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Q: Updating video drivers ( Answered 5 out of 5 stars,   1 Comment )
Question  
Subject: Updating video drivers
Category: Computers > Software
Asked by: boomering-ga
List Price: $10.00
Posted: 02 Oct 2004 06:36 PDT
Expires: 01 Nov 2004 05:36 PST
Question ID: 409281
I am getting a hard lockup using Doom3. The video just freezes at
random points and the only cure is a power down/power up. One of the
suggestions for improving performance and eliminating problems is to
update to the latest video drivers. I have an ATI Sapphire Radeon 9600
Atlantis video card. I went to the ATI website and downloaded the
driver update to my hard drive. (I also downloaded and installed
Microsoft's .NET Version 1.1 per the instructions on the ATI website).
Now the website says that previous versions of the video driver must
be removed before installing the updated driver. I'm kinda loathe to
remove my video driver. My question is whether I can use the Update
Driver option in Windows's device manager to do this switch for me. I
guess my question is "what is the best/safest/easiest way for me to
update my video driver?".

Request for Question Clarification by sublime1-ga on 02 Oct 2004 10:15 PDT
boomering...

Can you specify which version of Windows you're using,
and which driver bundle you're installing (file size
might be useful, too)?

sublime1-ga

Request for Question Clarification by sublime1-ga on 02 Oct 2004 10:36 PDT
boomering...

I'm also not seeing where, on the ATI website, it says
that previous versions of the video driver must be 
removed before installing the updated driver. Can you
point me to that page?

sublime1-ga

Clarification of Question by boomering-ga on 02 Oct 2004 13:35 PDT
Hi Sublime1,

Sorry, I should have mentioned I'm running XP home version with the
Service Pack 2 installed. I should add that I have an emachine desktop
with AMD Athlon 64 bit CPU and 512 MB DDR SDRAM.

One place that the uninstall instruction can be found is:
http://www2.ati.com/drivers/Catalyst_49_release_notes.html

I got there by following DRIVERS & SOFTWARE, then selecting Windows
XP, Graphic Driver, RADEON Family, GO (gets you to a new page), then
under #2, RELEASE NOTES.

Request for Question Clarification by sublime1-ga on 02 Oct 2004 18:06 PDT
boomering...

I understand your reluctance to uninstall your current video
drivers, based on personal experience of difficulties with
the Windows default drivers on the subsequent reboot, prior
to installing the updated drivers, and some problems with 
the installation program for the new drivers.

However, in looking over the ATI instructions, they seem to
have it all covered in a most thorough manner, and I would
be inclined to follow their directions exactly. They even
incorporated feedback from users into the installation:
"This driver release incorporates suggestions received through
 the CATALYST? CREW feedback program."
http://www2.ati.com/drivers/Catalyst_49_release_notes.html


The Update Driver option in Windows's Device Manager is only
useful in updating drivers which can be installed using the
.inf installation file format, and cannot be used to install
a complex suite of tools and applications such as are included
in the CATALYST? Software Suite.

So, in answer to the question "what is the best/safest/easiest
way for me to update my video driver?", in this case, I honestly
believe it would be best to follow the manufacturer's recommended
procedures. Researching this on the internet seemed only to 
confirm the wisdom of this approach, for this company.

You might want to review this page from ATI in advance, re what
to do in the case of a failed uninstall/reinstall process:
http://www.ati.com/support/installation/removal.html

I won't yet post this as an answer, in case you want to hold out
for other opinions, or would simply disagree with the idea of 
not doing it in some other way.

If you decide that this answers your question satisfactorily,
however, I'll be happy to post it as a formal answer.

As you wish...

sublime1-ga

Clarification of Question by boomering-ga on 03 Oct 2004 07:15 PDT
hi sublime1,

I think this will work as a final answer if you can clarify a couple
of things for me:
btw, you're right about my reluctance to remove my current drivers. I
also get a sense of forboding when i see the ATI instruction
"Installing a new driver is only recommended if you are having issues
with your ATI product" because I don't know whether my Doom3 problem
is video driver related.... so:

1) is the full suite of software necessary? i.e., can i use the
Windows Update feature to just update the driver, not the whole suite
(and how important is the whole suite anyway?)
2) I certainly don't want to do this if it's not necessary -- is there
an easy way to check my version of the video driver vs the download
version? The driver information in Device Manager shows my version to
be 6.14.10.6414. I'm not sure I see what version I'd get with the
download. Also, Device Manager offers Update Driver, Roll Back Driver
(in case the update doesn't work), and Uninstall Driver buttons when
you select Properties for the display adapter in Device Manager. Do I
lose access to all of the above if i follow the manufacturer's
procedures?

Thanks,

boomering
Answer  
Subject: Re: Updating video drivers
Answered By: sublime1-ga on 03 Oct 2004 13:37 PDT
Rated:5 out of 5 stars
 
boomering...

I will first reiterate my previous response, for the sake of
future readers:

-------------------------------------------------------------

I understand your reluctance to uninstall your current video
drivers, based on personal experience of difficulties with
the Windows default drivers on the subsequent reboot, prior
to installing the updated drivers, and some problems with 
the installation program for the new drivers.

However, in looking over the ATI instructions, they seem to
have it all covered in a most thorough manner, and I would
be inclined to follow their directions exactly. They even
incorporated feedback from users into the installation:
"This driver release incorporates suggestions received through
 the CATALYST? CREW feedback program."
http://www2.ati.com/drivers/Catalyst_49_release_notes.html


The Update Driver option in Windows's Device Manager is only
useful in updating drivers which can be installed using the
.inf installation file format, and cannot be used to install
a complex suite of tools and applications such as are included
in the CATALYST? Software Suite.

So, in answer to the question "what is the best/safest/easiest
way for me to update my video driver?", in this case, I honestly
believe it would be best to follow the manufacturer's recommended
procedures. Researching this on the internet seemed only to 
confirm the wisdom of this approach, for this company.

You might want to review this page from ATI in advance, re what
to do in the case of a failed uninstall/reinstall process:
http://www.ati.com/support/installation/removal.html

-------------------------------------------------------------

> 1) is the full suite of software necessary? i.e., can i use the
> Windows Update feature to just update the driver, not the whole
> suite (and how important is the whole suite anyway?)

On the driver download page, here:
http://www.ati.com/support/drivers/winxp/radeonwdm-xp.html?type=xp&prodType=graphic&prod=productsXPdriver&submit.x=11&submit.y=10&submit=GO%21

...the option is given to download the entire package (Display
Driver, Control Panel, CATALYST Control Center, WDM Capture driver),
or the package minus the CATALYST Control Center (which is the piece
that needs the MS .NET v1.1 Framework, so you could skip that too),
or you can download the pieces individually if you have a slow
connection, so the display driver can be downloaded separately.

As to whether they can/should be *installed* separately, that is,
by updating only the Display Driver and leaving in the old Control
Panel, e.g., I can't honestly say whether this will work or not.
My gut would say no, and this ReadMe from the driver installation
suggests otherwise, as well:

"When installing Display Drivers or Software a 'Version Conflict'
 message may appear multiple times during the installation."

"If you encounter a "VERSION CONFLICT" message while installing
 this display driver select the "NO" option to proceed."

"* Selecting "NO" will ensure that the components of this driver
 bundle will replace your existing driver components.
 * Selecting "YES" will result in a MIX of new and old driver
 components, which is undesirable."

It also notes:

"NOTE: If you use the Advanced ATI Control Panel tabs download
 the corresponding CONTROL-PANEL components from the ATI WEB site."

"NOTE: ALL-IN-WONDER and VIVO products require the corresponding
 TV-CAPTURE-WDM driver components that are available for download
 from the ATI WEB site."

If you don't use or need the ATI Control Panel tabs or the 
TV-CAPTURE-WDM driver components, you should be able to install
the Display Driver separately, after uninstalling your previous
drivers by doing the following:
- Click START, go to SETTINGS and select CONTROL PANEL. 
- Launch ADD/REMOVE programs.
- Select "ATI Display Driver" and then click the ADD/REMOVE button. 
- RESTART Windows.

If you want to be very thorough, you can then use the advanced
uninstall procedures on the ATI page I linked to earlier:
http://www.ati.com/support/installation/removal.html

Also, here's an additional highly-rated program, specially 
designed by Spike (Ruud Ketelaars), called Driver Cleaner, 

"..to remove parts of drivers that are left after uninstalling the
 old drivers. The program is for ATI and nVidia drivers. First you
 need to uninstall the drivers from the control panel than reboot
 and after that run the program. If you really want a good
 description of what steps you should do than you really need to
 read the readme file included in the zip file and installation
 as it contains a detailed description step by step."
On DriverHeaven.net:
http://www.driverheaven.net/cleaner/

If you don't have any of the additional software currently
installed (Control Panel, CATALYST Control Center, WDM Capture
driver), then you could, theoretically, simply download only
the Display Driver, click on the executable to unzip the 
contents, and then use Device Manager to update the driver
(though you would likely have to dig to locate the .inf file
- more on this later).

But if you have any of those installed, it would be much wiser
to uninstall them all first, using Add/Remove Programs, and
additional software, as above. You would then have the option
to install *only* the Display Driver, and though not recommended,
you should be able to install it via the Device Manager.


> 2) is there an easy way to check my version of the video driver vs
> the download version? The driver information in Device Manager shows
> my version to be 6.14.10.6414.

Version: 6.14.10.6476 - on the far right of the dialup download here:
http://www.ati.com/support/drivers/winxp/radeonwdm-xp.html?type=xp&prodType=graphic&prod=productsXPdriver&submit.x=11&submit.y=10&submit=GO%21


> Also, Device Manager offers Update Driver, Roll Back Driver
> (in case the update doesn't work), and Uninstall Driver buttons
> when you select Properties for the display adapter in Device
> Manager. Do I lose access to all of the above if i follow the
> manufacturer's procedures?

I downloaded your display driver and ran the initial executable, 
which simply unpacks the Setup files to a directory. On inspecting
the files, I *do* see .inf files, so this means that the functions
of Device Manager will be available for use if necessary, but I
wouldn't recommend doing so except in the case of a failed install
using the manufacturer's directions. This programmer, and many who
write installation software, have opted to bypass the Device Mgr.
in favor of using an executable install (Setup.exe) which can be
overseen by Add/Remove Programs in Windows Control Panel. There
are definite advantages to this, over the use of Device Manager,
in the case of a complex installation or uninstallation, as when
the installation consists of multiple drivers and a suite of 
accompanying tools and applications.

I also suspect that, in order to maintain the functionality of
the Device Manager, you would need to leave the directory of
setup files intact on your hard drive so that the .inf files
could be located and utilized, and, having installed by way
of Add/Remove Programs, you might have to search for the inf
files if you subsequently use Device Manager. I have noticed
that many programs which use setup.exe to install and which 
use unwise.exe to uninstall, may not play nicely with Windows
and place their .inf files in the default location for them
[C:\WINNT\inf], and register them in the registry for ease in
locating them.

I also tend to believe that this is probably all moot, and 
using install and uninstall via Add/Remove Programs will 
work just fine.


Finally, there is one other note in the ReadMe file, which
may be relevant, on the topic of Data Corruption, which 
seems to have been included based on the possibility that
extended downloads and file transfers may result in the 
increased likelihood of corrupted data and failed software.

"Data corruption may occur if the Large System Cache feature
 is enabled in Windows XP."

"For complete details see:"
http://www.ati.com/support/infobase/4217.html


Please do not rate this answer until you are satisfied that  
the answer cannot be improved upon by way of a dialog  
established through the "Request for Clarification" process. 
 
sublime1-ga


Searches done, via Google:

"problems installing" Radeon OR ATI "video drivers"
://www.google.com/search?q=%22problems+installing%22+Radeon+OR+ATI+%22video+drivers%22

"problems updating" Radeon OR ATI "video drivers"
://www.google.com/search?q=%22problems+updating%22+Radeon+OR+ATI+%22video+drivers%22

Request for Answer Clarification by boomering-ga on 04 Oct 2004 05:30 PDT
Thanks, sublime1,

Let me just make sure I understand the recommended drill, and sequence of actions:

1) remove previous ATI software (should I use the Control
Panel/Add/Remove or should I use the ATI Software Uninstall Utility?
When I go to Add/Remove, I see that I have 3 ATI programs: the ATI
Uninstall Utility, the ATI Control Panel, and the ATI display
driver).I'm wondering if the ATI Uninstall Utility would eliminate the
need for a program like Driver Cleaner? Should I remove all 3
programs?
2) download and install the new ATI software (i have high speed
internet access). I assume that Windows will automatically provide
some kind of lo-resolution display until the new driver is in place?

I want to thank you for your thoroughness thusfar!

Clarification of Answer by sublime1-ga on 04 Oct 2004 08:44 PDT
boomering...

> 1) remove previous ATI software (should I use the Control
> Panel/Add/Remove or should I use the ATI Software Uninstall Utility?
> When I go to Add/Remove, I see that I have 3 ATI programs: the ATI
> Uninstall Utility, the ATI Control Panel, and the ATI display
> driver).I'm wondering if the ATI Uninstall Utility would eliminate the
> need for a program like Driver Cleaner? Should I remove all 3
> programs?

If you review this ATI page with regard to a thorough uninstall
procedure, everything is spelled out precisely:
http://www.ati.com/support/installation/removal.html

The Driver Cleaner program seems to have been designed to 
remove registry entries and other debris which might be left
behind even after running the ATI Uninstall Utility, as noted
on that page, so I would run the ATI Uninstall Utility to 
remove the ATI Control Panel and Display Driver, then, as
previously noted, reboot, and run Driver Cleaner to clean up
what remains. If it leaves the ATI Uninstall Utility, then so
be it - it's not a driver, and will have no effect.

I haven't read the documentation for Driver Cleaner, so it
may also ask for a reboot following your use of it.

> 2) download and install the new ATI software (i have high speed
> internet access). I assume that Windows will automatically provide
> some kind of lo-resolution display until the new driver is in place?

Personally, I would download the new software first, and have it
on hand for immediate deployment following the steps above. And
Windows may surprise you - the basic drivers available to it are
not necessarily going to be *that* pathetic - though they might.

I can't emphasize strongly enough that the entire uninstall and
install process is very thoroughly documented in its entirety on
this page:
http://www.ati.com/support/installation/removal.html

sublime1-ga
boomering-ga rated this answer:5 out of 5 stars and gave an additional tip of: $5.00
Great answer and excellent patience with my clarification requests!

Comments  
Subject: Re: Updating video drivers
From: sublime1-ga on 04 Oct 2004 22:50 PDT
 
boomering...

Thanks very much for the kind words, the stars, and the tip!

sublime1-ga

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