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Subject:
Famous quote by Ben Franklin
Category: Reference, Education and News > General Reference Asked by: constitutional-ga List Price: $2.00 |
Posted:
10 Feb 2004 13:17 PST
Expires: 11 Mar 2004 13:17 PST Question ID: 305485 |
"Everyone knows" that Ben Franklin said "He who would give up a little liberty in return for a little security deserves neither liberty nor security." (Or variations thereof) It's listed in tens of thousands of places all over the net (although a handful think Thomas Jefferson said it, and one apparently thinks Churchill said it.) Problem is, I can't find one single reference anywhere that states when or where he said it. My simple question: Where is this famous quote of his documented? |
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Subject:
Re: Famous quote by Ben Franklin
Answered By: pinkfreud-ga on 10 Feb 2004 13:53 PST Rated: ![]() |
Having seen the quote virtually everywhere, I researched this on my own several months ago. This was apparently a common saying in the 18th century. I believe Benjamin Franklin was the first author to have published it, although in slightly different words: "AUTHOR: Benjamin Franklin (1706 - 1790) QUOTATION: They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. ATTRIBUTION: Historical Review of Pennsylvania. BIOGRAPHY: Columbia Encyclopedia. Note 1. This sentence was much used in the Revolutionary period. It occurs even so early as November, 1755, in an answer by the Assembly of Pennsylvania to the Governor, and forms the motto of Franklin's 'Historical Review,' 1759, appearing also in the body of the work. - Frothingham: Rise of the Republic of the United States, p. 413." Bartleby.com http://www.bartleby.com/100/245.1.html Google Web Search: "benjamin franklin" + "historical review of pennsylvania" ://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=%22benjamin+franklin%22+%22historical+review+of+pennsylvania%22 I hope this information is useful. If anything is unclear, or if a link doesn't work for you, please request clarification; I'll be glad to offer further assistance before you rate my answer. Best regards, pinkfreud |
constitutional-ga
rated this answer:![]() Thank you SO much! Not only did you satisfy my current interest, you also gave me Bartleby.com which will undoubtably satisfy my various curiosities many times over in the future. |
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Subject:
Re: Famous quote by Ben Franklin
From: slickwilly-ga on 22 Jul 2004 12:54 PDT |
Unfortunately, PinkFreud, your answer is wrong. Franklin isn't proven to have written or said it, and the quotation given by bartleby is wrong. See http://www.thefutureofthebook.com/stories/storyReader$605 |
Subject:
Re: Famous quote by Ben Franklin
From: constitutional-ga on 22 Jul 2004 23:01 PDT |
At least the bartleby link works, as opposed to the one you give. Snide remarks aside, if the quote is unproven to be attributable to Franklin, it follows that it cannot be disproved either. So how do you know that Bartleby's quote is incorrect? |
Subject:
Re: Famous quote by Ben Franklin
From: slickwilly-ga on 23 Jul 2004 04:17 PDT |
1) the URL should have been http://www.futureofthebook.com/stories/storyReader$605 . My apologies. 2) If you read that link, you will see that the quotation, whether by Franklin or not, from the source cited by Bartleby, is NOT the quotation given by Bartleby. |
Subject:
Re: Famous quote by Ben Franklin
From: constitutional-ga on 23 Jul 2004 14:04 PDT |
Now THAT is an interesting read. Thank you. Since Bartleby cites the Historical Review as its source, and since an interested party has supplied a photocopy of the title page of the H.R. showing the actual line, and since that line differs from Bartleby's version, then I agree, the Bartleby version must be incorrect. You should offer your information to them. I also agree with Minsky that the elegance of the version in the H.R. is much more "Franklinesque" than the myriad internet versions out there. He also cedes that "Franklin may well have composed this particular quote" which of course does not imply at all that he coined it. So it could be that it was in fact a concept voiced in many ways by others prior to the publication of the H.R., but Franklin apparently thought the concept worthy of being placed front and center of the H.R., thereby popularizing the phrase. Whether Franklin wrote it, composed it or said it becomes almost secondary to the fact that he published it. As publisher, he well KNEW the phrase was there and that it took center stage on the title page. In modern terms: "I am Ben Franklin, and I approve this message". Thank you very much for adding yet more tangibility to this subject for me. |
Subject:
Re: Famous quote by Ben Franklin
From: slickwilly-ga on 23 Jul 2004 16:27 PDT |
I thought it was very interesting, too. Three clarifications, though. 1) I was undoubtedly too positive in my first comment. For all I know, Franklin's authorship has been positively established by some Franklin scholar, and the findings tucked away in a journal that only Franklin scholars read. The World Wide Web is a mighty tool, but it doesn't contain all of the world's learning. Minsky isn't really a Franklin scholar, but his email suggests further lines of enquiry. 2) If I'm reading Minsky right, the original edition of the Historical Review wasn't attributed to Franklin at all, as publisher or author. It was only the edition released after Franklin's death that identified him (apparently incorrectly) as the author. Franklin's autobiography (chapter 14) says that he was the publisher, but it didn't appear until after his death, either. I really think it is a stretch to say that he held himself out, at the time of the first edition, as approving. 3) Minsky hasn't provided a photocopy of the quote. All you see is a photoshopped image, taken from a scan. For all I know, that image, and most of the rest of what is reproduced there, is an elaborate hoax. If so (and I'm not seriously suggesting that it is), it has successfully hoaxed some members of Congress. See http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?c108:12:./temp/~c108fkbTYN:: (If that cite doesn't work for you, go to http://thomas.loc.gov and search for Franklin Patriot). They add a comma, but otherwise use Minsky's words, not Bartleby's. |
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