I have a watercolour picture of a fort. The title of the picture
appears to be "Fort Betman Sinicure & Mote"(?). It was on the "Jhansi
& Cawnpore Road" in India.
The picture is dared 1914. I am unable to find any reference to this
fort.
Can you tell me anything about it?

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Request for Question Clarification by thx1138-ga on 17 Jul 2002 07:51 PDT

Hi miketarrant,

Usually I would say you have given me enough information to answer
your question, but on this occasion the answer is proving quite
elusive.  However it might be I have a lead! but I need some more
information from you:

1. The words "Fort Betman Sinicure & Mote"(?) are located where on the
picture? and why the question mark at the end? are the words clear or
do you doubt the spelling?

2. What is the size of the painting?

3. Can you see ANY sign of a signature?

4. What is the fort like ie. colour, size, does it have towers?, is it
a substantial fort for hundreds of men or is it a small outpost fort
for maybe a couple of dozen men.

5.  Are there any people or animals in the picture?

6. Is it definitely an original water colour?

I have had several hours of fun investigating your picture so far and
hopefully if you can provide a little more detail I will be able to
give you an answer.  As I said I have a theory about your painting
which could be quite exciting if you can confirm  some/all of the
above.

Thanks in anticipation!

THX1138

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Clarification of Question by miketarrant-ga on 18 Jul 2002 05:04 PDT

Hi thx1138-ga, The picture is a water colour and charcoal sketch - I
think.
The picture is mounted and is approx 9" x 6 ". It is a picture of a
substantial fort on a hillside surrounded by two or three fences or
walls. The fort appears to be sandstone or a light colour. Within the
walls is a separate tower with a spike on the top. In the front of the
fort is a moat with a bridge  over it leading to a gate through the
first wall - the gate has two small turrets either side of the
entrance. There are no people or animals in the picture. On the
reverse of the mounting is a label with the following notation - it is
in cursive script and I may spell some of the words incorrectly -
"Fort Betman Sinurce & Mote Jhansi & Cawnpore Road sketched by Walter
Howard 80th regt(?)" underneath the above notation someone has added
in a different hand "Given to me by Mrs Howard July 1914" and against
the name Walter Howard has added "Paula's Husband". There is also a
sticker giving the name of the firm where the picture was mounted -
"Norris of Monkton Street, Ryde, Isle of Wight"

---

Request for Question Clarification by thx1138-ga on 18 Jul 2002 09:12 PDT

Hi miketarrant-ga,


Thanks for the clarification!

Not a difinitive answer (so I havent posted it as such) but hereīs
what I have found out about your painting.  The 80th (or 80th Regiment
of Foot  South Staffordshire Regiment) was stationed in Cawnpore in
1859 and in Jhansi from 1862-1864 so your picture more than likely was
painted between 1859 and 1864.
The Cawnpore – Jhansi road is in a district of India known as Uttar
Pradesh, in this district there are just three substantial forts, Agra
Fort, Chunar Fort, and Jhansi Fort.  The only fort that has a moat is
is Agra Fort.
Have a look at this website and let me know if you recognize it:
http://travel.indiamart.com/uttar-pradesh/forts/

I think the word “mote” is either a misspelling of “moat” or
misspelling of  “motte” (a mound on which a fort/castle is built)

The words “Sinicure” or “Sinurce” (spelt differently in the original
question and subsequent clarification) I donīt know! But it might
refer to the type of fence or wall you mentioned.

I have absoultely no idea about the word “Betman” There are no forts
with the name, and there are no towns or villages in that district
with that name.  My only suggestion is that it could be a colloquial
name given to the fort by the troops of the 80th.

I had originally thought that your painting might just possibly have
been painted by Lord Baden Powell who was a painter of water colours
and was in India at this time (he even painted a fort in water colour
see examples here: http://www.pinetreeweb.com/bp-paintings.htm ) 
However it seems the artist was idenitfied in your question 
clarification.


For information about the 80th Regiment of Foot South Staffordshire
Regiment:
http://members.ozemail.com.au/~clday/80foot.htm

I have spent many pleasurable hours researching your question, and I
hope that given the information above, you will be able to identify
the fort, but without seeing the picture I canīt tell you much more
than I already have.

A big thanks to  Lewis P. Orans of http://www.pinetreeweb.com/ for his
help in my research

Good luck with your search.

THX1138

While looking for a reference to Cawnpore road,  I discovered that
what is now called "Kanpur" used to be called "Cawnpore", and it was
the site of a massacre in 1857 (of British women/children).  There
was, indeed a fort there.  Do you think that this could be what you
are looking for?

Here are some links that further describe the incident:
http://members.ozemail.com.au/~clday/locations.htm  (scroll down to
Cawnpore)

http://www.defencejournal.com/2000/june/cawnpore.htm


It also seems, at this time, (1858) there was another incident at
Jhansi (which is where the between Cawnpore & Jhansi reference came
from, either the proximity in location, or the time frame between
1857-1858))...  here is something to back up that information:
http://www.s-asian.cam.ac.uk/Handlist_C.htm  (scroll down to
Christison Papers)

Also, http://www.briansiano.com/flashman/HTML%20Files/Timeline.htm




I can try to look for a picture, so that you can compare it with
yours.. let me know if any of this sounds feasable (or perhaps it will
point another researcher in the right direction)

-Rebekah

As Rebekah has said... Cawnpore is the old name for Kanpur. Secondly
"Mote" might refer to a town close to Jhansi called "Moth", the
pronounciations would be quite similar. Suggest you look at the
following link:

http://www.eindiatourism.com/jhansi/excursions.html

Possibly the picture of Samthar fort might be familiar?

The problem is that there are so many forts in the region, that it is
difficult to pin point the one that you might want without looking at
the picture of the same. There is another large fort at a place called
Kalpi on the Jhansi- Kanpur highway. You can check it out at

http://travel.indiamart.com/uttar-pradesh/kalpi/

Hope this helps you find what you are looking for.

Regards

If you look at history. During 1857 there was a revolution against
British Rule.
This was supposed to be well planned but broke off when Indian Hindus
and Muslims were forced to byte of "beef and Pork" greased ammunition,
this was strted by Mangal Pandey and 80 other soldiers who revolted
and killed 80 British officers.

The Leaders who led armies against Britsh were Tantya Tope,
Queen(Rani) of Jhansi and Nana Saheb. Not being properly organized the
revolution was not able to throw of British rule. But, I believe from
that time onwards British realized that these people are no longer
slaves and revolted. Rani Jhansi Used to fight with her child tied on
her back. the heir to the throne of Jhansi.

There is a famous incident during this time when Rani Jhansi rides her
horse over the fort wall and a large ditch, which the britishers could
not cross and able to escape. She was later captured I believe and
killed.

I have seen painting of this incident. Which has fort of Jhansi in the
background.

Another famous fort in this area about 50miles from Jhansi is Fort of
Gwalior.
The "Scindia" royal family from this region is still involved as
Member of Parliaments in Indian politics.

I used to live in Jhansi from 84 to 86 and these are the only famous
forts I remember in this region.

About 100 miles from Jhansi are temples of "Khajjaraho" I don't think
these are what you are looking for. "Cawanpore" or Kanpur is 200 miles
from Jhansi and I believe there is no other famous fort in Kanpur.

I have limited knowledge but look up any history book on India. I am
writing from my memory in high school.

There was a famous poem we used to read about Rani Of Jhansi at that
time.
I still remember two lines.

"Bundele Harbolo Ke Mooh Humne suni Kahani Thi"
"Khoob Ladi Mardani, Woh To Jhansi Wali Rani Thi"

BundeleKhand is the name of the region around Jhansi and Budles are
the local people. It basically means "We heard the legend of Great
Female but Masculiene warrior who was the queen of Jhansi"

I would say at that time in the society of India and probably even the
world and even today woman are not actively involved in wars. She was
a great legend of that era.

read your explanation late seems like agra fort check these out.

http://travel.indiamart.com/uttar-pradesh/forts/gifs/agra-fort.jpg
http://www.mskousen.com/OddsandTrends/img/Agra-Fort-India.jpg
http://www.amrita-it.com/india/dia/Agra%20Fort%203.jpg
http://www.destinationrajasthan.com/tour-packages/gifs/agra-fort.jpg
http://www.pcug.org.au/~alanlevy/Thumbnails/Images/Delhi-Agra-Jaipur/AgraFort.JPG
http://www.logincalcutta.com/tours/images/RedFort2.jpg