Does the student register (matricule) of the University of Paris
(faculty of theology, "Sorbonne") for students who enrolled in the
years 1641-43 still exist?
If so, where?
If not, why not?

(I would like to look up when someone who is known to have studied at
the Sorbonne enrolled there.)

Hello again buncic

After hearing from you, I decided to research this more thoroughly. My
first theory that the matriculation registers disappeared during the
revolution is still likely, but I've managed to establish that if they
*did* survive, they must be in the Bibliothèque de la Sorbonne.

If I could continue researching this online, I would, but it seems
impossible to communicate with the librarians at the Bibliothèque de
la Sorbonne by email. Thus, I'm afraid all I can do is give you the
facts I have and let you take it from there, by post, fax or phone.

Although the Sorbonne was used as a barracks and a prison after the
initial stages of the revolution, some of its documents were saved.
(Not just the library treasures I mentioned in my comment below.) In
fact, property titles and other valuable documents were confiscated
earlier, while the Sorbonne was still open, under a decree stripping
the clergy of their possessions. Some of these are stored in the
Archives Nationales and described online. They do not include any
matriculation registers.

The Archives Nationales tell us that other documents from the
pre-revolution University of Paris are in the Bibliothèque de la
Sorbonne (Sorbonne Library). Some of these are "registres" and this
could might just include "registres matricules".  Unfortunately, I can
find only one email address for the Bibliothèque de la Sorbonne and
that is the webmaster's. He has not been able to offer me any way of
contacting the librarians online. I also asked a computer support
department (at one of the Paris Universities linked to the Sorbonne)
and was referred to a library which asks people not to confuse it with
the Bibliothèque de la Sorbonne. I'm afraid I've reached a dead end
and can't suggest any ways of pursuing this online.


======================================


So - what can we discover via the net?

Somewhere in the Bibliothèque de la Sorbonne there are 109 registers
and 27 boxes of material relating to the Faculty of Arts and the Paris
colleges, including the Sorbonne, from the 13th century to the
Revolution:

"Archives de l'Université de Paris

109 registres et 27 cartons essentiellement relatifs à la faculté des
arts et aux collèges parisiens du XIIIe siècle à la Révolution."
http://www.sorbonne.fr/Websorbon/Arborescence/5-Etablissements/BIU/BIU04.html

The contents are listed in a catalogue compiled in 1918:

"La Bibliothèque de la Sorbonne conserve une partie des archives de
l’ancienne université de Paris dont la description figure dans le
Catalogue général des manuscrits des bibliothèques publiques de
France. Université de Paris et universités des départements, Paris,
1918, p.339-368."
www.archivesnationales.culture.gouv.fr/chan/
chan/fonds/EGF/SA/InvSAPDF/H-3.pdf

There is a copy in the Bibliothèque de la Sorbonne:

Catalogues des manuscrits :
BEAULIEUX, Charles, « Manuscrits de la bibliothèque de l’Université de
Paris »
DESCHAMPS, Paul, « Manuscrits de la bibliothèque Victor-Cousin à la
Sorbonne »,
Catalogue général des manuscrits des bibliothèques publiques de
France. Université de Paris,
Paris, Plon, 1918, p.1-368 et p.369-465.
Cotes : Salle de référence 011.31 SOR (accueil)
Salle de réserve USR 701
http://web.ccr.jussieu.fr/urfist/menestrel/guide.pdf


The author of the following article, Jacqueline Artier, knows a great
deal about the library's collections and might be a good person to
contact:
"Les Collections Patrimoniales de la Sorbonne"
http://www.enssib.fr/bbf/bbf-96-3/09-artier.pdf


Contact information for the Bibliothèque de la Sorbonne:

Adresse postale : 47 rue des Ecoles, 75257 Paris cedex 05

Tél. : 01 40 46 30 27
Fax  : 01 40 46 30 44

Informations Pratiques
http://www.sorbonne.fr/Websorbon/Arborescence/5-Etablissements/BIU/BIU01.html


====================================================


This is an outline of what the Archive Nationales have relating to the
Sorbonne:

Faculté de Théologie. XIIIe-XVIIIe s.
69A. Statuts, élections. XIIIe-XVIIe s. Comptes. 1549-1584.
69B. Censures de livres, condamnations de thèses, autorisations
d'imprimer, dossier sur la bulle Unigenitus. XVIe-XVIIIe s.
71 et 72. Consultations doctrinales, censures, correspondance avec les
rois et les princes. XVe-XVIIIe s.

Sorbonne. 1256-XVIIIe s.
Élections de proviseurs ; comptes, 1645-1646 (74). 
Fondations de chaires,assemblées, casuistique et censures, pièces
relatives à la bibliothèque
(75). 


Sorbonne. XIIIe-XVIIIe s.
268 à 277. Conclusions des prieurs prononcées dans les assemblées.
1540-1690.
278. Comptes. 1661-1664.
279 et 280. Inventaire des titres. 1716.
281 à 295. Cartulaire général. 1261-1647.
296. Compte des sommes extraites du coffre-fort. 1534-1648.

SÉRIES M ET MM
http://www.archivesnationales.culture.gouv.fr/chan/chan/fonds/EGF/SA/SAPDF/Egfn-m.pdf


S 6211 à 6232. Collège de Sorbonne.
6211 et 6212. Construction de la Sorbonne par Richelieu.
1256-1792.
6213 et 6224. Titres et baux de maisons. 1228-1791.
6225 à 6229. Censive. 1275-1708.
*6230 à *6232. Inventaires de titres. XVIe s.

SÉRIE S
BIENS DES ÉTABLISSEMENTS RELIGIEUX SUPPRIMÉS
http://www.archivesnationales.culture.gouv.fr/chan/chan/fonds/EGF/SA/SAPDF/egfn_s.pdf


Detailed accounts, mostly eighteenth century
Also background information and books on university history listed in
this document
ANCIENNE UNIVERSITÉ DE PARIS ET COLLÈGES :
comptabilité, titres de rentes
REPERTOIRE METHODIQUE ET REPERTOIRE NUMERIQUE DE LA SOUS-SERIE H3
http://www.archivesnationales.culture.gouv.fr/chan/chan/fonds/EGF/SA/InvSAPDF/H-3.pdf


====================================================

FURTHER INFORMATION


Bibliothèque de la Sorbonne
http://www.sorbonne.fr/Websorbon/Arborescence/5-Etablissements/BIU.html

Sorbonne website and administration outline:
http://www.sorbonne.fr/Websorbon/=Etab.html

References to the Sorbonne as barracks and prison in 1790s
http://www.sorbonne.fr/Websorbon/Arborescence/5-Etablissements/BIU/BIU02.html
http://www.humanite.presse.fr/journal/1998-05-26/1998-05-26-354852


Movements of documents during the Revolutionary period:

"Ces documents proviennent du séquestre des biens des corporations qui
avaient été supprimées par la loi du 18 août 1792. Les papiers des
collèges et de l'Université ne sont cependant pas parvenus d'un bloc
aux Archives nationales." (and following paragraphs)
http://www.archivesnationales.culture.gouv.fr/chan/chan/fonds/EGF/SA/InvSAPDF/H-3.pdf

"the Sorbonne buildings were emptied"
http://www.mtholyoke.edu/courses/rschwart/hist255/bohem/tsorbonne.html


It seems pretty certain that if these matriculation registers are not
in the Bibliothèque de la Sorbonne, they no longer exist. I'm not sure
whether to be optimistic about the library holdings. Although 109
registers sounds promising at first, they are not necessarily anything
to do with the Sorbonne and it is unclear whether they are the right
kind of registers. While researching, I looked out for references to
historians using pre-Revolution matriculation registers from Paris,
but there was nothing involving theology, nor the Sorbonne.

Good luck in your researches - I will be wondering how you get on! 
Please feel free to ask if there's anything further I can do to pin
this down.

Best Wishes - Leli


PS I hope I interpreted your wishes correctly when I posted this as an
answer, not just as a comment.


Search strategy:

Many searches were made difficult because the word "Sorbonne" is part
of so many Parisian academic addresses and references.

The key to finding the information about surviving documents was: 
archives sorbonne "ancien régime"
://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=archives+sorbonne+%22ancien+r%C3%A9gime%22&btnG=Google+Search&meta=

which led to this:
http://www.sorbonne.fr/Websorbon/Arborescence/5-Etablissements/Rectorat/Services/Archives/ARCHIV-02.html

and so to the Centre Historique des Archives Nationales:
://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=Centre+Historique+des+Archives+Nationales%22&btnG=Google+Search&meta=

Of course I also used combinations of Sorbonne, théologie, matricules,
étudiants, listes d'inscription, révolution, ancien régime, various
dates, caserne, soldats etc.

At first Leli provided rather thorough information that was meant only
as a comment and then for the final answer found out even more. Great!
Thank you!

Hello buncic

It's quite likely that the register disappeared during the revolution,
when the Sorbonne was closed and the building used for various
different purposes. See, for example, "The Lowest Ebb" section here:
http://www.sorbonne.fr/Websorbon/=Hist.html

Even though some manuscripts were saved, the matriculation records
might not have been given high priority.

"In anticipation of possible theft or destruction, valuable
manuscripts from the Sorbonne and St. Germain-des-Prés were stored in
the national library. Chamfort even disobeyed Roland’s orders and
saved the genealogies of aristocrats and other papers and books deemed
“useless” by the government."
http://www.gslis.utexas.edu/~landc/fulltext/LandC_34_4_Oliver.pdf

The article above implies that anything saved from the Sorbonne would
now be in the Bibliothèque Nationale, but I didn't find anything
helpful in their catalogue:
http://www.bnf.fr/pages/zNavigat/frame/catalog.htm

Nor did I have any luck with the Catalogue Collectif de France:
http://www.ccfr.bnf.fr/accdis/accdis.htm

I hope this helps a little - Leli

Dear Leli,

thank you very much for your comment. Yes, it helps. It is almost an
answer. (Only the "likely" would have to be replaced by "secure" to
make it a real answer.)

It is a pity that there is no way to tip commentators.

Thanks! - Buncic

Buncic,

If you would like to compensate Leli for her work, you can ask her to
repost her remarks as the official answer to your question. I very
much doubt that a better answer is forthcoming, since proving that
something does *not* exist is ever so much more difficult than proving
that something does exist.

Best wishes,
pinkfreud-ga, Google Answers Researcher

Dear Leli,

let's do what pinkfreud has proposed. Please post your comment (or
just a link to the comment already existing) as official answer to
this question. I reduced the price by 2$ because 10$ was really what I
wanted to pay for a definite answer. But probably pinkfreud is right
that I will not get that kind of answer anyway. So all the work that
could be done was done by you. Thanks again!

Buncic

Dear Buncic 

Thank-you for your generosity.

It is frustrating not to have a definitive answer to your question.

Just in case someone knows something, I've decided to try sending out
a couple of emails asking if there is any further information to be
had on this. Let's wait a few days to see if there's a response before
I put anything in the answer box.

Thanks again - Leli

Buncic - thank-you so much for the tip and kind feedback.

Good luck with continuing your research - I've seen a couple of other
questions you've asked on GA and it sounds as if you're working on
something very interesting.

Leli