I would like detailed information on SF Bay Area Micro-Climates. Specifically, 
I would like a map detailed down to neighborhood level showing how sunny/foggy 
and warm/cold the neighborhoods are on average.

A map just covering East Bay Neighborhoods would be ok, if there isn't one 
covering the entire Bay Area.

The context of this is that we are looking for a new house in the Bay Area, 
probably in the East Bay, and we hate fog but want to live on the Bay side of 
the Hills. All I've been able to find on the net is city level info, which 
isn't detailed enough.

---

Request for Question Clarification by jessamyn-ga on 16 May 2002 16:19 PDT

hey there geodog, 

would a pointer to an offline reference [i.e. a PhD thesis at UCB if
it was on-topic] be acceptable?

jessamyn-ga

Hi Geodog, 
 
Weather is an important factor in buying a house in the Bay Area.  Known for  
its temperamental microclimates, neighborhoods less than a mile apart can  
either be sunny or foggy depending on the weather pattern and season.  
 
Your best bet is to ask your real estate agent about the temperatures and  
weather patterns in the desired location.  Since they are familiar with the  
location, they should have a clear idea on the temperatures for the area. No  
available information, in regards to neighborhood maps, exists online.   
 
There are several neighborhood indexes where you can enter the zip code and  
find out the average temperature highs and lows, precipitation, and air  
quality.  A reasonable hypothesis could be inferred from there.  Some good  
sites to check out are: 
 
Bayinsider.com 
Location climates 
&lt;a href=&quot;<a href="http://www.bayinsider.com/shared/homes/stats/environ_climate/index.html">http://www.bayinsider.com/shared/homes/stats/environ_climate/index.html</a>&quot;&gt;<a href="http://www.bayinsider.com/shared/homes/stats/environ_climate/index.html">http://www.bayinsider.com/shared/homes/stats/environ_climate/index.html</a>&lt;/a&gt; 
 
Yahoo! Real Estate 
Find Neighborhood Information 
&lt;a href=&quot;<a href="http://list.realestate.yahoo.com/realestate/neighborhood/main.html">http://list.realestate.yahoo.com/realestate/neighborhood/main.html</a>&quot;&gt;<a href="http://list.realestate.yahoo.com/realestate/neighborhood/main.html">http://list.realestate.yahoo.com/realestate/neighborhood/main.html</a>&lt;/a&gt; 
 
Search Terms Used: 
 
san francisco weather 
&lt;a href=&quot;<a href="://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&amp;amp;q=san+francisco+weather">://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&amp;amp;q=san+francisco+weather</a>&quot;&gt;<a href="://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&amp;amp;q=san+francisco+weather">://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&amp;amp;q=san+francisco+weather</a>&lt;/a&gt; 
 
san francisco neighborhood weather 
&lt;a href=&quot;<a href="://www.google.com/search?">://www.google.com/search?</a>&quot;&gt;<a href="://www.google.com/search?">://www.google.com/search?</a>&lt;/a&gt; 
sourceid=navclient&amp;amp;querytime=lMvYjB&amp;amp;q=san+francisco+neighborhood+weather 
 
Regards, 
 
Trailhead  

---

Request for Answer Clarification by geodog-ga on 22 Apr 2002 21:31 PDT

Hi Trailhead, 
 
Thanks for the post, but you didn't actually answer the question, other than  
saying that no such info is available. 
 
I was hoping that somewhere on some academic server resided some climatology  
grad student's project or dissertation, with a map of microclimates. That is  
what I am trying this service to find - something like that. 
 
I have found similar information to what you provided, simply by searching for  
SF BAY AREA MICROCLIMATES using google. The best I found was  
&lt;a href=&quot;<a href="http://ggweather.com/climate/">http://ggweather.com/climate/</a>&quot;&gt;<a href="http://ggweather.com/climate/">http://ggweather.com/climate/</a>&lt;/a&gt;, which actually has records broken down by month,  
which is much more helpful than biannual data like Jan and July temps. 
 
Thanks, 
Geodog 
 
P.S. Real Estate agents don't help much if you are just renting.  

---

Clarification of Answer by trailhead-ga on 24 Apr 2002 16:43 PDT

Hi Geodog, 
 
I looked for more granular studies on neighborhoods and climate, but could only  
find the following site: 
 
National Weather Service Forecast Office 
Climatological Studies 
&lt;a href=&quot;<a href="http://www.wrh.noaa.gov/Monterey/climate.html">http://www.wrh.noaa.gov/Monterey/climate.html</a>&quot;&gt;<a href="http://www.wrh.noaa.gov/Monterey/climate.html">http://www.wrh.noaa.gov/Monterey/climate.html</a>&lt;/a&gt; 
 
It includes climatological data for precipitation and climate tables for the  
Bay Area and San Francisco.  Unfortunately, the readings are only by city and a  
scale for neighborhood granularity isn't available.  
 
Good luck on your search, 
 
Trailhead  

---

Clarification of Answer by trailhead-ga on 26 Apr 2002 15:18 PDT

Geodog, 
 
The following is a link if you are asking for a refund to your
question.  Please fill out the form and Google will gladly heed your
request.
 
Request for Refund 
&lt;a href=&quot;<a href="https://answers.google.com/answers/main?cmd=refundrequest">https://answers.google.com/answers/main?cmd=refundrequest</a>&quot;&gt;<a href="https://answers.google.com/answers/main?cmd=refundrequest">https://answers.google.com/answers/main?cmd=refundrequest</a>&lt;/a&gt; 
 
Thanks again for using Google Answers, 
 
Trailhead  

Already posted this:

Trailhead-ga wrote a pleasant and informative essay, but he didn't answer my 
question - I asked for something specific, where to find a neighborhood map, 
and he told me "No available information, in regards to neighborhood maps, 
exists online".

The fact that he couldn't find the information isn't worth $5. I want a refund, 
please. He should have claimed the question if he didn't know the answer.

Thanks,
GeoDog

Trailhead-ga wrote a pleasant and informative essay, but he didn't answer my 
question - I asked for something specific, where to find a neighborhood map, 
and he told me "No available information, in regards to neighborhood maps, 
exists online".

The fact that he couldn't find the information isn't worth $5. I want a refund, 
please. He should have claimed the question if he didn't know the answer.

Thanks,
GeoDog

First I will give  a common sense answer on the fog question and then
  sketch a more technical response.

  1) There are three mountain ranges, as seen on this DEM map of CA

  http://wwwflag.wr.usgs.gov/USGSFlag/Data/maps/CaliforniaDEM.html

  Counting from the shore, the first is on the Peninsula, the second and third
are on
  the East Bay as seen in more detail on
  http://home.attbi.com/~snarayan/wxpls.html this map of the Bay Area.

  Fog enters through the Golden Gate and fills the valley between the first and
  second range to a certain height.

  So the first rule to avoid the fog is
  "rent a house on the bay side of the second range as close to the crest as
possible"

 Moving along the crest from Berkeley South you get less and less fog.
 On  Grizzly Peak road (http://www.pashnit.com/roads/cal/GrizzlyPeak.htm) 
in the Berkeley area, the fog reaches crest in 20-30 days between September 
 and the end of May, and 2 out of 3 days in summer.
 In San Leandro area about 2 to 5 days a year.
 (This based on informal observation of a person who commutes to work along the
skyline).

 So- the second rule to avoid the fog, 
  move away from the Golden Gate, South, along the crest as far as practical.



 At this house  on the crest in San Leandro hills
 (which BTW will be available for long term lease starting this July)
 you get fog less then 6 days a year, but you get breeze to  windy from time to
time. 

 2) Scientific answer: First we  have to define fog and look for available data. 

   Low-lying clouds may became fog - depending on the point of view and weather
pattern.
   In Bay Area, most fog comes from the ocean, but sometimes low lying clouds
descend on
   the hills and become fog. Some areas (mostly in Berkeley hills) get both
kinds of fog.
   

   So - 'scientifically' - we can measure visibility,
   that is optical density of atmosphere as function of three space coordinates
  (that is latitude, longitude and elevation) and time.

   Some data can be obtained from the satellite imagery 
   http://clipper.coastweather.com/CWNCAwx.html which is archived in detail,
however
    is dominated by high elevation cloudiness.

   To measure visibility at  low elevations , one can search archives of live
   web-cams on the east bay, looking at the peninsula, such as
   one at Cal State Hayward and Lawrence Hall of Science etc
  
http://drala.mcs.csuhayward.edu/cgi-bin/recentevents  view from Cal State
Hayward web-cam
http://sv.berkeley.edu/view/">http://sv.berkeley.edu/view/
http://www.rahul.net/kpapai/images/KPIXcam29.html
...

       Then one could construct a model which will consider line of sight and
the aforementioned
       optical density distribution and .. and so on..

 As for micro-climate data, precipitation (rain, temperature ..) these are
available on daily
or even hourly basis at several weather station scattered through the area, such
as

 http://www.weather.com/weather/hourbyhour/94578  (by zip code - here 94578=
Castro Valley

addendum: The last link on  on the previous comment is no longer valid - sorry
about that
 The modified link http://www.weather.com/weather/local/94578 exists, but gives
local
weather only for sommunities.

 the list of local stations is e.g. at
http://www.wrh.noaa.gov/Monterey/climate.html

The list of  web-cams in Bay  Area are is e.g. here:
http://www.bayinsider.com/autos/traffic/livecams/index.html

Thanks for all the information, hedgie-ga. The rule of thumb, higher and 
further south is useful, although I wonder how far north of Berkeley you have 
to go before the fog starts to diminish?

Where can I find info on that house for lease? :-) Was there supposed to be a 
URL for it?

Thanks,
Geodog

Dear questioner,
                     I thought you were a bit hard on the researcher who had a 
very difficult task otherwise one as obviously experienced as you would not 
have sought his or her help. For the lousy five dolars you thought the  
resaerch  was worth I think you more than got your money's worth. Perhaps if 
you had  nominated $25 as the value of the info you seek and then got same 
answer you  would be justified in asking for a refund. Otherwise you  come 
across as  unreasonable and petty.

I thought it was reasonable to ask for a refund, for exactly the reasons given.
 It's not petty to expect an answer.

Thank you both for your comments.

I tried not to be petty - I pointed out that trailhead's msg was informative 
and well written.

The question may very well be worth more than $5 - I was just trying this 
service out, and it was a question that has been bugging me for a while, and I 
thought someone might have the answer. I just don't think it is fair for 
someone to claim the question and the $$$ if they don't have the answer.

Thanks,
GeoDog

Where can I find info on that house for lease? :-) Was there supposed
to be a
  URL for it? 
   
I felt that google rules  forbid  identifiable info, so I did not put
any URL there.
 However, since you asked about rentals, I can tell you that
two sites:
http://list.realestate.yahoo.com/re/renting/
http://www.ehousing.com/  

are good for:

Rentals and shared housing for Berkeley, Oakland, Emeryville, Albany,
Piedmont, Richmond, El Cerrito, Orinda, Kensington, Alameda, and other
cities in the SFBA
 

and the 4Br house I mentioned as an illustration will be listed there,
in few
days, under San Leandro (that includes the hills between SL and Castro
Valley
which are really unincorporated part of the Alameda county) with
keywords: View, NoFog ...
   These ^ sites are good for preview of rental costs, which (unless
you are moving from Manhattan) tend to shock newcommers (but that's
another question.
 ~ $10??)

Question of moving North of Berkeley is interesting, but I wonder if
you looked
at the map, e.g. 
http://www.anywho.com/cgi-bin/mqinterconnect?screen=map&&city=San%20Leandro&lat=377250&lng=-1221550&orig_lat=377250&orig_lng=-1221550&orig_name=San%20Leandro&si=2&so=1&ss=1&level=5&event=zoom
You will see the the Bay turns, Richmond (flatland) is dump and the
hills end.

 Also, you need to consider traffic if you have a commute -
 You may learn to hate it more that the fog :-)
 Answwer to that BIG question  depends on  location of
the workplace and availability of the flextime...

Here's a book that may provide the answers:

Weather of the San Francisco Bay Region 
(California Natural History Guides, No 63)
by Harold Gilliam

It's not yet published, but the description on the major book-selling
sites sounds promising...

Great find, tomo2. There are used editions of the first edition
available now - I'm going to buy one.
Thanks,
Geodog

San Francisco is broken into 3 zones (sunbelt, transition, and
fogbelt). If you scroll down this link you'll see the map
http://sfwater.org/detail.cfm/MSC_ID/46/MTO_ID/18/MC_ID/10/C_ID/333/holdSession/1

Did anyone ever find a solution to this question? Was the book helpful? Thanks.
G-