Ok, this one is not just for fun.  I need real help and guidance this
time.

What vocational, occupational, or other alternatives to conventional
schooling can we find in Northern California (Santa Clara County) for
a 17-year-old male who
- is extremely bright (162+ IQ)
- is not at all extrinsically motivated--used to be intrinsically
motivated and is now intrinsically UNmotivated; really is just about
completely unmotivated to do anything
- has few interests, mostly just computer games and music
- is an excellent learner if anything does take his interest
- hates every kind of school
- has dropped out, fallen out, or been kicked out of 5 secondary
schools, 3 of them alternative schools--mostly for not attending or
for not doing anything when he got there
- is under treatment for depression
- has a long-standing pattern of just doing nothing and waiting to see
what happens
- is somewhere around sophomore grade level
- could probably pass the GED today
- has no aim or goal in life
?

A number of very smart therapists, practitioners, counselors, and
teachers have been entirely at a loss what to do with this child. 
Their formulas and packaged solutions do not work on him.

This multitalented kid is not only showing no hope of fulfilling his
tremendous potential but does not even seem likely to be able to take
care of himself as he will have to do within a year or so.  Right now
he could be sent somewhere, but there is no point if he will not do
anything and just waits to be dropped.

Urgently needed:  advice, recommendations, answers.  School starts in two weeks.

Thank you,
Apteryx

Hello apteryx-ga: 

As you've learned the hard way, there isn't any magical, one-step
solution out there. But I did find some programs in the Santa Clara
area, and some other resources, that may help your family.

Just let me say upfront, I have some understanding of these types of
problems from my own battles during my teens (I have ADD), and from
some of my friends' trials & tribulations with their kids, ranging
from ADD to dyssemia (more about the latter condition is noted below).

Re: alternatives to high school:

An often over-looked possibility is, public school districts are
obligated to provide homebound instruction to children ages 18 and
under, who -- due to physical or psychological problems -- can't
attend school.

Call your district's superintendent and ask him/her about homebound
instruction. If your son qualifies (the school board will have to
approve him as a homebound student), certified teachers (often,
substitute teachers) will come to your home and tutor him one-on-one.
At least they may be able to work with him enough to get him through
GED testing.

Be prepared: the superintendent may inform you that a parent or
parent-appointed guardian must be present in your home during
homebound tutoring. You may be able to arrange tutoring around your
and/or your spouse's work schedule. Otherwise, one of you may have to
take a leave of absence, or you may have to call in favors to friends
and relatives who are available to hang out at your home during
tutoring sessions.

You said alternative schools hadn't worked for him, and I assume you
mean brick & mortar magnet or charter schools. You may want to
consider "cyber charter schools," which will enable your son to stay
home and learn in an online classroom.

For an overview, see "Policy Brief on Charter Schools":
http://www.ecs.org/clearinghouse/44/13/4413.htm

You can read about California's online Vision Academy high school in
this November 2002 Sacramento Bee article by Bill Lindelof, "Students
feel at home in new 'cyber school'":
http://www.sacbee.com/content/news/education/story/5333530p-6323673c.html
You'll see a contact phone number for Visions: (916) 971-7037.  

Also see California's "Cyber High" at:
http://www.cyberhigh.org/index.htm

Cyber schools are controversial, but many children have done well with
this form of  home schooling or alternative education. There is
currently much debate in several states as to whether public school
funds should continue to fund charter schools. Right now, some cyber
schools charge a small fee for materials. It's been several months
since I've read extensively about charter schools, but based on the
material I've found for you today, it appears they're still publicly
funded in CA.

Given his high IQ, your son may indeed be able to pass GED testing
after just a few months of homebound or cyber instruction. Also,
having tutors coming into your home (either literally or virtually)
every day to work with him, one-on-one, means he'll have to do his
homework. He can't hide in the back row and hope the teacher doesn't
call on him. Who knows? He may become motivated enough that he'll want
to keep at it and earn his diploma.

Here's some additional resources for schooling and counseling:

EMQ (Eastfield Ming Quong) in Santa Clara is a program that assists
teens who struggle at conventional schools. See:
http://www.emq.org/OurServices/School-based_Treatment.html

From that site: "EMQ provides therapeutic services at school sites
throughout Santa Clara County in partnership with four school
districts and the County Office of Education. EMQ staff offers mental
health support for children whose emotional problems block them from
learning in a less restrictive classroom setting. The educational
staff provides academic curriculum, special education support and
classroom space." You can call EMQ at 408-379-3796.

Btw, according to this link:
http://216.239.53.104/search?q=cache:8ZSbF3ekH3oJ:www-cap.stanford.edu/training/Training%2520Manu%25C9%2520revised%25202002.pdf+%22child+psychiatrists%22+%22Santa+Clara%22&hl=en&ie=UTF-8
it appears EMQ is affiliated with Stanford School of Medicine, which
is certainly impressive.

Stanford also has outpatient mental health services at its Lucile
Packard Children's Hospital. See:
http://www.lpch.org/clinicalSpecialtiesServices/COE/BrainBehavior/Psychiatry/overview.html

A great benefit in going to Stanford for help would be dealing with
doctors who are completely up-to-date on new research and treatments.
Since your son hasn't fared well with therapists in the past, he may
respond to more innovative approaches. Clearly, the tried-and-true
hasn't helped him up to this point.

Helping your son get the schooling and counseling he needs to get his
GED may well be the easy part. Helping him decide what kind of job
training he wants could be the biggest battle you'll face.

chellphill-ga made some excellent suggestions for vocational programs,
and also noted that people like your son (and me!) have only two
modes: not at all interested (AKA bored senseless) and obsession, with
no healthy middle gear whatsoever. His areas of great interest may
prove to be the *only* basis for a successful career. He probably
won't last in a job that bores him; that is, he may be brain-wired so
that he simply can't just put up with a dull job, and then pursue fun
hobbies on his own time.

His interests are computers and music? I don't know if he plays music,
but there are careers in that field for non-musicians, including sound
engineer. See "Sound Engineering Schools - Thoughts and a List"  by
Dan Lasley at MusicCareers.net:
http://www.musiccareers.net/article.php?id=241

There's a long list of music-related careers (for non-musicians too,
such as critics, music editors, and music librarians) at:
http://www.menc.org/information/infoserv/Dictionary.html

There are, of course, many careers related to computers. This site,
"Careers in Computing":
http://www.computer.org/education/careers.htm
provides an overview of various jobs and resources, including links
for "Distance learning.

This informative, and somewhat caustic, site offers some perspective
(and humor) on careers in computers:
http://philip.greenspun.com/careers/ 

Graduating Engineers & Computers Careers Online has a list of great
articles, including one on very cool hi-tech jobs, and one on career
fairs, at:
http://www.graduatingengineer.com/articles/feature/index.html
(At left, see some very helpful links for would-be computer
scientists.)

If he shows any interest in any particular line of work, don't
hesitate to call a related company (say a software firm, or a company
that makes computer games), and ask if your son can come in for an
"informational interview." Many companies will be glad to give your
son a tour, and let him speak to some of their professionals and watch
them in action.

Or, if that doesn't work out, start asking your friends, do you know
anyone who knows anyone whose cousin's cousin works in these fields?
If so, arrange to have your son meet with that person. People who
really love their jobs often love to spread the gospel.

If nothing in computers or music interests him, he's going to need
some vocational guidance, and that's where you need to cast the net
wide, so that he has opportunities to explore many different avenues.
You can take him to job fairs. If he really can't narrow down to
anything that interests him enough to do it 8 hours a day (that pays a
living wage): take him -- drag him if you have to -- to as many places
and events as possible; expand his horizons. Take him to art museums,
plays, community events, even things like community or church dinners.
Just take him everywhere you can, and especially try to give him the
opportunity to see people in action creating or working. At least help
him meet people from all types of industries and professions. Sooner
or later he's going to meet someone whose job sounds interesting to
him.

Once he finds some career ideas he likes, you can try this page "Cyber
Schools & Online Education":
http://www.trade-schools-review.com/trade_schools_articles_usa_today_cyber_schools.html
It focuses on cyber colleges and trade schools. At the top of the page
you can link to vocational schools by subject.
  
Re: possible sources of his problems: as I noted, I have ADD, and the
aforementioned book, DRIVEN TO DISTRACTION, helped me enormously. Your
son may have a condition called "dyssemia": a potpourri of
neurobiological disorders including ADD, Asperger's (mild,
high-functioning autism), and a little of this and a little of that.
The condition is maddening because it contains traces and echoes of so
many problems. It's a bewildering condition that, by its nature, often
stumps even outstanding therapists.

You can check this link to learn more about the definitive book on
dyssemia, HELPING THE CHILD WHO DOESN'T FIT IN (Peachtree Publishers:
June 1992. Dr. Stephen Nowicki and Marshall P. Duke.), at:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1561450251/qid=1061218462/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/002-1628388-9854463?v=glance&s=books

Don't be put off right away when you notice the emphasis on children
with poor verbal skills. I happen to know one dyssemic child who's a
delightful conversationalist. People with dyssemia don't act
completely alike any more than those of us with ADD all act alike. (In
fact, your son may have non-hyperactive ADD, which would help explain
his passivity. Non-hyperactive ADDers are often listless to the point
that you just want to scream at them.)

Another book, SHADOW SYNDROMES: THE MILD FORMS OF MAJOR MENTAL
ILLNESSES THAT SABOTAGE US (Pantheon: 1997, by John J. Ratey, M.D.
(co-author of DRIVEN) and Catherine Johnson, Ph.D.),  may offer some
insight and guidance into your son's problems.

Also recommended: YOU MEAN I'M NOT LAZY, STUPID, OR CRAZY?! (Scribner:
1995, by Kate Kelly and Peggy Ramundo). This book, written by
psychiatric nurses who both have ADD, is written in simplistic style
for people who are bright, but have poor reading skills or limited
attention span. It contains a wealth of practical information on
various approaches to coping with all forms of ADD, including
non-hyperactive. This book is especially useful for career guidance:
which types of brain-wiring match which kinds of jobs.

Another ADD book that could help you and your son is ATTENTION DEFICIT
DISORDER: A DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVE (Underwood Books: 1997, by Thomas
Hartmann). I love this book, which offers an anthropological
explanation for the baffling mysteries of ADD. Hartmann argues that we
ADDers are hunters who never evolved into farmers; that is, we roam,
we forage, we hate structure, coloring in the lines, sitting in
alphabetical order, and all that other stuff. This book is especially
appealing to all of us misfits who scoff at the dull farmers (people
who don't have ADD) who plant and harvest according to a stupid
calendar. Your son may actually read this book, as it appeals to the
rebel in us ADDers.

What these books, along with DRIVEN TO DISTRACTION, underscore, is we
wanderers MUST learn the farmers' organized ways in order to fit into
the modern world. The world isn't about to adjust to us; we have to
adjust to it. Sadly, many people with ADD (and other disorders) have
high IQs and many talents, but become underachievers because they fail
to learn self-discipline. Please understand, anyone can develop
self-discipline and structure, but some of us need help to learn the
basics. The above-cited books can go a long way in helping your son
understand why he is the way he is, and what he can do to help
himself.

I really believe your son needs aggressive cognitive/behavioral
therapy with a psychiatrist. Ideally, you want an M.D. in a case this
severe, or at least a psychologist who has a strong background in
neurobiology and who religiously keeps current on brain research. When
you call doctors' offices, don't hesitate to ask if the psychiatrist
(or psychologist) is oriented in psychobiology or neurobiology --
brain-wiring. I would emphasize that above all else, I think your son
has a problem with brain-wiring (and that is VERY common). I don't
think it's just a matter of him pulling up his bootstraps, although he
is going to have to learn to do that too.

For more help:
http://www.family-teen-program.com/ in Laguna Beach, CA.

The Buddy System (Santa Clara):
http://www.buddysystem.com/resource.html
"Bill Lehtonen offers Parenting Classes for individuals and groups
focused on building accountability and responsibility within the
family. Please call him at 408/391-9890 for more information."

Also, you can go to: http://www.respond.com:
Type in "therapist" or "psychologist." This will bring up a page where
you can fill in fields on the type of therapy you're seeking, in this
case, "adolescent issues," whether you want a certified, licensed
therapist only (check "Yes"!), and where you live, etc. You'll receive
an e-mail notifying you of Santa Clara area therapists who specialize
in working with kids.

I say this with all due respect and a lot of compassion: you may want
to seek some (even short-term) therapy for yourself too. You've been
living with chronic, overwhelming stress for a long time, and maybe
talking to someone about what you've been through will help you. It's
only now, as an adult, that I can appreciate what I put my mother
through way back when.

You have at least several years worth of battles ahead to launch your
son into successful early adulthood. You need to keep up your
strength, as your son still faces quite a few roadblocks and will need
your emotional support for some time to come. It won't be easy, but
your son can have a happy, fulfilling life and career.

But your son has to hit that proverbial wall and decide if he wants to
drift forever, or if he wants direction in his life and if he's
willing to help himself.  No, you can't "force him" into anything, but
you can set boundaries. If he doesn't make any attempt to get himself
together, you may have no choice but to try "tough love," and tell him
that upon his 18th birthday he'll be expected to move out and support
himself, if he isn't in school or some sort of job training program.
If you get a good therapist, he/she can advise you on how far you and
your spouse should push that approach.

Many of my colleagues made some excellent suggestions and I suggest
you re-review them for some truly helpful ideas.

I wish you and your son the very best. 

Search strings:

"'child psychiatrists' 'Santa Clara'"

"dyssemia"

"homebound instruction California"

"California cyber schools"

"music careers"

"computer careers"

Regards,
nancylynn-ga

Excellent work, nancylynn, and almost overwhelming in its scope and
depth.  Some of it is off the mark (no ADD here, I think), and some of
it is already on the rap sheet (EMQ, family therapy, Rxx, M.D.
therapist), but the majority is unexplored territory, with some very
fine and perceptive suggestions binding and integrating and amplifying
your research findings.  I thank you most gratefully for all you've
done here.

Apteryx

I don't know if this will provide any comfort, but, except for gender,
the description you've given sounds almost exactly like me, at age 17.
I had to take some time off from school before I was ready to continue
my education. Eventually I turned out OK (or at least I think so).
Some gifted people are late bloomers, but with the right nurturing
they may grow and produce some mighty fine blooms.

This sounds like someone I knew.  He was so bright and yet so bored. 
I wish I had an answer for you.  As my colleague Pinkfreud stated,
sometimes gifted people are late bloomers.  In addition to that, many
of these kids are dealing with angst and lack of interest in life. 
It's very difficult for them to find a niche in life - somewhere they
feel like they belong.  And school for them, a structured atmosphere -
brings on a whole new set of problems.

Have you considered OutwardBound?
http://www.outwardbound.com/

A Special Program for Troubled Teens
http://www.outwardbound.com/type/troubled_teens_ascent.html

You find yourself trying to look at the world through your teen’s
eyes. You see a rocky and unsettling road from adolescence to
adulthood, filled with potholes, perils and teen-age pitfalls. You
want to lend a hand. We can help.

Have you considered any of the following:
1. Homefires.com (the best homeschooling resource for Santa Clara
County).
2. Grace Llewellyn's books "The Teenage Liberation Handbook: How to
quit school and get a life and education" and "Real lives" (letters
from real unschooled teenagers).
3. Cedarwood Sudbury School in Santa Clara (The Unschooling School) --
http://www.cedarwoodsudbury.org; also check out the original Sudbury
Valley site (http://www.sudval.org) with lots of free texts online.

Bored smart kid?  I would not try to encourage him to use his mind, or
reach his potential.  Instead, I would put him to work, landscaping,
lumberjacking, stacking brings.

This child is certainly not a "troubled teen."  He is simply an
extremely intelligent young man being forced into a world designed for
those nowhere near his intellectual level.  I'd suggest contacting
groups who deal with kids like this specifically.  Some you should try
would be:

The Mega Foundation
"A variety of approaches are taken by the Mega Foundation in its
efforts to help the severely gifted. One is to provide intellectual
fellowship through which the profoundly gifted can overcome their
natural tendency to become isolated in a desert of misunderstanding.
Another is mentoring, whereby those of great promise can receive the
the kind of specialized personal guidance that will bring their gifts
to flower.  "
[ http://www.megafoundation.org/History.html ]

Hoagie's Gifted Education page
[ http://www.hoagiesgifted.org/ ]
There are LOTS of very good links on this page, s look through deeply.

I wish you the best of luck with this child.  The irony of this
situation is that he probably seems much more difficult to deal with
than a 'normal' child, yet he has so much more intellectual potential.
 Please do not give up trying to find a place for him to go-
eventually he will wake up to a place where he can be happy and very,
VERY useful and engaged.  Take care...

Sincerely,
Andrewxmp

Thank you all for the good comments.  I’ve found some helpful remarks
and suggestions here.  Others, though, surprise me:  commenters may
guess and speculate, but those aren’t facts supplied by me, and it
doesn’t make sense to base the next comment on them as if they were.

For example:  “bored smart kid”?  I didn’t say that.  I’ve been
exposed to a club of top-two percenters myself for more than three
decades and have seen or heard just about every variation on the
bored-smart-kid cliché that you can imagine.  This youngster does not
fit the mold.  The issue is not boredom.  If this were as simple as
that, he would not have left a trail of dozens of baffled teachers,
counselors, therapists, and psychiatrists in his wake.

I’ve also seen every kind of resource an organization like that has to
offer.  Personal advice and experience are probably still the very
best resources.

“Certainly not a troubled teen”?  Take a look at the Outward Bound
“Troubled Teens” program description and notice the list of
exclusions: “We cannot accept kids who . . . “ (sorry, not *that*
troubled).  The 17-year-old I wrote about is disqualified on two
counts.

Homeschooling:  with full-time-working parents, how does that work? 
And how do you actually force a child to study?  Look at the kids you
know who do their schoolwork, all or at least some of it.  Why do they
do it?  What happens when those reasons just aren’t there?

Some kids just need to take some time off.  This one took from one to
three years off, depending on how you count it, and is only in school
at all now because juvenile justice came into the picture.

I have sent for Grace Llewellyn’s book, which sounds promising, and am
having it shipped directly to him.  As for Cedarwood, thanks, but I
know much more about that alternative than anyone would care to see
written here.

The goal is not to get him to use his mind, and I don’t think anyone
has an obligation to reach his potential.  How, exactly, does one
force someone to go to work?  Really, how?  If you were the parent,
what would you do, refuse to feed him?

Intuitively I think the key is to figure out what there is in the
things he does do that makes him want to do them.  There are so few
such things that that is really hard, and he knows very well what use
the information would be put to if he supplied it.  If nothing
external motivates him, if he wants nothing, if nothing excites or
interests him, if he does not feel competent at or inspired by
anything, and if he detaches from anything that is withheld or
threatens to be withheld, that hypothetical key is not of much use.

So far, Pinkfreud, your remarks have been the most heartening.  I have
utter faith in his native abilities and his essential soundness of
being.  I have confidence that he will turn out all right too, if only
he can get through this long and painful passage, more than half his
life by now.  Sometimes I think the whole job of the adults who are
responsible for him is just to keep him alive long enough so he can.

Because he has to be in school somewhere, we have to answer the
question.  I didn’t think it was going to be easy.

Thanks for all the good wishes and encouragement.  Perhaps this was
just the wrong place to look.

Apteryx

Hi  apteryx-ga,
     I certainly appreciate your dilemma. I met my husband when he was
only 17, and watched him go through
a similar situation. He tossed around just about every idea known to
man.  But was never committed.
Then about 5 years ago, quite by accident, he stumbled onto the IT
(information technology) path. He went from being unmotivated
and apathetic about his career/future, to being enthusiastic, driven
and successfully.
He too is an avid gamer (just got back from Quakecon)  and other than
that, computers pretty much rule his life.
Have you given much thought about training and certification programs
the IT industry? My husband, and most of his
friends all started off in this field because of their love of
computer games and interest in computers in general.
And unlike most other professions, it is quite possible to obtain high
paying positions within reputable companies
without having to have a college degree.  Many companies are more than
happy to employ talented IT experts who have
the required certifications and  some experience. And a few will be
glad to let you get your feet wet with just your certs
and little or no experience. One of the benefits of this type of
education is that one is not necessarily required to go
to a class to obtain the certification.  It is highly  recommended of
course, especially for those who don't have much
experience in the field, however a person can buy the books and other
study material and study on his own, and then take
the test/tests at an authorized testing center.  If classroom training
is needed, many places do offer "bootcamp" style
courses, where the material is taught at an  accelerated pace over a
period of anywhere from 1 to 3 weeks. There
is also slower paced regular classroom style that is less intensive.
The good thing about schooling/training like this
is that the time is spent actually learning about the subject matter.
There usually isn't any "boring" hours spent going
over subjects that do not pertain to the certification.

With such certifications as CCNA (cisco certified network associate)
MCSE (Micrsoft certified systems engineer)
RHCE (red hat certified engineer) , it's possible to obtain positions
as a Network Administrator, Systems Administrator,
Network Engineer (with experience)  and Network Security  positions.

http://www.computertrainingschools.com/hello/santaclara/
An IT Certification Training Company

http://www2.itt-tech.edu/qs/campus/school.cfm
ITT Technical Institute

I quite honestly believe that perhaps once this child gets a taste of
real success, earned by
his own skills and hard work, that it will become quite addictive. The
key with these types of
people is helping them find something that they have a natural knack
for, and can enjoy themselves doing it.
Perhaps if games are a really big factor you might discuss with him
about the possibility of pursuing the
skills/degrees/certifications that might be needed to work for a game
company?

Best of luck to you!
chellphill-ga

Apteryx-ga: This might sound a bit off the wall, but have you had this
young man evaluated for attention deficit disorder?  Many if not most
of the problems you mention could be symptomatic of ADD. It's a
neurological condition that is often associated with hyperactivity,
but in about a third of the cases hyperactivity isn't a symptom. 
Someone who has ADD and is as smart as he is could very easily have
hidden the symptoms that often lead to difficulties in school.  A
classic book on the condition, especially as it affects adults, is
"Driven to Distraction" by Edward Hallowell and John Ratey.  If you
haven't done so already, I strongly suggest you look at this
possibility, especially if this young man has a strong tendency to be
disorganized (starting tasks without finishing them, losing things a
lot, extreme procrastination, etc.).

You say that "he detaches from anything that is withheld or threatens
to be withheld". Have you tried removing all privileges? And I do mean
everything, even if it means hiring movers and having them move his
stuff to a locked storage unit somewhere. Not even the privilege to
pick out his own clothes each day, but instead forced to wear the
outfit you give him each morning. If that is not enough to motivate
this child to perform, and he isn't acting out of defiance, then I
would say that the depression issue needs to be looked at further.
When someone is really depressed, they will loose interest in things
that
normaly give them pleasure. You said he was being treated for
depression but did not mention if he was on any meds. If he is on
meds, then it could be that the dosage is insufficient, too high, or
he might be on the wrong type of med for him.
I would recommend taking him to a child Psychiatrist, if you haven't
already. Insufficiently treated depression, or incorrectly
prescribed/dosed meds could be what is making this kid "not care"
about anything.

Here is some interesting things for you to consider:
http://health.yahoo.com/centers/depression/_1518.html
"Because of the behavior problems that often co-exist with adolescent
depression, many parents are tempted to utilize punitive solutions
like "boot camps", "wilderness programs", or "emotional growth
schools."
These programs frequently utilize non-professional staff and use
confrontational therapies and harsh punishments. There is no
scientific evidence which supports use of these programs. In fact,
there is a growing body of research which suggests that they can
actually harm teens, particularly sensitive teens with depression"

http://www.about-teen-depression.com/treatment-depression.html
"Your child may not have the tools to get better on his own, so
telling your teen to "pull himself up by the bootstraps" will not be
effective if your child is clinically depressed. A depressed
adolescent is not lazy, willful, or just trying to get out of work. A
depressed teen is ill and needs treatment"

What a great answer, nancylynn! I wish some of these options had been
available when I was 17. Back then, bright youngsters who had such
problems were thought to be either "bad" or "crazy" or both.

Apteryx: thanks for your rating and for the tip. I'm glad I could
help, I really am . . . . Yes, I admit to an ADD bias! Teens with
depression always make me wonder if non-hyperactive ADD could also be
in the mix. But it sure sounds like you've been through a battery of
experts -- and they know more than I do!

I sure do wish you and your family the best. Just remember: Pinkfreud
and I turned out all right! (Btw, Pink, I was considered "bad" AND
"crazy.")

Here's to smooth sailing ahead,
nancylynn-ga