Normally if you go to Google (or another search engine like Teoma)
there is a blinking cursor in the edit box. You can type and hit
return. You DO NOT have to click in the edit box first.
If I have Zone Alarm on (Paid Zone Alarm Pro version 3 with no decimal
point, herafter ZA) then when I go to Google (or Teoma, etc) there is
no blinking cursor in the edit box and I have to FIRST click in the
box before I can type there.
I have confirmed that this is true by repeatedly switching back and
forth and getting consistent results.
Is there a way to resolve this and use ZA and not have to click in the
edit box?
Other information:
-XP Pro, Norton Antivirus 2002.
-I have made ZA permission for Google site as permissive as possible.
-If you click "source" to see HTML code at Googel, you can see "pop up
blocker" is present at the top of the code if ZA is on and that it is
not if ZA is not on. However, I cannot decipher (let alone edit) the
code.
-I have taken following steps with no luck:
-Google says it's a browser issua and can't help.
-Microsoft has no info I could find on site, and won't support my IE6
since it's from Dell.
-Dell says it's not broken; and they can't fix it. They suggested
resetting everything to default, but I've since found that ZA is the
specific issue.
-My IE6 setting for "privacy" is "medium high" and I've left ZA mostly
at default settings, except for allowing more permissions to Google.
-I have tried the Zone Alarm site and found nothing. I've send an
email after suffering through their "artificial intelligence"
automated help, but have not yet heard back.
A successful answer will give me specific (and fully reversible if
things go wrong) steps to take to resolve this. Please do not post a
reply that substantiall says "update to a newer version of ZA" or
"reset everything on your computer to the way it was when you got it."
Thanks for your help!
DCP |
Request for Question Clarification by
mvguy-ga
on
23 Sep 2003 09:38 PDT
Have you tried this with another browser such as Opera or Mozilla? No,
I'm not suggesting you switch browsers to avoid the problem. But your
results might tell us whether this is a browser-specific issue or
something else.
|
Clarification of Question by
dcp10-ga
on
23 Sep 2003 12:02 PDT
Thanks for the idea. I have not tried with another browser and
unfortunately do not have ready access to another browser (imagine
Bill's surprise) and I am loath to install more software than
absoultely needed, since something always messes something else up.
I can tell you that some sites (e.g. NASDAQ)work the same w/ ZA on or
off--if I go to NASDAQ.com, i DO have blinking cursor in the default
box.
Oh yeah, one other thing, I HAVE enabled "snap to" in my mouse
settings so the mouse should snap to default dialog box on web pages.
I have tried different mouse. And I have updated mouse drivers.
Thanks for working on it.
DCP10
|
Clarification of Question by
dcp10-ga
on
23 Sep 2003 12:57 PDT
One other clarification. When Google told me it was "a browser
problem," I had not yet discovered that Zone Alarm could toggle the
issue on and off. So Google did not know that either when they gave
that reply.
|
Request for Question Clarification by
aht-ga
on
23 Sep 2003 15:51 PDT
dcp10-ga:
Without getting too deep into the details, the way that the Google
default home page works (and similar, the way that may search engine
pages work) is that a script is explicitly run to give the search-term
input box the focus after the page loads. This is partly because
different browsers will handle the "default" focus differently, and
Google prefers that the focus go to the input box which happens to be
in the middle of the page. Interestingly, the Nasdaq home page does
the exact same thing (ie. uses a VBscript command to give the focus to
the first ticker symbol box). When I block all scripts on either page
(using my local proxy server), indeed neither page places the focus on
the desired input box. Instead, the first object defined on the page
gets the focus.
In your case, your Zone Alarm Pro 3 settings, along with your Internet
Explorer settings, are preventing scripts from running on the Google
home page. Since you already know that turning off Zone Alarm Pro 3
causes the problem to go away, we can pretty much assume that your IE
settings are fine for the express purpose of allowing the focus script
to run.
The most likely source of your problem, therefore, is the "mobile
code" filtering capability in Zone Alarm Pro 3. Can you confirm for me
that, in your Zone Alarm 3 settings, that you have disabled the mobile
code filtering for the Google home page? If you do not know how to
check this, please let me know and I can provide you with instructions
on how to get there.
Regards,
aht-ga
|
Clarification of Question by
dcp10-ga
on
23 Sep 2003 19:20 PDT
aht-
thanks for questions. I can confirm in "privacy" tab of ZA as
follows:
there are 2 sub-tabs. in "main" I have mobile control set to OFF. In
"site list" I can confirm that google specifically is NOT modbile
controlled. I've broken default to mobile control only two sites--New
york times and washington post.
Thanks.
DCP
|
Request for Question Clarification by
aht-ga
on
23 Sep 2003 23:45 PDT
dcp:
Hmm, if the mobile code control setting is OFF (ie. mobile code is
allowed), and if there is a checkmark under the "Mobile Code" heading
for Google on the "Site List" tab, then it would appear that there is
a conflict in the injected code for ZA's pop-up blocker, and the code
used by Google to give the focus to the input box.
Can you look at the source for the Google home page (with ZA enabled),
and look for the following script:
<script>
document.f.q.focus();
</script>
You should find this shortly after the <body ...> tag. Please let me
know what precedes it, and what follows it (perhaps best to just cut
and paste that section of the source file). There may be a "bug" in
the code that ZA injects in order to block pop-ups, that may be
interfering with Google's script.
As well, if it isn't too long, also try to copy and paste the injected
pop-up blocker code.
Thanks,
aht-ga
|
Clarification of Question by
dcp10-ga
on
24 Sep 2003 06:42 PDT
aht-
I suspect you may be on to something, tho as I noted, I'm not able to
decipher, let alone edit, the html code. But here you go:
I've pasted in below both what i get if i click View/Source at Google
home page with ZA BOTH on and off. The ON code is listed first, then
the off code is further below. If ZA is on I get:
----------
<!-- BEGIN Popup Blocker -->
<script language='javascript'>
NS_ActualOpen=window.open;
function NS_NullWindow(){this.window;}
function NS_NewOpen(url,nam,atr){return(new NS_NullWindow());}
window.open=NS_NewOpen;
</script>
<!-- END Popup Blocker -->
<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html;
charset=UTF-8"><title>Google</title><style><!--
body,td,a,p,.h{font-family:arial,sans-serif;}
.h{font-size: 20px;}
.q{text-decoration:none; color:#0000cc;}
//-->
</style>
<script>
<!--
function sf(){document.f.q.focus();}
function c(p,l,e){var f=document.f;if (f.action &&
document.getElementById) {var hf=document.getElementById("hf");if (hf)
{var t = "<input type=hidden name=tab
value="+l+">";hf.innerHTML=t;}f.action =
'http://'+p;e.cancelBubble=true;f.submit();return false;}return true;}
// -->
</script>
</head><body bgcolor=#ffffff text=#000000 link=#0000cc vlink=#551a8b
alink=#ff0000 ><center><table border=0 cellspacing=0
cellpadding=0><tr><td><img src="/images/logo.gif" width=276 height=110
alt="Google"></td></tr></table><br>
<table border=0 cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0><tr><td
width=15> </td><td id=0 bgcolor=#3366cc align=center width=95
nowrap><font color=#ffffff size=-1><b>Web</b></font></td><td
width=15> </td><td id=1 bgcolor=#efefef align=center width=95
nowrap onClick="return c('www.google.com/imghp','wi',event);"
style=cursor:pointer;cursor:hand;><a id=1a class=q
href="/imghp?hl=en&tab=wi&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8" onClick="return
c('www.google.com/imghp','wi',event);"><font
size=-1>Images</font></a></td><td width=15> </td><td id=2
bgcolor=#efefef align=center width=95 nowrap onClick="return
c('www.google.com/grphp','wg',event);"
style=cursor:pointer;cursor:hand;><a id=2a class=q
href="/grphp?hl=en&tab=wg&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8" onClick="return
c('www.google.com/grphp','wg',event);"><font
size=-1>Groups</font></a></td><td width=15> </td><td id=3
bgcolor=#efefef align=center width=95 nowrap onClick="return
c('www.google.com/dirhp','wd',event);"
style=cursor:pointer;cursor:hand;><a id=3a class=q
href="/dirhp?hl=en&tab=wd&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8" onClick="return
c('www.google.com/dirhp','wd',event);"><font
size=-1>Directory</font></a></td><td width=15> </td><td id=4
bgcolor=#efefef align=center width=95 nowrap onClick="return
c('www.google.com/nwshp','wn',event);"
style=cursor:pointer;cursor:hand;><a id=4a class=q
href="/nwshp?hl=en&tab=wn&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8" onClick="return
c('www.google.com/nwshp','wn',event);"><font
size=-1>News</font></a></td><td width=15> </td></tr><tr><td
colspan=12 bgcolor=#3366cc><img width=1 height=1
alt=""></td></tr></table><br><form action="/search" name=f><table
cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0><tr><td width=75> </td><td
align=center><input type=hidden name=hl value=en><span
id=hf></span><input type=hidden name=ie value="UTF-8"><input
type=hidden name=oe value="UTF-8"><input maxLength=256 size=55 name=q
value=""><br><input type=submit value="Google Search" name=btnG><input
type=submit value="I'm Feeling Lucky" name=btnI></td><td valign=top
nowrap><font size=-2> • <a
href=/advanced_search?hl=en>Advanced Search</a><br> • <a
href=/preferences?hl=en>Preferences</a><br> • <a
href=/language_tools?hl=en>Language
Tools</a></font></td></tr></table></form><br><p><br><font size=-1><a
href="/ads/">Advertise with Us</a> - <a
href="/services/">Business Solutions</a> - <a
href="/options/">Services & Tools</a> - <a
href=/about.html>Jobs, Press, & Help</a><span id=hp
style="behavior:url(#default#homepage)"></span>
<script>
//<!--
if (!hp.isHomePage('://www.google.com/')) {document.write("<p><a
href=\"/mgyhp.html\"
onClick=\"style.behavior='url(#default#homepage)';setHomePage('://www.google.com/');\">Make
Google Your Homepage!</a>");}
//-->
</script></font><p><font size=-2>©2003 Google - Searching
3,307,998,701 web pages</font></p></center></body><script>
window.open=NS_ActualOpen; </script>
</html>
---------------------------
Then if i turn ZA off and return to the page I get:
---------------------------------------------
<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html;
charset=UTF-8"><title>Google</title><style><!--
body,td,a,p,.h{font-family:arial,sans-serif;}
.h{font-size: 20px;}
.q{text-decoration:none; color:#0000cc;}
//-->
</style>
<script>
<!--
function sf(){document.f.q.focus();}
function c(p,l,e){var f=document.f;if (f.action &&
document.getElementById) {var hf=document.getElementById("hf");if (hf)
{var t = "<input type=hidden name=tab
value="+l+">";hf.innerHTML=t;}f.action =
'http://'+p;e.cancelBubble=true;f.submit();return false;}return true;}
// -->
</script>
</head><body bgcolor=#ffffff text=#000000 link=#0000cc vlink=#551a8b
alink=#ff0000 onLoad=sf()><center><table border=0 cellspacing=0
cellpadding=0><tr><td><img src="/images/logo.gif" width=276 height=110
alt="Google"></td></tr></table><br>
<table border=0 cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0><tr><td
width=15> </td><td id=0 bgcolor=#3366cc align=center width=95
nowrap><font color=#ffffff size=-1><b>Web</b></font></td><td
width=15> </td><td id=1 bgcolor=#efefef align=center width=95
nowrap onClick="return c('www.google.com/imghp','wi',event);"
style=cursor:pointer;cursor:hand;><a id=1a class=q
href="/imghp?hl=en&tab=wi&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8" onClick="return
c('www.google.com/imghp','wi',event);"><font
size=-1>Images</font></a></td><td width=15> </td><td id=2
bgcolor=#efefef align=center width=95 nowrap onClick="return
c('www.google.com/grphp','wg',event);"
style=cursor:pointer;cursor:hand;><a id=2a class=q
href="/grphp?hl=en&tab=wg&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8" onClick="return
c('www.google.com/grphp','wg',event);"><font
size=-1>Groups</font></a></td><td width=15> </td><td id=3
bgcolor=#efefef align=center width=95 nowrap onClick="return
c('www.google.com/dirhp','wd',event);"
style=cursor:pointer;cursor:hand;><a id=3a class=q
href="/dirhp?hl=en&tab=wd&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8" onClick="return
c('www.google.com/dirhp','wd',event);"><font
size=-1>Directory</font></a></td><td width=15> </td><td id=4
bgcolor=#efefef align=center width=95 nowrap onClick="return
c('www.google.com/nwshp','wn',event);"
style=cursor:pointer;cursor:hand;><a id=4a class=q
href="/nwshp?hl=en&tab=wn&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8" onClick="return
c('www.google.com/nwshp','wn',event);"><font
size=-1>News</font></a></td><td width=15> </td></tr><tr><td
colspan=12 bgcolor=#3366cc><img width=1 height=1
alt=""></td></tr></table><br><form action="/search" name=f><table
cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0><tr><td width=75> </td><td
align=center><input type=hidden name=hl value=en><span
id=hf></span><input type=hidden name=ie value="UTF-8"><input
type=hidden name=oe value="UTF-8"><input maxLength=256 size=55 name=q
value=""><br><input type=submit value="Google Search" name=btnG><input
type=submit value="I'm Feeling Lucky" name=btnI></td><td valign=top
nowrap><font size=-2> • <a
href=/advanced_search?hl=en>Advanced Search</a><br> • <a
href=/preferences?hl=en>Preferences</a><br> • <a
href=/language_tools?hl=en>Language
Tools</a></font></td></tr></table></form><br><p><br><font size=-1><a
href="/ads/">Advertise with Us</a> - <a
href="/services/">Business Solutions</a> - <a
href="/options/">Services & Tools</a> - <a
href=/about.html>Jobs, Press, & Help</a><span id=hp
style="behavior:url(#default#homepage)"></span>
<script>
//<!--
if (!hp.isHomePage('://www.google.com/')) {document.write("<p><a
href=\"/mgyhp.html\"
onClick=\"style.behavior='url(#default#homepage)';setHomePage('://www.google.com/');\">Make
Google Your Homepage!</a>");}
//-->
</script></font><p><font size=-2>©2003 Google - Searching
3,307,998,701 web pages</font></p></center></body></html>
-----------
Thanks.
DCP
|
Clarification of Question by
dcp10-ga
on
24 Sep 2003 06:55 PDT
aht-
inspired by your line of thought, i diabled all "ad blocking" in ZA
and the cursor function works normally. I further experimented with
the three options of blocking (banner ads, pop ups, and animation) and
determined that it is the "pop up" block that disables the cursor in
edit box at Google home page.
Now, the question is, is this fixable so I can keep the full function
of ZA and have the cursor? Now that we've narrowed this so
specifically, I guess if this is a known bug in ZA that was fixed, I
guess I'd consider patch or upgrade, tho my fear is then something
else won't work quite right.
If there is another way you can suggest, I'd consider that.
I'll try surfing w/ pop-ups allowed and see if I can stand it; not
sure which is lesser evil until I try for a while.
|
Clarification of Question by
dcp10-ga
on
24 Sep 2003 07:10 PDT
aht-
OK, maybe we can solve this. But I still need help to do it. ZA
appears to allow me to ALLOW all ads on Google specificly, while
continuing to block them at other sites. At least that is how I
interpret the "main" and "site" tabs.
SO, I have UNCHECKED all ad blocking for Google (highlight a site and
right click, then choose options, then use relevant tab) while leaving
ad blocking ON for "main" tab.
However, I still get the "pop up blocker" html code at google when I
look at the source code, even after doing this. (I shut ZA down and
restarted w/ no change in effect. I have not re-booted.)
Maybe I'm missing something simple? in the ZA customization that will
lick this, but I'm not sure what.
Thanks to you, we at least understand where the problem is, for which
i'm most grateful. STill hoping we can solve it entirely w/ your
help.
Thanks aht!
DCP
|
Clarification of Question by
dcp10-ga
on
24 Sep 2003 09:35 PDT
I have just gotten return email from Zone Alarm which has lots of
general suggestions and nothing specific about this issue which I
emailed them about.
I'd be happy to cut/paste/post if researchers want to see it.
It does mention enabling "show privacy advisor" on a site to allow
editing of that site specifically, and says this will be evidenced by
"privacy settings have affected this site" message when you go there.
I get this message at New Yort times and several other sites I've
adjusted on a site-specific basis, but not at Google, whether I check
or uncheck the "show privacy advisor."
I continue to find the pop-up blocker html shows at google if it is ON
is "main" tab, regardless of what I've tried in Googel site specific
tab.
DCP
|
Request for Question Clarification by
aht-ga
on
24 Sep 2003 09:58 PDT
dcp10-ga:
The reason I love helping others as a Google Researcher, is because I
learn something new every day as a result!
The lesson I learned today is that the Google.com home page is coded
differently from the Google Canada home page (which is the "default"
home page for me).
The Google Canada home page (://www.google.ca) uses the
<script>
document.f.q.focus();
</script>
method that I mentioned above to assign the focus to the query input
box. This method works regardless of the pop-up blocker, as it is
in-line code.
The Google.com home page, on the other hand, uses the "OnLoad"
property of the <body> definition to run the self-defined "sf()"
function. This function, which you will find near the top of the HTML
code, simply executes the same command as the in-line code on the
Google Canada page.
The difference is that the privacy/pop-up blocker in ZA blanks out
that property in the actual HTML code (look for the <body...> tag in
both versions you posted, you will see blank space in the "enabled
blocking" version where the 'OnLoad=sf()' property should be). The
reason it does this is because the 'OnLoad' property is often used to
trigger pop-up ads.
So, a likely solution for the specific case of Google, is for you to
switch from using Google.com, to using Google.ca! That isn't the
solution you are looking for, though, is it?
So looking again at ZA, please do the following:
1. Enable the pop-up blocker in the main tab of ZA.
2. Go to ://www.google.com in Internet Explorer.
3. Go to the site list tab in ZA, and locate www.google.com on the
list.
4. Highlight the entry, and click the Options button.
5. Go to the Ad blocking tab, and uncheck all Ad types, and click
Apply.
Now...
6. Go to some other page, like http://www.microsoft.com .
7. Go to Internet Explorer's Tools>Internet Options dialog, and Delete
Files... from the cache.
8. Navigate to ://www.google.com and observe the behaviour after
it loads.
Let me know if this helps solve your problem, and if so, whether it is
an acceptable answer so that I can post it as the official Answer (I
prefer not to post computer-problem solutions as an Answer right away,
simply because until we solve the problem, there's no guarantee that I
*can* solve it for you).
Regards,
aht-ga
|
Clarification of Question by
dcp10-ga
on
24 Sep 2003 10:22 PDT
aht-ga-
I think we've solved the specific case, tho not the general case, and
not quite the way you suggest. But almost, and I couldn't have done
it without you, so I'm pleased to pay you for "answer."
FYI, I'd tried the path you suggest most recently (as i had described
above) but found the pop up html was __still present__ at top of
google and couldnl't figure out why. I tried turning off ad-blocking
at other sites and it worked OK but NOT at google. why?
finally I turned off and then on ZA again and noticed I had TWO!!
google sites listed. One listed as "www.google.com" the other as
"google.com" (any idea why? not that it really matters, except it
will happen for other sites too in future)
when I set BOTH to NOT block ads, I got my cursor back, for which I'm
most grateful and happy to pay the $20.
However, I'd still love any thoughts you have on the general
case--e.g. if I go to Teoma I still do NOT have cursor, (unless I go
into ZA and un-block ads for that site specifically.) Do you know any
general case solution?
Do you know if later versions of ZA fix this issue?
Can you "elevate" problem at Google, given your "status" as researcher
and your new knowledge so maybe they can adjust? I will likely only
get "artificial intelligence" agent replies.
In any event, again, I wouldn't have gotten here without you; thanks;
and do post the answer after taking stab at above, if you can.
DCP
|
,
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