Background.

I'm an Australian guy who met an Italian girl from a small villiage in
Northern Italy some years ago. We stayed friends, she split from her
boyfriend (is now single), and I recently took her on a vacation to
Australia.

Things are warming up (she asked me on the plane back where we would
go for our honeymoon!) but I need help understaning our cultural
differences.

Unfortunatley, I fit the typical Aussie male stereotype of culture not
being in my vocabulary, but I would like some pointers on where to
read up and understand her culture.

For instance, she seemed upset when I suggested that marriage was
unimportant as long as two poeple loved each other (I'm an atheist
BTW). Why is marriage so important to her? Is this a Catholic thing?
Or, would she be looked down on by her family and communnity if say
she settled down and had kids without getting married?

She is almost 30, but still living at home with her parents, and needs
their permission to stay out late at night! This is beyond my
comprehension! Also, she insisted not only on separate beds, but
separate rooms when we travelled together. Why? Why would it be
considered wrong to share a bed or room to sleep in?

I should add that she is not unworldly - she is highly intelligent and
has a master's degree in English Literature and four fluent languages.

A great answer to this question would be some links to sites (in
English) that discuss or describe modern Italian social and religous
culture, with emphasis on personal relationships.

Personal experience or knowledge of Italian culture would be a bonus.

Hello eppy-ga!

Back in my dating years, I too was a part of a few "inter-faith"
relationships, so I deeply empathize with your situation. It's hard
enough to make a relationship work, but when your faced with the
realization that you both come from two completely different worlds,
it can be even more trying.

Not only are you having to deal with your girlfriends different
religious views, but her cultural ones as well. So I commend you on
your eagerness and enthusiasm to try and understand where she is
coming from!

As for why your girlfriend finds marriage so important, and whether or
not it's a "Catholic thing"
That question would be best answered by your girlfriend. Only she can
tell you why she feels/believes the way she does. But, to make an
educated guess, I would have to say that her views on marriage are
most likely due to her being Catholic, as well as her own personal
views, and the views of her family.
I have known quite a few practicing Catholics who believed in the
Sanctity of marriage and it's importance, but still continued to have
"relations" with partners out of wedlock. I have also known non
practicing Catholics, or ex-Catholics who didn't think that premarital
relations was a sin, but still chose marriage because of their own
moral convictions.
Any religion you will find, will have it's own views, laws, or "rules"
regarding sex and marriage. And within these religions, you will find
those that are devout in their beliefs. Their devoutness is usually
either they way they were brought up, or a way they have chosen for
themselves, or a combination of the two.

 
To Gain a better understanding of the Catholic Churches view on
marriage you may want to check out the links listed below.
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/09699a.htm
Moral and Canonical Aspect of Marriage

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/09707a.htm
Sacrament of Marriage
A bit of insight as to why many Catholics find marriage so important.

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/09693a.htm
The history of marriage

http://www.dwc.org/questions/Marriage/interfaith.htm
Interfaith marriages and the Catholic church

http://www.findarticles.com/cf_0/m1252/n15_v125/21148201/p1/article.jhtml
Interfaith marriages

Even though your girlfriend may be 30 years old, requesting the
permission of her parents before staying out late isn't necessarily
due to her religious beliefs, although they probably do play a part in
them. Many adult children, regardless of religious or cultural
upbringing will still show such respect while they are living in their
parent's home. It may fall under the category of the saying "While you
live under my roof, you follow my rules."
There is also instances where grown children will continue to obey
their parents, and abide by their wishes even when they are no longer
living with their parents.

Catholic and other Religious viewpoints about obeying parents:

http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/lewis/lewten51.htm
"Even though a child marries one whose faith permits him to accept
this Commandment as part of the Decalogue, that does not in the least
mitigate the enormity of the crime or lessen the hatred aroused. I
have seen a Catholic mother weep as though her heart would break
because her son was to marry a girl of the Protestant faith and the
marriage ceremony was to be performed in a Protestant church. I have
seen a Protestant mother disown and disinherit her son because he
married a Catholic girl and the ceremony was performed by a priest. It
was not until there was a death in the family that she permitted him
and his wife and children to enter her house. Even today I have known
orthodox Hebrew parents to mourn as dead a child who married outside
of their faith. Some even go to the extent of performing the funeral
ceremony as required by the ancient tribal law, to express their
grief, as well as their condemnation of this filial breach."

"The superstitious belief that parents possess the power of God on
earth is found in nearly all primitive societies. Long before Moses is
supposed to have lived, an Egyptian sage had written that "a son who
attends to the words of his father will grow old in consequence." "

"Fear of parents, and paying strict obedience to their demands, were
almost universal in early times, and prevail in primitive societies
today. The lower the scale of intellectual development, the greater
the fear and the stricter the compliance."

Would she would be looked down upon if she were to have children
without being married? The answer would be yes. In the eyes of the
Catholic church, sex outside of Holy Matrimony is a sin. She might
also be looked down upon if she were to marry a non-Catholic as well.

More on sin, premarital sex, and the Catholic church's views:

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14004b.htm
Sin

http://www.newadvent.org/summa/315402.htm
"Wherefore, since fornication is an indeterminate union of the sexes,
as something incompatible with matrimony, it is opposed to the good of
the child's upbringing, and consequently it is a mortal sin.

Nor does it matter if a man having knowledge of a woman by
fornication, make sufficient provision for the upbringing of the
child: because a matter that comes under the determination of the law
is judged according to what happens in general, and not according to
what may happen in a particular case. "

Information on interfaith relationships:

http://www.suite101.com/article.cfm/interfaith_relationships/66622
Defining Your Relationship: What Does Interfaith Mean?

http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/4448/Couples.html
The International Couples' Homepage
"This page is for those of you who are married (or planning to marry)
with a person of a different nationality.
Let's share our experiences, difficulties, anecdotes, merits and joys
of sharing your life with someone coming from a different culture!"

http://members.fortunecity.com/canzian/it.html
"On this list you'll find people from Italy who are engaged in
international marriages!"

Misc. Links you may find interesting:

http://www.virtualitalia.com/articles/wedding.shtml
Italian weddings and traditions

http://christianminds.healthekids.net/course.phtml?course_id=348
Religion and Catholicism in Italy

http://www.italydownunder.com.au/
An Australian magazine about Italian culture

http://www.virtualitalia.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=62&sid=8550d8c2f9d70c885b067b6551b8efaa
Traditional Italian Dating

http://www.virtualitalia.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=4
Message forum with various topics about Italian customs and culture,
such as dating,weddings, marriage, and manners.

http://www.virtualitalia.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=11
Main Italian forum, has some posts regarding culture and social
differences

http://www.newadvent.org/
Resources for information about the Catholic church and the Catholic
religion

Tips for success in a inter-faith relationship:

1.) Communicate. Once you feel comfortable in the relationship, you
should both sit down and discuss each others views, beliefs, and
families. Neither of you should be afraid to ask the other person
"honest questions" about each others perspectives.

2.) Keep an open mind. Remember what may seem odd or downright
abnormal to you, may be quite natural to your partner.

3.) Respect. No matter how much you disagree with your partners
perspective, you should never be disrespectful about it. Don't try and
prove that each other's beliefs are incorrect.

4.) Honesty. If there is a viewpoint/belief that your partner has, and
you absolutely cannot live with it, then tell them. If a compromise
cannot be made then it would be best to stop the relationship as to
avoid future heartache. For example, there is no point in telling your
partner you will be willing to convert to their religion when you have
no real intention of doing so, just to buy you time and more
"leverage" in the relationship.

5.) Families. Understand that your partners family/parents may play a
bigger role in their life than your family does in yours. Often when
in a relationship with a person of a different religion, Country or
culture, you will not only find yourself courting your partner, but
their family as well. If the relationship means that much to you, then
make the commitment to winning their approval as well. In some cases,
no matter how hard you try, you will not be able to win the hearts of
your partners family. In that case, just be the most respectful person
you know how to be.

Some questions you might consider asking yourself, and then discussing
with your girlfriend,

1.) If the only way to continue a serious relationship, or have a
relationship on a level you feel appropriate would be to marry this
woman, would you be willing to do so?

2.) Would you be willing to convert to her religion to continue the
relationship? Ask her about her views, or her families views would be
if she were to marry a non-Catholic, or an atheist.

3.) If you were to have children with this woman, would you be opposed
to their being raised as Catholic?

4.) If you didn't want to marry her, but did want a committed life
partnership with her, and she agreed, would you be able to go ahead
with it knowing that she could potentially be disowned by her family
and excommunicated by the church?

5.) If life changing compromises are made by either of you, would you
be able to do so willingly as to avoid any future resentment?

If you have any questions about the information in which I have
provided, do feel free to request a clarification of my answer. And
please be sure to allow me enough time to respond to your
clarification request before rating the answer.
Best of luck to you in your relationship!
 Thanks so much,
chellphill-ga

Search Terms used:
Interfaith relationships Catholic
Catholic Marriage
Italy dating customs
traditional Italian catholic views

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Request for Answer Clarification by eppy-ga on 24 Aug 2003 12:54 PDT

Thanks very much for your efforts. I appreciate your own advice as
well as the links. FYI, the concept of marriage or nominally raising
children as Catholic doesn't bother me; I just wanted to understand
why marriage can be seen as important to some people, and you've
provided me with the answer.

Before I rate your answer, I do have one question: Did you solely have
this question locked for the day or so between the posting and having
the answer published?

Thanks again very much!

---

Clarification of Answer by chellphill-ga on 24 Aug 2003 21:59 PDT

Hey eppy-ga,
Glad you found the information useful.
I do understand how foreign it can seem when exposed
to religious or personal views that are seem extreme when
compared to our own. One way I try to understand such views is
by thinking of something I personally consider morally wrong. Then
I try to picture someone where by either through their personal,
religious or cultural views, perceiving what I feel as wrong, to be
something
perfectly acceptable.
As for my lock on the question, I had it locked for around
2-3 hours before I posted my answer this morning. I am not sure who,
or if anyone had this question locked before I came across it.

Thanks again!
chellphill-ga

Researcher gave comprehensive answer, backed up by a lot of useful
links, and addresses each section of my question. Well done!

If a little advice from an Northern Italian can help, here it is:
1. Every Italian girl wants to marry, even if she is not religious.
Only 5-10% of Italian girls nowadays are "praticanti", i.e. go to
church every week and base their lives on church moral teachings. But
maybe 90% of girls want a marriage in church (even if you are an
atheist, even if SHE is an atheist). It is just for the ceremony.
2. Don't be afraid if she still lives with her parents. In Italy it is
very common to stay with our parents until we marry. That doesn't mean
to be parentally-controlled, it is just a way to save the rent. Of
course there are little trade-offs, ...

I hope this was useful.

Bye,
Marco