
result, I am only asking you to find manufacturers with this
capability. Any manufacturer that has the capability of building the
full spectrum color-changing ASIC/LEDs that I referenced previously
should be able to accomplish my project. If the guy says he can do
and he provides sufficient proof that you to believe him, then I am
satisfied.
Please remember that I need three such manufacturers.
Thanks again for all of your help,
Josh
|
Request for Question Clarification by
pafalafa-ga
on
14 May 2003 15:52 PDT
Oy vey, Josh.
I've gone about as far as I can with these manufacturers without
having more specifics to work with...for every question I might want
to ask them, they come back with ten for me, and I just can't answer
them, because they're really questions for you.
So...tell you what I'm going to do. A gentleman's agreement, of
sorts. Here are the contacts I've found so far (I'll probably hear
from a few more as time passes). They are more or less in order of
likliehood of being able to do the job. If one of them pans out for
you, let me know, and I'll post it as a formal answer and collect my
fee. And if they don't pan out...then no harm done.
Best of luck to you.
----------
Tim Delaney
Delaney Industries
(888)771-4547
www.delind.com
tim@delind.com
Sounds like he can do the job, but had a whole mess o' questions,
including:
What is the timing of the project. ?
Has the product been presold, or is this strictly a development
project.
Has the product been fully designed? If so, we need to see drawings
and specs and we will sign a NDA. If not, do you need us to design?
Are the funds in currently in place to cover development costs, setup
and initial order- or will financing be required?
----------
Jeff Land
S-J Associates
jland@sjassoc.com
703.533.2233 office
703.626.4018 mobile
http://www.sjassoc.com/
This guy's an agent representing a number of ASIC manufacturers and he
thinks he can get the job done, probably through AMI, though other
companies may also be possible. Again....wants a ton of info in order
to direct the job the right way.
----------
Chad Stalker
cstalker@colorkinetics.com
http://www.colorkinetics.com/
Wants...what else...more information. I don't know a lot about Color
Kinetics except that two other companies that *couldn't* manufacture
your piece suggested I contact them.
----------
J.H.KIM
ichest@korea.com ; jhkim@nissitronics.com
http://www.nissitronics.com/
A possibility. Our communication was via e-mail, and they say they
can do it, but I wasn't sure they fully got what you are after. Could
just be a language issue, though.
----------
Hope one of them comes through.
|
Clarification of Question by
joshbussert-ga
on
14 May 2003 16:04 PDT
Pafalafa,
Thanks for all of your hard work. I'll begin calling these folks
tomorrow, and will respond to you via this forum in the next few days.
Josh
|
Request for Question Clarification by
pafalafa-ga
on
21 May 2003 08:32 PDT
Hey Josh,
I'm DYING to know how things are going...any of the leads look
promising, or are they turning into dead ends?
|
Clarification of Question by
joshbussert-ga
on
22 May 2003 06:57 PDT
Pafalafa,
Delaney Industries is an assembly shop. They do not manufacture the
discrete components. As an example, they might take one company's LED
and another's ASIC and assemble a circuit board utilizing both. They
do not manufacture either of the discrete components, nor do they work
on a scale anywhere approaching my requirements.
As you stated, S-J Associates represents AMI who does manufacture
ASICs. They do not manufacture any other component, nor do they
assemble any other components into their finished package. They
*might* be a source for the ASIC if I need to outsource it to another
company, but they cannot manufacture my product.
ColorKinetics has developed a technology dealing with mixing different
light sources, and they would very much like to force the rest of the
world into paying them licensing fees. They don't manufacture
LED/ASIC assemblies.
I have not yet contacted Nissitronics. I will do so, but I feel that
they are probably the least likely as they are representing products
manufactured by Lumiled, who would be their competitor if they could
manufacture their own LEDs.
I'll let you know if anything positive turns up with my further
discussions with Nissitronics or AMI, but I am not hopeful.
Do you wish to continue this process?
Josh Bussert
|
Request for Question Clarification by
pafalafa-ga
on
22 May 2003 07:18 PDT
Bummer.
It's hard to imagine it being so difficult to find the type of
capabilities you need, but I have to admit...I'm at my wit's end.
I've had a few other nibbles from folks since my last post to you, but
none that seemed even as promising as the ones I provided
(which...apparently...aren't all that promising).
The best I can do is wish you well in your efforts, and continue to
look around for as long as your question remains open. If anything
turns up, I'll certainly let you know. But I, too, am not terribly
hopeful at this point.
Wish it were otherwise!
pafalafa-ga
|
