|
|
Subject:
Grammar
Category: Reference, Education and News > General Reference Asked by: thouston-ga List Price: $10.00 |
Posted:
18 Aug 2004 13:54 PDT
Expires: 17 Sep 2004 13:54 PDT Question ID: 389628 |
Is "request to" considered to be correct, as in "We request the court clerk to issue a summons." |
|
Subject:
Re: Grammar
Answered By: markj-ga on 18 Aug 2004 16:41 PDT |
thouston -- Both "request [someone] to [do something]" and "request that [someone do something]" are entirely correct, and both are very common. However, the use of "to" rather than "that" with "request" appears to be significantly more popular. As to the correctness of each version, two very good dictionaries at my disposal recognize them both as grammatical. First, from the American Heritage dictionary, here is its first definition of "request," along with three usage examples: "Request [] 1. To express a desire for; ask for. Often used with an infinitive or clause: requested information about the experiment; requested to see the evidence firsthand; requested that the bus driver stop at the next corner." "The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition" Houghton Mifflin Company (2003. The eminent Oxford English Dictionary lists the "request to" usage first, and the "request that" usage as an alternative: "Request [] 1. (a) With infinitive. To express a wish or desire 'to' have, hear, etc. (b) Similarly, with 'that' or objective clause." "The Compact Edition of the Oxford English Dictionary, Vol II," Oxford University Press (1971). As for which is the more common, the following two simple Google searches justify (fairly, I think)the conclusion that "request to" is the winner: "requested to" (gets 1,750,000 "hits") ://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&safe=off&c2coff=1&q=%22requested+to%22 "requested that" (gets "only" 1,110,000 hits) ://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&safe=off&c2coff=1&q=%22requested+that%22 If we limit our searches only to the websites of educational institutions (designated by ".edu"), "requested to" wins again, by a very similar percentage: "requested to" (gets 245,000 hits) ://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&safe=off&c2coff=1&q=%22requested+to%22+site%3Aedu "requested that" (gets 145,000 hits) ://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&safe=off&c2coff=1&q=%22requested+that%22+site%3Aedu Under the circumstances, you can be confident about being grammatically correct if you use either "to" or "that" with "request" or "requested." Search Stategy: I used dictionaries that I have on hand to determine the correct grammatical usages, and I devised the above Google searches to help bolster the point that either usage is correct and to add information about their relative popularity. I hope that I have answered your question to your complete satisfaction. If anything is unclear, please ask for clarification before rating the answer. markj-ga |
|
Subject:
Re: Grammar
From: joey-ga on 18 Aug 2004 15:03 PDT |
I'm not sure of the official stance on that, but I've always found it terribly awkward, and so I avoid that usage in favor of, "We request THAT the court issue a summons." --Joey |
Subject:
Re: Grammar
From: pinkfreud-ga on 18 Aug 2004 15:09 PDT |
I agree with Joey. While "We request the court clerk to issue a summons" may not be wrong, to my ear it does not sound as good as "We request that the court clerk issue a summons." |
Subject:
Re: Grammar
From: luntes-ga on 18 Aug 2004 17:28 PDT |
Hi, I'm from Brazil and English for me is a foreign language. Reading the comments (and having researched Google - so I know I'm wrong in what I'm going to say)I would think that "We request that the court clerk issueS a summons" would be right. Can you tell me how would you feel hearing or reading the sentence this way? Thanks Luntes |
Subject:
Re: Grammar
From: pinkfreud-ga on 18 Aug 2004 17:57 PDT |
Luntes, "Issue" is used (instead of than "issues") in the sentence "We request that the court clerk issue a summons" because the verb is in the subjunctive mood. "A verb is in the subjunctive mood when it expresses a condition which is doubtful or not factual. It is most often found in a clause beginning with the word if. It is also found in clauses following a verb that expresses a doubt, a wish, regret, request, demand, or proposal. These are verbs typically followed by clauses that take the subjunctive: ask, demand, determine, insist, move, order, pray, prefer, recommend, regret, request, require, suggest, and wish. In English there is no difference between the subjunctive and normal, or indicative, form of the verb except for the present tense third person singular and for the verb to be. The subjunctive for the present tense third person singular drops the -s or -es so that it looks and sounds like the present tense for everything else." http://englishplus.com/grammar/00000031.htm French, Italian, Portuguese, and Spanish use the subjunctive mood much more than does modern English. The subjunctive is dying out in English, but it's not extinct yet, and the sentence above is a good example of one of the surviving usages. |
Subject:
Re: Grammar
From: luntes-ga on 18 Aug 2004 18:35 PDT |
Thanks Pinkfreud, As I said, I knew that would be wrong. What I wanted to know was if the phrase that way would sound completely weird or if people would sometimes say it that way (illiterate people, for example). And it was good to know that English is changing like Brazilian Portuguese is(in fact, Portuguese would be more like English - with a less complicated grammar - in 200 years than it is now). Luntes |
Subject:
Re: Grammar
From: joey-ga on 18 Aug 2004 19:17 PDT |
You know, luntes, that's kind of an "advanced" thing to say to begin with, so I don't know that "illiterate" people would even organize something with that syntax. I know that I don't have to think about how to say it . . . it's just natural (as is the case with most things as a native speaker). However, with forms of "be", less educated people have been known to mistakenly not use the subjunctive form. For instance, I've heard less educated people say something along the lines of, "If I was in charge," or, "If she was my child." But, to most people they both would sound very awkward. For the record, the correct way to say these are, "If I were in charge," and, "If she were my child." --Joey |
Subject:
Re: Grammar
From: luntes-ga on 19 Aug 2004 06:35 PDT |
Thanks, Joey, You fulfilled my curiosity. Luntes |
Subject:
Re: Grammar
From: pinkfreud-ga on 19 Aug 2004 10:09 PDT |
Luntes, If I were to encounter the sentence "We request that the court clerk issueS a summons," my first thought would not be "the person who said this is probably illiterate." My first thought would be "the person who said this is probably not a native speaker of English." As Joey mentions, the sentence is structured in a rather formal way that would not come naturally to an illiterate person. Some language buffs wring their hands at the changes that English is undergoing. Personally, I am not displeased to see the subjunctive mood ebbing away. I take great delight in the English language, but the simplification of the grammar used in everyday speech does not, in my view, rob us of anything worth saving. Now if only we could simplify the spelling of English words... |
Subject:
Re: Grammar
From: ac67-ga on 19 Aug 2004 12:07 PDT |
I would add that use of poor grammar is only an indication, but not proof, of poor education, and certainly not a sign of low intelligence. I have known very well educated and highly intelligent people who use poor grammar in casual conversation, primarily because that is what they learned initially at home. They may know the rules quite well, and use them correctly in writing and formal speech, but in casual conversation, they revert to what they are most comfortable with. As Benjamin Franklin said, "Write with the learned, pronounce with the vulgar" |
Subject:
Re: Grammar
From: luntes-ga on 19 Aug 2004 14:12 PDT |
Thanks, Pinkfreud, for your second comment. You fulfilled what was left of my curiosity. Luntes |
If you feel that you have found inappropriate content, please let us know by emailing us at answers-support@google.com with the question ID listed above. Thank you. |
Search Google Answers for |
Google Home - Answers FAQ - Terms of Service - Privacy Policy |