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Q: For Jem (& Scout & Boo): UK Insurances ( Answered 5 out of 5 stars,   3 Comments )
Question  
Subject: For Jem (& Scout & Boo): UK Insurances
Category: Miscellaneous
Asked by: probonopublico-ga
List Price: $10.00
Posted: 12 Sep 2003 11:52 PDT
Expires: 12 Oct 2003 11:52 PDT
Question ID: 255132
I received 2 letters today regarding insurance:

1) On car insurance, where the limit on 3rd Party Claims is now
limited to £20 million. (Yes 20 MILLION POUNDS STERLING, not Turkish.)

2) On a property I own where the Insurer (Independent Insurance
Company) has gone pop.

My question is: Can I insure my insurer?

With regard to: 

(1) I do not anticipate any 3rd Party Claims > £2m but then what
happens if the unimaginable happens? (Apart from Daisy having to
tighten her belt.)

(2) Thank God that I only have to pay a further premium and not to
forego some hefty claim!

I am sure that you, Scout & Boo can produce some enlightenment but
PLEASE do not forget the usual disclaimers.

Many thanks & regards

Bryan

Request for Question Clarification by jem-ga on 13 Sep 2003 00:04 PDT
Morning Bryan :)

I am on the case:) I already have an answer in mind but would like to
check with one or two sources - as its the weekend, this means that I
probably won't be able to get in touch with them until Monday
(possibly Tuesday). Is that okay with you?

Just to confirm your question, you're asking:

1. Can you insure your car insurance insurers/policy? (I'm assuming
this is a domestic policy although the £20 million limit makes me
wonder!) and;
2. Can you insure your property insurance insurers/policy? (Again, I'm
assuming this is a domestic policy).  You state that your property
insurer has gone bust - have I understood this correctly?

Bryan, I haven't had my normal dose of caffeine yet (!) and so was
wondering if you could assist me with some further clarification as
noted below:

With regards to your further references (1) and (2) in your question,
I'm not sure I understand how you want me to tie this information into
the answer. Can you clarify a bit more for me (I just want to make
sure I'm not missing anything important or fundamental to your
concerns).

Kind regards
jem-ga :)

p.s. typical that Boo, Scout and Atticus are unavailable on the
weekend but hey, if anyone deserves a break, they do! ;)

Clarification of Question by probonopublico-ga on 13 Sep 2003 05:07 PDT
Hi, Jem

Please take whatever time you need.

The car is insured for private use and, according to my brokers, all
insurers are now imposing a £20 million limit for 3rd Party claims. It
seems plenty to me but there must be something behind it, would you
think?

The property in question was also insured for domestic occupation and
new insurance has already been put in place, by the property
management company. It's a multiple occupancy building. It means my
having to pay to premium again but this is a small price compared with
those who may not get their claims paid.

so, suppose the unthinkable happens ...

And I get a claim on my car insurance for £30 million ...?

Or the property insurer goes bust after the house has burned down ...?

Highly unlikely (I hope) but just supposing ....

It would be nice to have insured with someone else to cover that
eventuality.

Regards to all your Little Helpers.

Bryan

Request for Question Clarification by jem-ga on 13 Sep 2003 06:17 PDT
Got it Bryan :)  All very clear - many thanks for the clarification.

Have managed to speak with Atticus already (and on a weekend, too!)
and so have one part of my proposed answer confirmed.  I just need to
check one or two other sources of reference in order to
confirm/finalise the rest of the answer.

Kind regards
:) jem-ga

Clarification of Question by probonopublico-ga on 13 Sep 2003 06:43 PDT
We now await your learned response ...

Many thanks.
Answer  
Subject: Re: For Jem (& Scout & Boo): UK Insurances
Answered By: jem-ga on 14 Sep 2003 09:49 PDT
Rated:5 out of 5 stars
 
Hi Bryan :)
 
Regarding your original question, "Can I insure my insurer?" and
having spoken to my various professional contacts (bearing your
provided examples in mind), I can comment as follows;
 
1. if a claim on your car insurance was in excess of the stated policy
limit, you would simply have to bear that excess (or not, as the case
may be!) and;
2. if the insurers who underwrote your house insurance went bust, you
would simply have to find another insurer and take out a new policy. 
Additionally, you could assume that you would not get back any
premiums that you paid to your previous insurer before they went bust!

At present, there are no "payment protection plans" regarding lost
insurance premiums and the best that you could hope for is that a
suitably qualified broker would be able to negotiate a new policy for
you on similar or better terms that your previous policy, taking into
account any history of "no claims", etc. re: your previous policy as
held by the defunct insurers.
 
There are, however, two *potential* options which you could
investigate as a means of "insuring your insurer" BUT they are likely
to be disproportionately expensive in relation to the benefit derived.
 
Option 1
 
You could ask Lloyds of London (or more likely, one of their
syndicates) to underwrite your specific risk for you.  For example,
you could specify that you want a contract stipulating that they will
underwrite any losses over and above the £20 million policy limit that
you have on your car insurance.  Similarly, you could ask them to
underwrite any risk pertaining to the event of your insurer's
bankruptcy.
 
Lloyds are famous for having underwritten all kinds of obscure and
wonderful contracts (think celebrity cases such as famous conductors
insuring their hands or famous actresses insuring their legs and
you're halfway there)!  Have a look at this article:

http://www.bizjournals.com/pacific/stories/1999/06/14/focus2.html?jst=s_rs_hl

and you'll see further examples of the more unusual kinds of insurance
policies (called "surplus lines") that are underwritten.
 
As you can imagine, bespoke policies do not come cheaply and you need
an authorised broker who will handle your business via Lloyds on your
behalf - see:
 
http://www.lloyds.com/index.asp?ItemId=1905

Of course, Lloyd's aren't the only company in the UK underwrite
surplus lines but they are certainly one of the most well-known!  A
quick search on the internet revealed at least 3 UK insurance brokers
who indicated on their websites that they would be willing to discuss
more unusual or bespoke policy requirements.
 
Option 2
 
This is a rather more arcane option and would require you to execute a
fairly complex financial instrument called a credit derivative.  Two
very good, basic definitions of what a credit derivative is can be
found at:
 
http://encarta.msn.com/encnet/features/dictionary/DictionaryResults.aspx?refid=561546766
 
and
 
http://www.investorwords.com/cgi-bin/getword.cgi?1200

What follows is an extremely basic and purely hypothetical example of
this concept:

Using the example of insuring excess risk, you would go to an
investment bank that employs lots of clever people and ask them to
create an asset which utilises your insurance policy with your insurer
as a reference asset (or some similar permutation thereof).  You get
newly created asset ("CA"), investment bank gets periodic payments
from you (and you should assume that these periodic payments would be
very large indeed).  If you subsequently had to deal with a claim in
excess of your £20 million limit, you would return the CA to the bank
and they would pay you the "value" of the CA which would hopefully
cover your excess.

I hope that you find this information useful and interesting - more
importantly, I hope you never have to act upon it! ;)

Kind regards
jem-ga :)

p.s. Ran in the Flora 5K (Hyde Park) today - you see, I stay on my
toes in more ways then one!

Search strategy:

1. Lloyds +of London:

://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=utf-8&q=Lloyds+%2Bof+London&btnG=Google+Search

2. what is a credit derivative?:

://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&q=what+is+a+credit+derivative?

3. unusual insurance; unusual insurance UK

://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&q=unusual+insurance

4. Conversation with professional contact who is a
reinsurance/insurance intermediary in the UK

5. Conversation with professional contact who is a finance expert in
the derivatives market (both UK and overseas)
probonopublico-ga rated this answer:5 out of 5 stars and gave an additional tip of: $10.00
Hi, Jem

Brilliant, as usual ... even though it was a pretty tough assignment.

I don't think that I will be pursuing the options that you have
outlined, even though it's nice to know the possibilities.

I thought it was you that I saw in Hyde Park today but I was too shy
to say 'Hello' ... I was the good-looking young man that you kept
eyeing up.

Perhaps next time?

Kindest regards

Bryan

Comments  
Subject: Re: For Jem (& Scout & Boo): UK Insurances
From: boquinha-ga on 12 Sep 2003 12:23 PDT
 
What about Atticus? ;)
Subject: Re: For Jem (& Scout & Boo): UK Insurances
From: probonopublico-ga on 12 Sep 2003 14:11 PDT
 
Oops!

Thanks Boquinha ... I didn't know how to spell Atikus ...

Yes, indeedy, AND Atikus.
Subject: Re: For Jem (& Scout & Boo): UK Insurances
From: jem-ga on 15 Sep 2003 00:12 PDT
 
Hi Bryan

Gracious, as ever :) Many thanks for the kind words and generous tip.

Oh, was that YOU I saw at Hyde Park yesterday - those bottles of water
that you had by your side looked mighty appealing as I crossed the
finish line ;)

Kindest regards
jem-ga :)

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