Hello Bob:
One of the best things about being a researcher is the variety of
questions asked. Your question asking for a step by step process
sharkskin into shagreen is a good example of the variety of questions
asked.
A first good description is located at primitiveways.com, a very
interesting site that sums up their site by saying:
“The PrimitiveWays website is dedicated to Stone Age technology,
"Friends of Primitive Technology" events, atlatl and darts,
fire-by-friction, bow and arrow, hide tanning, simple kayaks, cordage
and knots, flintknapping, baskets, stone tools, prehistoric knives,
survival skills, ancient and earth skills, wilderness and outdoors
skills, nature awareness, medicinal and edible plants, traditional
skills, archaeology, anthropology, native technology, aboriginal
skills, old ways, artifact replication, workshops and classes, and
more.”
Here is the shagreen process, covered in depth, with many detailed
pictures:
http://www.primitiveways.com/processing_sharkskin.html
“Historically, shark skin has been used as an abrasive and, in Asia,
to decorate sword hilts and sheaths. Dried but untanned skin, called
shagreen, was once used like fine sandpaper for polishing wood.
Shagreen was also used for the membranes on drums in the South
Pacific.”
From : http://freespace.virgin.net/a.data/glossary.htm#Shagreen
Some sites that I found attributed shagreen to the skin of a
different animal, in this case the Ass:
“Originally the skin of the ass (from the Persian "saghari", French
"chagrin"), a leather covered with indentations formed by rubbing
seeds over the moist skin and rubbing them in. Much used for
scabbards. In the late 17thC to early 18thC the term became confused
with fish-skin, shagreen was usually dyed green with a vegetable dye
and used for covering boxes and caskets”
You probably already know about this site:
http://www.shagreen.com/page2.html
This shop in Moisson, France handcrafts shagreen into items similar to
the items made by Jean-Claude Galuchat for Louis XV.
As you probably know there is not a lot on the Internet specifically
describing the process. I hope the first link will help you out.
Sincerely,
Colin
Google search terms used:
process shagreen
Jean-Claude Galuchat
prepare sharkskin |
Request for Answer Clarification by
bfish-ga
on
23 Jun 2002 06:14 PDT
Colin,
Thanks for trying. As you say "there is not a lot on the Internet
specifically
describing the process". I haven't found anything yet. I am quite
familiar with all the links you provided. Primativeways.com describes
how to make sharkskin rawhide, nothing close to shagreen. I have even
asked the author what he knows about shagreen and he is clueless.
Freespace.virgin.net is simply a glossary. And, shagreen.com is
basically a store.
The net is that I am no closer to the answer to my question than when
I posted the question. And, I thought I was quite specific and
included pertinent descriptions. If you want to know more of what I do
about it, I'll be happy to provide what I can. I do appreciate your
effort, but without any progress I can't rate your "answer" at all
because none of the elements of the question were answered.
I'm not exactly a light weight on using the net as a resource. My
failure to find the information brought me to answers.google with a
willingness to pay for the information. If you can find what I want,
I'm still willing to compensate. But, we aren't close yet.
Thanks,
Bob
|
Clarification of Answer by
colin-ga
on
23 Jun 2002 06:23 PDT
Bob:
I certainly appreciate your frustration, as I have searched high and
low for the method. I will do some more searching today. Hopefully I
can get closer to what you need.
It has got to be out there somwhere.
Colin
|
Clarification of Answer by
colin-ga
on
24 Jun 2002 06:03 PDT
Hi Bob:
I am Still looking for more links for you. I offer what I have found.
It would seem that only bits and pieces of the process are available,
and will have to be pieced together, as I still have not found a
detailed explanation of the process for you to duplicate.
http://palimpsest.stanford.edu/byform/mailing-lists/cdl/2001/0513.html
“Shagreen is prepared by scraping, stretching and drying. It is not a
true leather but a rawhide. It is processed into a useable material
by grinding, filing and polishing the surface denticles in order to
flatten their sharp points. The skin may also have been dyed, or
have pearly white denticles interspaced with black varnish. (A
chemical process to decalcify and soften placoid scales for
producing commercially tanned leather did not exist prior to the
1920's). Black filler in-between closely spaced denticles is common,
as are natural, light-coloured skins with ground-down spikes, e.g.,
from the stingray. Copper salts and other dyes were used for
contrasting denticles and skin tones in shades of green, red, brown
and yellow.”
http://palimpsest.stanford.edu/don/dt/dt3058.html
“The leather was dyed from the flesh side so that the dye did not
reach the small circles of calcified substance but only colored the
epidermis where it could be seen between the circles.”
There are places that you can buy partially processed shagreen online:
From: http://www.sea-ex.com/countryinfo/bangladesh.htm
Excel Sea Fish Company Bangladesh
excelseafish@hotmail.com
“We deal in the following products: Sting ray fish skin (Tanning
standard Wet and Salted, and finished leather), snake leather
(finished) Shark's fin and meat. Ready stock in Bangladesh and
Thailand.”
Transtrade Development Co
develop@abnetbd.com
“We are an exporter of stingray fish skin (wet and salted), dry
stingray skin, shark teeth and jaws, fish maws, and frozen sea fish.”
I hope this helps you a little more in this very hard to find topic.
Sincerely,
Colin
Search terms used:
process sharkskin +shagreen
+learn +shagreen process
shark processing factory +skin
|
Request for Answer Clarification by
bfish-ga
on
25 Jun 2002 09:35 PDT
Colin,
I really don't want to discourage you or seem unappreciative. But, we
seem to be running the same traps. I have been to the URLs you have
offered, and as you have discovered, some offer pieces of the puzzle,
but none get specific. For instance, which side does one scrape, with
what, and to what thickness? With what does one grind, file and/or
polish the surface denticles in order to flatten their sharp points?
With what does one dye the material? What adhesive does one use to
adhere the material to other objects? Which skins are best suited for
decorative work, dogfish, rays, sharks....
I have also found several places to buy the several versions of
prefinished to finished material (rawhide and leather), but that is
not my current purpose. Maybe it will become so. I have tried
searches (with various qualifiers) on taxidermy, leather, Jean-Claude
Galuchat, John Paul Cooper, Phillippines, and I forgot many others.
Somehow I have to break out of the box I'm in and find a key. The
Galuchat process and/or variations MUST be published or otherwise
available somewhere!
Thanks for hanging in there!
Bob
|
Clarification of Answer by
colin-ga
on
25 Jun 2002 13:02 PDT
Hello Bob:
Discouraged? Moi? Mais non!
Sorry, I was thinking in french again.
I've been visiting many french sites, dusting off my knowledge of
french trying to find more information.
Not much new, but I have been searching www.fr.Yahoo.com hoping that
searching there would go deeper into the french corner of the WWW.
I have emailed two museums in france, and a couple of Universitys of
Art, pleading for any information available on the web, or in a book.
I will keep you posted.
Regards,
Colin
|
Clarification of Answer by
colin-ga
on
27 Jun 2002 08:55 PDT
Bob:
As I mentioned earlier, I had contacted some companies in
France, in the hopes of finding someone who can detail the galuchat
process. I think we are in luck. There is a master craftsman at
Aisthesis that makes his own galuchat, I have his phone number and
email address. He has agreed to talk to you about the process. He also
speaks english, which I'm sure will help. You may call or write to him
Name: Jérôme Cordié
Phone: 33.1.53.33.00.45
email: clairecordie@hotmail.com
Here is a copy of our correspondance:
To: contact@aisthesis.com
Subject: Galuchat
Date: Tue, 25 Jun 2002 14:49:24 -0400
Bonjour:
J'essaie localiser la méthode ou le faire galuchat. Nous voulons
utiliser la peau de peau de requin ou piqûure-rayon. Fait vous sait
d'un website ou livre qui montrera nous une étape par stp . Nous
serions très reconnaissants. Nous sommes aux états-unis
d'Amérique, donc s'il vous plaît exuse n'importe quelles erreurs en
français.
Vous remercier
Colin
===========
On 26 Jun 2002 at 7:11, claire cordie wrote:
>
bonjour,
thank you for your message. we can speack english. what do you
need galuchat for ? and how can we help you. we are using
galuchat for furniture and other "objets d'art". we went to your
website to see your activity.
please don't hesitate to ask us more information if we can produce
for you any kind of good with galuchat. we are used to work with
USA (New-York, LA).
you know you can contact us via email or by phone
33.1.53.33.00.45 and ask to speak to Jérôme Cordié the manager
of AISTHESIS (cabinet maker).
Best regards. Claire Cordié
=================
Bonjour Clair:
Thank you for responding. I have a client/artist that is trying to
make (process) galuchat from shark or sting ray skin. He has been
unsuccessful in learning the process. He has questions on what
tools are used, chemicals so he can recreate this interesting
process.
Does Jérôme Cordié make the galuchat himself or do you purchase
it already processed?
===========================
Bonjour Colin,
Jérôme Cordié purchases, uses and fashions himself the galuchat for
his creations. He has reinvented the process of using it some years
ego. So what I can tell you is that you could call him or try to reach
"French Window" in New York" which is our Decorator for USA. I ask for
the phone number and come back to you.
Regards. Claire
I hope Monsieur Cordie, can help you.
As always, feel free to follow up.
Regards,
Colin
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