Advice for mothers with a poor mother/ daughter relationship age 10 through 12.
Advice for only daughters who are demanding, rude to their mothers, and defiant.

---

Request for Question Clarification by czh-ga on 29 May 2004 19:43 PDT

Hello justaskingnow-ga,

There are lots of resources available for dealing with mother-daughter
relationships but it?s clear that you are interested in a very
specific type of relationship. I see that your question could have
multiple interpretations so I?d like to clarify some points.

As I understand it, you?re looking for information about daughters who
are aged 10-12. Would you accept resources that address the needs of
pre-teen and/or pre-pubescent girls and/or daughters?

Your second question also raises questions. I'm not sure what the
"only" refers to. Are you interested in information about daughters
who are only children with no brothers or sisters or might the girl
have siblings? Alternately, are you only interested in problems of
rudeness and defiance toward mothers and all other behavior issues
don?t matter?

Also, how old is the mother? What about the father? Is the family
intact? Does the child have problems with rudeness and defiance toward
other people -- adults and/or children? How does the child get along
in school? Has the girl always been rude and defiant or is this a
recent development? Have there been any changes in the family recently
? divorce, birth of sibling, relocation, illness, etc.?

I sense that there is a story behind your questions. The more you can
tell me about the context of your question, the more likely I will be
able to get you the information you need.

I look forward to your clarification.

~ czh ~

---

Clarification of Question by justaskingnow-ga on 30 May 2004 23:50 PDT

This question is regarding daughters who are 10 - 12 years.  3 mothers
have similar problems.  all the girls are only children, two from
intact families.  one child has limited social skills, one child has
good social skills, one child has good skills and does mischievious
things - ie, overflow the toilet in a restraurant or retrieve salt
shaker that has been taken away because she was creating fizz in the
mineral water.   all have been dificult for mothers since onset.   All
are very attached to their fathers.

Hello Justaskingnow~


Marketers have a new name for kids in this age group: tweens. Pressed
forward into teen-dom by such factors as advertising, pop culture, and
peer pressure, kids between the ages of eight and twelve are becoming
increasingly difficult for parents.

Sadly, while they are running headlong into adolescent behavior,
tweens have even less of an understanding of themselves and the world
around them than teens do. They tend to rely even more heavily on what
others tell them about the world and how they should look and behave.

?The Toy Manufacturers of America Factbook states that, where once the
industry could count on kids between birth and 14 as their target
market, today it is only birth to ten. ?In the last ten years we've
seen a rapid development of upper-age children,? says Bruce Friend,
vice president of worldwide research and planning for Nickelodeon, a
cable channel aimed at kids. ?The 12- to 14-year-olds of yesterday are
the ten to 12s of today."? The rise of the preteen teen is ?the
biggest trend we've seen.??The Nickelodeon-Yankelovich Youth Monitor
found that by the time they are 12, children describe themselves as
?flirtatious, sexy, trendy, athletic, cool.? Nickelodeon's Bruce
Friend reports that by 11, children in focus groups say they no longer
even think of themselves as children.? (?Tweens: Ten Going on
Sixteen,? Kay S. Hymowitz, City Journal:
http://www.city-journal.org/html/8_4_a1.html )

This is a key element: Children believing they are no longer kids and
in need of parental guidance--but believing instead that they are
?grown up.? Tweens tend to eschew typical family movies and seek out
more adult-oriented films. Instead of reading children?s magazines,
they seek out adult-oriented magazines and books. Television shows
aimed at tweens no longer fit into the ?kids? category?they are
teen-like, and tend to encourage the behavior parents most fear for
their tweens.

Some of this adolescent-style behavior may be chalked up to the fact
that many tweens are falling into puberty as a younger age. The
average age for a girl?s first period is 11; it used to be 13.

Perhaps influenced by these factors, tweens ?are demonstrating many of
the deviant behaviors we usually associate with the raging hormones of
adolescence. ?Ninth and tenth grade used to be the starting point for
a lot of what we call risk behaviors,? says Brooklyn middle-school
head Henry Trevor, as he traces the downward trajectory of deviancy
many veteran educators observe.?

However, hormones, culture, and peer pressure aside, there?s little
doubt parenting plays its role: Robert L. Johnson, director of
adolescent and young-adult medicine at the University of Medicine and
Dentistry in New Jersey says, ?Kids wear sexually provocative clothes
at nine because their parents buy them provocative clothes, not
because of their hormones.?

Many experts believe the main problem with today?s tweens is that
parents are too permissive or absent; therefore, kids are turning to
the media and to peers for guidance.

According to the City Journal article, ?almost without exception, the
principals and teachers I spoke with describe a pervasive loneliness
among tweens. ?The most common complaint I hear,? says Christie Hogan,
?is, 'My mom doesn't care what I do. She's never home. She doesn't
even know what I do.'? Although the loneliest and most estranged kids
don't talk to counselors and can't even be coaxed into after-school
programs when they are available, the more resourceful and socially
well-adjusted children stay after school whether or not there is a
formal program, hanging around popular teachers and counselors. ?We
have to shoo them home at six sometimes,? recounts one New York City
middle-school director. ?They don't want to go home. No one's
there.??The one theme that comes through loud and clear in talking to
educators and therapists is that, with parents and their tween
children, it's the blind leading the blind. ?I'm hearing statements
like, 'What can I do? I can't make him read,'? says one director of a
New York City private middle school. ? And the child is in fifth
grade. What does it mean that an adult feels he cannot make a
ten-year-old do something???

So, the first step to dealing with defiant tweens is to really be
there, if the parents aren?t already. Find time for the children?make
time for them. Get to know them; find out what their lives are like.
Have conversations with them daily. Experts say it?s important to
listen?without interrupting. If you disagree with the child, disagree
with respect. And offer support: ?I know this is a tough time for you;
believe it or not, I?ve had similar experiences. Hang in there, honey.
I love you, and it will pass.?

The second step may be to introduce a new level of discipline. This
will likely be difficult at first, as the child will resist something
new, but most experts agree, in the end, the child is thankful for
discipline?wants discipline, wants parental guidance. For tips on
discipline for tweens, check out ?Discipline from Nine to Twelve,?
James Dobson, Troubled With:
http://www.troubledwith.com/Stellent/groups/public//@fotf_troubledwith/documents/articles/twi_013813.cfm?channel=Parenting%20Children&topic=Discipline
When disciplining an angry tween or teen, it can be easy to react with
anger in return. Resist the urge. ?We need to respond, rather than
react to, each other and to situations,? says Focus on Adolescent
Services. (?Anger,? Focus on Adolescent Services:
http://www.focusas.com/Anger.htm )

If the child is often angry, FAS offers a list of questions children
and parents should ponder. For tips on defusing defiance and anger,
also check out ?Defusing Preteen Battles,? Brad Lewis, Troubled With:
http://www.troubledwith.com/Stellent/groups/public//@fotf_troubledwith/documents/articles/twi_013811.cfm?channel=Parenting%20Children&topic=Discipline

Unfortunately, for some kids, part of feeling ?grown up? and not
needing their parents anymore involves rude behavior at parental help.
But do realize the reason tweens and teens behave this way is that
they?re insecure and feel out of place; they don?t know how to go from
kid to adult. ?They may be embarrassed to be seen with their parents
because they are trying to separate from them and become an
individual.? (?Puberty Primer,? Valerie K. O?Berry, Preteenagers
Today: http://preteenagerstoday.com/resources/articles/pubertyprimer.htm
)
Tweens are attempting to separate from their parents and join society.
The main trouble is that tweens have even less of an ability to
separate ?society? from peer pressure than teens do. Nonetheless,
experts seem to agree that children going through this phase of life
need to have their wishes respected?at least to a degree. If they want
a certain amount of privacy, parents should grant it, but not to the
degree that the parents become permissive. For example, if the tween
wants a cupboard drawer kept private because it has mementos in it,
experts say allow it. But if they want to roam about town
indiscriminately, without clearing it with their parents, the parents
must put their foot down. (An exception to the privacy rule: If there
is good reason to believe the child has a drug or suicide problem, or
may be involved in criminal activities, privacy goes out the door.)

Experts also say parents should encourage the child to do some of her
own problem-solving; this should be in areas where the child can?t
make a detrimental mistake.

Parents should also talk about their core beliefs, and explain why
they believe them. Although it may not seem like it, the kids are
listening and are influenced. But don?t make this a big long speech.
Introduce this information as it seems appropriate in every day
conversation.

Experts also suggest trying to get the child interested in outside
activities that will occupy their mind, their energy, and their time.
This could include sports, dance classes, theatre, music, art classes,
etc. When the child shows an interest in something, see if you can
find a regular class or an activity for them to explore it.

The latter step is especially important for kids who are prone to
doing things to gain attention. Get them involved in an activity that
provides a means for them to have their achievements recognized.

Since the girls in question are very close to their fathers, their
dads should take the lead in all of this, but both parents must
present a united front. In other words, the parents must agree on the
rules and guidelines and enforce them consistently.



In addition to the information provided directly in this Answer, I
recommend that you read all of the articles mentioned, as well. They
offer additional ideas from experts about dealing with defiant tweens.


Best wishes,
Kriswrite


KEYWORDS USED:
tweens defiant
://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=tweens+defiant&btnG=Search

"HOW TO" Tweens defiant
://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=%22HOW+TO%22+Tweens+defiant

defiant pre-teen
://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=defiant+pre-teen&btnG=Search

defiant preteen
://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&q=defiant+preteen&spell=1

I feel that this question should be deel with problem relating
to family relation in wester countries. The best solution of all
such problem is in religion.
Regards
Ijaz Ahmad

Religion won't solve an existing problem, and in most cases just makes
things worse because instead of focusing on finding a solution to the
problem at hand, introducing a complicated new activity into the
effected peoples' lifestyles can impede the possibility of finding a
solution.

Problem solving is far more effective than introducing a new belief
system (especially when the belief system is based on guilt trips as
many religions are presented in this manner).

Of course, not all problems can be solved either.  All parties
involved must at least comprehend the benefit to solving a problem (if
they don't have a desire to do so) or else any attempts to fix things
will likely fail (and possibly make things worse).

Sometimes counselling can be helpful, but unfortunately many
psychiatrists in this day and age are hell-bent on turning all their
patients into whiners who ramble on about their feelings and never get
anywhere.  Yes, this is great for billing purposes, but it doesn't
help to get to the root of the real issues at hand, which are
generally not so difficult to figure out if most of the "my feelings
are important" nonsense is pushed left out of it.

Before recommending religion, I think it would be better for people in
conflict to somehow deal with the issues directly.  Unfortunately this
is much easier said than done since most people involved in conflicts
are usually afraid to face the issues directly because, you guessed it
- they don't want to hurt the other person's feelings.

Based on personal experience, I can say that the following helps a lot
with this age:

--Be sure to notice when they do things right, and congratulate them.

--Be very consistent with your rules, and DON'T BLUFF!  They will soon
learn whether your threats are real.

--Choose your battles.  You won't win them all, so decide in advance
what is important.  Allow yourself to lose from time to time on the
more minor items.

--Give them responsibility.  And let them fail from time to time.  But
don't demean them when they fail, as long as they are "stretching" to
do new things.  Instead, praise them for trying, and if they are
willling to listen perhaps you can give them hints on how to improve.