Hello. I am planning on selling novelties and humor items on eBay and
my website. I want to make sure none of the items I sell are made in a
sweatshop. I want to sell domestic and foreign items. Here is what I
consider fair labor and sweatshop-free:

-Workers do not work more than 12 hours a day.
-Workers are reasonably treated with respect and dignity.
-There is a safe and sanitary working environment. Minimization of
fire hazards by smoke detectors and fire exits.
-The factory pays the workers the country's minimum wage or more.
-Workers can organize peacefully (although unionization is not necessary).

How do I legally determine that a supplier does not use sweatshops to
produce their item? Is asking a supplier to sign a contract "under
penalty of perjury" a way to ensure they are sweatshop-free? How does
this work in foreign countries? I know nothing about legal matters and
contracts. Other than visiting the factory, there has to be a way to
prove this. Lack of labeling unlike in organic foods and nutritional
information is disconcerting here.

I researched the Fair Trade Federation site and they give links to
artisan sites. I do not want to sell artisan items because I have
little interest in them. I know companies like Nosweat and American
Apparel also make sweatshop-free clothes but I am not interested in
their products for my business. I have suppliers lined up and I'd like
to sell billy-bob pacifiers, bumper stickers, funny doormats from High
Cotton, Fetch Art dog lips toy, glitter toilet seats, funny license
plate frames, Groovy painted keys, etc. Many of these items are
plastic and I am concerned they are made in sweatshops. I will email
the supplier but how can I ensure they are telling me the truth when
they say an item is sweatshop-free? Major companies like Walmart and
Nike have denied the use of sweatshops until they were caught.

I know handmade or second hand items are sweatshop-free. I have one
supplier who makes signs on his own. But many of the items I want are
plastic and manufactured by companies. Some people tell me just to buy
items from the US or Canada and other countries where fair labor is
enforced. I have two qualms about this. For one, this is
discrimination. People in India and China and other poor countries
need jobs. Plus I read right here on Google Answers that there are
sweatshops in the US that exploit immigrants, especially in the
garment industry.

Thank you for your research. This may sound extreme but I can not in
good conscience promote items made by underpaid abused workers even if
this exploitation is hidden from public view.

Karen "rache-ga"

PS. I know I am asking this question in the middle of the night. But
take as much time as you need to look into this question. There is no
rush.

---

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 16 Dec 2003 17:59 PST

Hello rache-ga,

Thank you, thank you, thank you, for asking such a meaningful
question.  If more merchants would take the steps you are trying to
take, I really believe the world would change in a big, positive way.

I'm already pretty knowledgable about this whole area, having worked
on sweatshop issues in the past, and I've been researching your
question for the past few hours.  Short answer to "How can I guarantee
sweatshop-free conditions" is (I'm sorry!)... "You can't".

There ARE some steps you can take to minimize the likelihood of
sourcing from sweatshops, and to use relevant language in contracts,
educate yourself on the issues, affiliate with similarly-minded
organizations, etc.  These are all positive steps, and they CAN make a
difference.

If you want, I can provide this sort of information as an answer to
your question.

But I can't -- and I don't think anyone can -- provide a guarantee
about being able to source sweatshop-free goods.  There simply isn't
the international infrastructure in place yet for that.  But with more
merchants taking a stance like yours, I believe there soon will be.

Here's to a better world in the new year.  I look forward to hearing from you.

pafalafa-ga

---

Clarification of Question by rache-ga on 17 Dec 2003 06:55 PST

Yes then, please tell me how I can minimize the likelihood of an item
coming from a sweatshop. I realize there are no guarantees in life. I
would like to deal with mainly US, Canadian, and UK based companies
who may or may not have factories overseas and ask them to sign a
contract stating that they do not use sweatshops. But it is to wonder
if THEY even know if the factory is a sweatshop. I read that Walmart
uses auditors like PricewaterCoopers to make sure their manufacturers
are not sweashops (but this is a PR move). If I hired my own auditors
to go all over the place it would cost a fortune. If I hired locals to
check out a factory would they even be allowed in? This whole task is
daunting. Any advice you to help me buy sweatshop-free will help.

---

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 18 Dec 2003 16:28 PST

Hello again, rache-ga.

Just to let you know, I was working on your question when all of a
sudden a cold snuck up on me an whomped me on the head (and several
other places).

If no one else tackles this question, then I'll get back to it in just
a day or two, when I'm back on my feet.

Cheers.

pafalafa-ga

---

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 03 Jan 2004 18:44 PST

Hello rache-ga, and a very happy new year to you.

Between the holidays, other commitments, one party too many and a
miserable, stubborn cold, I've been slow to return to your question. 
But I am focusing on it now, and will give you an answer or an update
in a day or so as I finish my research on it.

Thanks for your patience, and I'll be back to you shortly.  

pafalafa-ga

---

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 05 Jan 2004 10:57 PST

Just a bit of an update...now that folks are generally back from the
holidays, I have a number of communications out asking for more
information from various organizations in the clothing, toy and
novelty businesses.

As I hear back, I will compile the information I've been collecting
into a (hopefully) coherent and useful answer.

Be patient...it's on its way!

---

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 09 Jan 2004 08:41 PST

Hello again, rache-ga.

I'm sorry to have to say that I haven't been able to turn up any
really useful information that would assist you in your worthy
efforts.

The main problems are twofold:

--The first is that the supply chain is probably at least five years
away from having independently certified suppliers that have been
shown to be sweatshop-free.  Some industry sectors are moving in this
direction -- and the basic mechanics are being put into place -- but
no one is quite there yet, and won't be for another few years, at
least.

Some larger merchants -- those that operate on the scale of McDonalds
and WalMart -- may undertake such certification measures on their own,
but that doesn't mean they report to the world about who their
suppiers are, and where they get which products.  This makes it
imipossible for a smaller merchant to take advantage of the existing
certifications.

So...as for now, there does not seem to be any easily-available list
of certified suppliers, other than those of the "Fair Trade" type,
which are not the types of products you are seeking.

--The second problem is the type of goods you're focused on.  The
biggest momentum for certification right now is in the clothing and
toy sectors.  The sort of novelty products that you're interested in
kind of fall between the cracks -- there isn't a novelty-goods trade
association that operates the way clothing or toy trade associations
do, to spearhead the development of "Codes of Conduct" and the like. 
The type of knick-knacks that you want to purchase may well turn out
to be among the last corners of the marketplace to get on the
certification bandwagon.

In the course of my research, I contacted numerous organizations and
merchants, asking for information on policies or lists of suppliers. 
Not one of them responded!

I believe this is an issue who's time will come, but it's obvious it
hasn't quite arrived yet.

So as to not leave you totally discouraged, I thought you might like
to have a look at the Codes of Conduct being put in place in the toy
manufacturing industry.  You can see them here:

----------

http://www.toy-icti.org/publications/bizpractice.htm

Code of Business Practices
Revised June 2001


The International Council of Toy Industries (ICTI), an association of
associations, is committed on behalf of its member companies to the
operation of toy factories in a lawful, safe, and healthful manner. It
upholds the principles that no underage, forced, or prison labor*
should be employed; that no one is denied a job because of gender,
ethnic origin, religion, affiliation or association, and that
factories comply with laws protecting the environment. Supply
agreements with firms manufacturing on behalf of ICTI members must
also provide for adherence to these principles....

----------

You can certainly inquire of your suppliers whether they adhere to
ICTI principles (for toys) or to any similar codes developed for their
particular industry sector.  Merely asking the question is a step in
the right direction, as it sends the message that this is an imporant
consideration for purchasers both large and small.

I wish you all success in your efforts -- both commercial and ethical.
 Hopefully, the next time this topic is revisited here at Google
Answers, it will be possible to provide an answer that is consideraly
more detailed than what can be provided today.

All the best.  

pafalafa-ga

P.S.  Just to be clear, I have posted this information as a comment
rather than an answer; you will not be charged for this.

Hi,

I have to agree with Pafalafa-ga, Karen.

I'm living in Shanghai and have talked to many business people who try
to avoid problems back with with accusation they produce in sweatshops
and you can never be 100 percent sure. Larger manufacturers work often
with thousands of suppliers, who often outsource the work in different
layers. So even when you buy products in the US, where is no guarantee
they could not come somewhere from Asia.
Larger companies do have systems and third-party companies in place to
check out production units locally. In that way you can prove you have
done your best, but the whole auditing process can be rather costly.

Fons

Perjury is the crime of intentionally lying in court, in an affidavit
or government document etc.  You can't make someone sign under penalty
of perjury in a civil contract.  You can make them certify that there
are no sweatshops used, and then (in the case of discovery of the use
of sweatshop labor) go after the supplier for fraud, or build in a
penalty (be sure its not excessive or unconscionable) into the
contract.

pafalafa-ga

I really thank you for the time you put into this answer. People told
me this question is an unanswerable one like "Is there a God?" or "Is
fate predestined?" and now I see how very tough it is. I also put this
question on Askearth and no good answers came. The two answers I paid
for just gave me research about how swaetshops work but no real
answer.

http://askearth.com/go/view_request?request=107804&e=331816

 I have decided I am going to ask manufacturers about working
conditions  and leave it at that even though they could be lying. It
is not feasible to do anything more. I am also dedicating a big
portion of my merchandise to handmade handcrafted items which are
undoubtedly "sweatshop-free."

In doing further research on this topic in Business Ethics books I
read an essay written by Ian Maitland. He says surpirsingly that
sweatshops are a good thing and a necessary part of a global economy.
He explained how activist groups spew out lies and halftruths. Being
vegetarian I can attest many activist groups are full of baloney
especially PETA. Second a lot of sweatshops pay well if you compare
workers' pay to rural workers' pay. According to the "International
Labor Organization" conditions and wages in Export Zones are higher or
equal to conditions outside of the zone. In fact the average worker in
one of Nike's Chinese factories is paid more than a professor at
Beijing University.

Anyone researching sweatshops should see this link:
http://shorl.com/hukostekodufre

It is a pdf. I used "shorl" because the link is so long and I don't
want this post to run off the screen.

Furthermore sweatshop critics' claim that third world countries are
only getting poorer in a race to the bottom is false. Countries like
Taiwan and Korea and Hong Kong rose to success by attracting foreign
investment in manufacturing. Wages may be low now but if we let the
market evolve wages will increase at full employment because of supply
and demand.

Shockingly, protesting sweatshops can be detrimental to the very
people we want to protect. Ifr wages are higher, countries will go
chase cheap labor somewhere else and that country will lose
desperately needed jobs. It is a fact that companies will always chase
cheap labor just as you and me look to get more bang for our buck when
we shop. No moral speaker will change this fact. Minimum wages may
work for the poor in industrialized countries but for thrid world
counties it will do more harm than good.

On the flip side of this is working conditions. Is it right to wait
for the market to clear and full employment to occur in order to put
in place humane decent working conditions? Even when full employment
occurs can workers really CHOOSE a job based on working conditions?
How will they know whether conditions are good or not until something
dangerous happens, right? This is why we have OSHA laws here. In the
United States we believe in human rights and the fact that everyone is
entitled to them.  Some third world countires clearly don't believe in
human rights and even some of the sweatshop workers who work at these
factories would rather have more pay than better conditioons.
Economics tells us everything comes at a cost and there is no free
lunch.

I have read about sweatshop factories in New York and Los Angeles that
exploit immigrants and not only pay measely wages but sometimes don't
pay for weeks. Workers are yelled at and worked to the bone. This is
unacceptable in my view.

So, my conclusion about sweatshops- I don't know. It is a mixed bag.
For one it is essential to have market clearing wages and attract
foreign investment in poor countires. But I certainly can't concede
with the argument that it is better to give people a horrible
life-threatening job than no job at all. I think that argument is
downright ignorant and avoids the problem. We can  put wage aside
since it is impossible to define a "living wage" and many well paid
workers in the US can't make ends meet. If I limited my suppliers to
ones who offer decent working conditions it is nearly as impossible to
define that as well. I believe in US safety standards in the workplace
but so many US companies have trouble complying with this as it is. It
just isn't doable to make distant third world countries comply with
our workplace safety laws.


                          *******************************

I realize you put a lot of time and work into your comment. I would
like to give you a $30  tip. I don't know Google Answers that well. In
the FAQS it said there is a link tpo tip when the researcher gives an
answer. But since you put it under "Comment" there is no link. So how
do I give you a tip??


Thank you for your help,
Karen Closkey
karen@parodyauction.com

Karen,

I'm so glad you posted your comment.  I was afraid we had disappointed
you by not providing an answer to your question, but I do hope there
was some useful information included in the various comments that I
and others posted.

I'll say it again...you seem to be on a worthy journey, and I hope you
find the means for doing good and doing well at the same time.  It may
be the case that "sweatshops" -- as we in the West tend to call them
-- have their place in the world.  But I dearly hope that that place
becomes smaller and smaller and just disappears through efforts of
merchants like yourself, and the millions of other consumers who care
about the state of the world.

Your offer to compensate me is most generous (we researchers sometimes
toil in our own self-made sweatshops!).  But allow me to politely
decline the offer.  I can't even quite articulate my reasons for doing
so, but it's what feels best to me.

So...carry on.  And let us know (by posting a comment of your own)
when you're open for business.

All the best...

paf

"I can't even quite articulate my reasons for doing
so, but it's what feels best to me."

I am not sure what you mean by that. Hmm.  I just think you did a lot
of hard work and you should get compensated. It bugs me when people
offer $2 for a question here and expect an essay answer. That is
downright cheap and stingy.

 I wish I could email people here on Google Answers. When I click on
their name all I get is the questions they answered (if they are a
researcher). According to the rules I am not even allowed to post my
email address here. That is silly. What if people want to contact me
and don't want to publicly post something here? I understand the
question being locked for 12 hours so no one can come along and
answer. But after that people should be able to email researchers and
commenters and askers. The commenters aren't emailed when someone has
a question or comment in reference to their comment. They may never
check the question again and never know about it. Google Answers
should have a mail forwarding thing like eBay.

Please pass this on to whoever is in charge. And thanks for your help and efforts.

Karen Closkey 
karen@parodyauction.com