Hello,

 Working for a Dutch subsidiary of a private US company, I got offered
a transfer to the US. A transfer in principle is for indefinite time
as opposed to an assignment which is time limited (18-36 months). A
financial offer is being made to compensate for relocation/inconvience
etc. which I would like to sense-check. At the same time I want to
make sure all relevant elements are included. With my girlfriend, I
have 2 small children (2 years and 1 month).
The US office I will work for is based in Warren County, NJ. I am
thinking about buying a house in either NJ (Morris County) or PA.

I have a number of specific questions:

 My Dutch salary is 90k Euro and includes free pension plan and health
insurance. My girlfriend is working parttime earning around 14k. The
US salary offered is 146k USD including a ' mirrored '  dutch pension
plan and global health coverage. How does this compare (index) ? What
is the average income in NJ ?

 What are the taxes that I need to pay and what will be my nett income
(approx) is there a difference between NJ and PA ? What is, in a
simple overview, the tax that I need to pay (federal, county, city,
sales taxes etc.)

 I own a house in the Netherlands which I would like to keep for a
while. Are there banks available that deal with expats and house
owners with houses in different countries ? I know ING (Orange) has a
US subsidiary but what about others. Which banks are good to work with
as an expat and that support eg. dual currency accounts ?

 What is the cost of living index between NJ / PA and the Netherlands
? Which is more expensive and on which criteria ?

 What is the approximate bandwidth that I can afford in terms of house
price (in dollar). If I would rent a house (e.g. rentals on
www.gsmls.com) of similar value, what would be the approximate monthly
rent ?
 
 Is there an index on quality of living ? I have seen a UN ranking of
most liveable countries where Netherlands is fifth globally and US
seventh but I am looking for more specific (NJ/PA) and especially the
criteria used.

 Finally any guidelines for transfer deals (maybe openly published by
other companies) would be very welcome and be a plus.

 I am looking for quite detailed answers as I have collected some
headlines myself. If more personal information is needed or
clarification, do not hesitate to contact me.

---

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 12 May 2004 11:52 PDT

You might find this slaary comparison tool useful:

http://www.homefair.com/homefair/calc/salcalc.html

Note that underneath the main "calculator" (for comparing costs within
the US), there is a link to an international calculator.  Click it,
and see what it tells.  It's a bit of a 'black box" in terms of how it
arrives at its numbers, but the site seems to take its task seriously,
and has other resources to offer that may be useful.

Let me know if this helps at all.

pafalafa-ga

---

Clarification of Question by bergcor-ga on 15 May 2004 07:41 PDT

Hi Pafalafa,

 That calculator was indeed useful. Although the fact that it is
unclear how it arrives at it's numbers makes it bit tricky to use as
an argument in a discussion. Reading the disclaimer it also seems that
the statistics could be dated.
 I have now found a tool from ERI (Economical Research Institute)
which compares cost of living as well but when comparing outside the
US the data seems not to be too reliable sometimes. I think they
collect via internet questionnaires which can be unreliable especially
if there are only 1 or 2 respondents for a city.

 Thanks though, the help was appreciated

---

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 15 May 2004 10:18 PDT

Thanks...glad that was useful to you.

Here's another site that *might* be of help.  It's the instructions to
eomployees of the US State Department who are stationed overseas on
how to figure out their salary and cost of living differentials
according to where they are stationed (e.g., Amsterdam):

http://www.state.gov/m/a/als/qtrpt/2004/  

It's typical government -- kind of hard to wade through -- but it
seems quite comprehensive, and may give you a lot of food for thought,
even if you don't come out of it with cold hard numbers.  Anyway, give
it a look and let me know if it's a help at all.

Beyond that, however, I'm not sure we have gotten much closer to an
answer to your original question.  Are the five or six specific areas
you laid out there still in need of detailed information?  Or have you
perhaps re-assessed what it is you need to know at this point?

If you still think we can assist you in appraising the differences
bewteen costs of living in the Netherlands, and in the US, then let us
know specifically what srt of info you still need, and we'll do out
best to try to get it to you.

Cheers.

pafalafa-ga

---

Clarification of Question by bergcor-ga on 01 Jun 2004 08:15 PDT

Hello,

 Thanks again pafalafa. The govt website was helpful in a sense that
it provided me with food for thought. The perspective was for US govt
officials to move to e.g. Europe whereas in my case it would be the
other way round so I would not be able to derive any indices etc.
 Thanks for your help.

---

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 01 Jun 2004 08:40 PDT

bergcor-ga,

Glad to hear that site was at least a bit useful, but I agree, it's
certainly not the ideal tool for someone making the move in the
reverse direction.

If I find any more useful information, I'll be sure to post it here
prior to the expiration date of your question in a few days.  Perhaps
other researchers may have some information to offer as well.

But from what I can see, I probably won't be able to offer a concrete
answer to your specific queries...the information just isn't out
there, it seems.  We never like leaving a question unanswered, but in
this case, that may be a better option than trying to force an answer
when the information just won't allow it.

Whatever the case, all the best with your move.  I'm sure you'll find
life in the US a fascinating change from your experiences back home.

Let us know if there's anything more we can help you with.

Cheers.

pafalafa-ga

Well since I am an expat myself (and dutch to boot) and moved over
here about 7 years ago I might be of some assistance to you answering
your questions

My Dutch salary is 90k Euro and includes free pension plan and health
insurance. My girlfriend is working parttime earning around 14k. The
US salary offered is 146k USD including a ' mirrored '  dutch pension
plan and global health coverage. How does this compare (index) ? What
is the average income in NJ ?

To determine the average income in NJ I would need to know what
profession you are in but to give you a head start go here
www.salary.com and check the averages for your profession.

Average income varies wildly by state and profession , people make
anywhere between 2 dollar to 18 dollar per hour in low end jobs (2
dollar usually being servers in a restaurant) Mid to high end jobs
vary between 40K and 60K a year , anything above that is considdered
high income
There are quite a few exceptions to this rule depending on where you
live , to give you an idea 150K dollar buys you a decent house in
georgia but would not buy you a closet in california


 What are the taxes that I need to pay and what will be my nett income
(approx) is there a difference between NJ and PA ? What is, in a
simple overview, the tax that I need to pay (federal, county, city,
sales taxes etc.)

Taxes vary by state, county and sometimes even city roughly they are
devided into the following
Federal tax -anywhere between 15 and 35% depending on income and deductions 
State tax (not all states have state tax) see for a taxtable here
http://www.state.nj.us/treasury/taxation/pdf/other_forms/taxtable.pdf
Sales tax - all prices you will see are excluding sales tax with the
exception of gasoline prices , sales tax is usually devided in 2
portions the state sales tax and the county/city sales tax and they
usually add up to 7% (considder it BTW)


 I own a house in the Netherlands which I would like to keep for a
while. Are there banks available that deal with expats and house
owners with houses in different countries ? I know ING (Orange) has a
US subsidiary but what about others. Which banks are good to work with
as an expat and that support eg. dual currency accounts ?

With any form of international banking in the US you will run into the
so called 'deer in headlight stare" (koeienblik) at the local branches
of the offices , my best experiences are with Bank of America and
Wachovia but even there you will need to be very patient and explain
exactly what you want and in most cases help them along (to give you a
real life example , they have no clue what a SWIFT number is)


 What is the cost of living index between NJ / PA and the Netherlands
? Which is more expensive and on which criteria ?
just to touch a few major points 

Housing (rent) higher then in the netherlands (+30% or more)

Groceries if you buy local stuff it is about the same , however luxury
stuff and imports are extremely high (french cheese for example will
set you back 7 dollars for 200 grams)

Clothing - in general cheaper then in the netherlands (Levi jeans cost
approx 35 dollars)

What is the approximate bandwidth that I can afford in terms of house
price (in dollar). If I would rent a house (e.g. rentals on
www.gsmls.com) of similar value, what would be the approximate monthly
rent ?

The rule of thumb is that they will not rent you a place if the rent
will surpass 1/3 of your income
 

 Is there an index on quality of living ? I have seen a UN ranking of
most liveable countries where Netherlands is fifth globally and US
seventh but I am looking for more specific (NJ/PA) and especially the
criteria used.

Sorry i have no information about NJ/PA available ,

Finally any guidelines for transfer deals (maybe openly published by
other companies) would be very welcome and be a plus.

the average transfer deal you will find (and if you don't mind me
saying so you got a hell of a deal on your medical insurance) is they
pay for packing  shipping and insurance and unpacking of your goods (a
full container will cost you arround 8000 dollars)  and in most cases
they will find you a (corporate)appartment for your immediate housing
needs with the understanding you will move out to your own place when
your stuff arrives (usually takes about a month)

 I am looking for quite detailed answers as I have collected some
headlines myself. If more personal information is needed or
clarification, do not hesitate to contact me.

You can always contact me if you need more information because there
are quite a few other quirks you need to work out before you can get a
foothold here
(for one thing you need to get married if you want your girlfiend to come along)

Thanks for your comment Corwin. It is really appreciated. I knew that
' I have to get married'.. :-) Currently I am looking at renting a
house. In the Netherlands I own a 5 bedroom house with a bit of land
for the children to play and schools/shops/daycare close by. I would
like to rent something similar in the US. My current estimate based on
www.gsmls.com is that a reasonable house will set me back certainly
around 4,000 USD a month. Do you know if taxes/insurances should be
added to that ? In the Netherlands you have to pay occupant taxes if
you rent.

Since I do not live in the state you are moving to I do not know all
the specifics however i can give you some general information

a. renters insurance , yes you need it cost is reasonable and is based
on location and size of the house , valuables and antiques need to be
appraised and insured seperately , (to give you an example I have
quite a lot of antiques and other trinkets and live in what is called
a safe neighbourhood and i pay arround 60 dollars a month) there is no
such thing as occupant taxes
your basic cost of living are the following elements
Rent,water(+sewage),gas,electricity,renters insurance
plus the addons 
telephone, cable, 

b. The houses you see on that website are houses that are for sale ,
it is highly doubtfull you will find a house like that for rent, but
you could always be lucky
ok I will try to price things for you based on Georgia prices (again
you would have to adjust those to local prices)

Bad (bad being lower class not the slums !) neighbourhood appartment
of approx 1000 sqf - 400 - 600 a month

Medium Neighbourhood appartment of approx 1200 sqf ($600-800)

High class neighbourhood appartment approx 1500 sqf ($1200-1500)

Houses , since most houses are rented out by individuals it depends on
your negotiating skills but they follow more or less the appartment
prices
(for easy calculation 9 sf is approx 1 square meter)

Buying a house will be rather difficult in the beginning unless you
are willing to swallow a rediculusly high interest rate for the first
years (11 to 12 %) at a current rate of 3 to 4% since you have no
established credit (that will take you about 3 years to do if you
follow a few simple rules)

Establishing credit the quick and dirty way 
a. get an american express card in the netherlands 
b. when you get here bully amex in changing it to an american  amex
card (easy to do , just play on their 'worldwide alure)
c. use that card once you have it to buy gas and groceries and 1 large purchase
d. pay back the card in 3 or 4 months (DO NOT PAY THE BALANCE AT ONCE
even if ou have the money)
e. rinse repeat
in about 3 to 5 months you will get offers for creditcards if they are
unsecured (meaning you do not need to upfront any money) take em and
use em in the same fashion
always pay your bills on time however do not pay them when you receive them 
avoid using cash for large purchases 
avoid using credit cards for nickle and dime stuff

Opening a bank account (now here is something funny)
Opening a bank account requires you to have a local address however
renting a house requires you to have a bank account (nice catch 22
isn't it) do what I did and use your bussiness' address as your local
address
you will get so called temporary checks , use them to augment your
supply of toiletpaper because that is all they are good for , wait for
3 weeks to get your real ones . and toss away the first set (merchants
look strange at low numbered checks)
Checks are mistrusted pretty much anywhere, once you have them in hand
you will see why , you can use them to pay bills and groceries and
thats about it

Leasing a car , same problem you don't have any credit so leasing is
not an option unless you like high interest rates , your best bet ,
buy a 2 yr old second hand car and pay in full since getting a loan
for it is pretty much impossible (same credit problem) after a year or
2 when your credit is established lease any car you want

Electronic equipment, Sell it , give it away , just don't bring it
since it won't work here
TV uses NTSC so all your PAL equipment won't work (including any DVD's
and Video tapes you have)
Radio uses a different increment on the stations (Dutch ones use the
even numbers like 96.8 american stations use odd numbers like 99.7)
anything else you have works on 220V/50 hz , overhere it is 110V/60Hz 
you can buy converters that cycle the power up to 220V , a converter
that outputs a max of 14 amps costs about $90 (I have one for my Hilty
drill that is about it)

I could go on for ever just leave me a list of questions here and I
will try to answer them for you