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Subject:
Specific Retirement Planning Software Sought
Category: Business and Money > Finance Asked by: alexduncan-ga List Price: $20.00 |
Posted:
01 Feb 2006 10:12 PST
Expires: 14 Feb 2006 09:25 PST Question ID: 440120 |
There are a number of programs designed to simulate market behaviour for retirement planning purposes. Two of the better known programs are RRIFmetric and RetireWare. There are three main methodologies for doing this: 1. straight line projection, 2. Monte Carlo simulation, 3. major market cycle simulation. The "flavour of the month" in retirement planning has become Monte Carlo simulation, which simulates random variability in returns of various categories of securities depending on the particular portfolio asset mix, then runs thousands of scenarios over a specified time horizon to evaluate the probability of one's retirement goals being achieved based on specified monetary inputs. However, as Otar (www.retirementoptimizer.com) and others have pointed out, Monte Carlo simulation only simulates short term market cycles - long term or major market cycles or corrections are entirely ignored. Otar (q.v.) developed a program that uses the actual historical data of the 20th century instead of assumptions about volatility and return to test retirement planning projections. He found that Monte Carlo simulations are invariably far too optimistic and actually fail when tested historically, a claim that I too have confirmed using his software. However, my objection to Otar's approach is that the 20th century itself is only one possible scenario and that it should be possible to elaborate Monte Carlo simulation into a more comprehensive approach that uses simular principles to superimpose long term variations onto the short term fluctations, using historical corrections, durations, recovery times, and intervening periodicities to allow one to test a retirement projection against a simulation that incorporates thousands of scenarios based on both minor AND major market cycles. I am trying to find a retirement planning program similar in principle to RRIFmetric, RetireWare, and Otar that goes beyond Monte Carlo simulation in just the manner that I have described above, and is not limited to historical market data, but despite several intriguing leads I have been unable to find such a program. Yet such a program should not be that much harder to develop than the existing Monte Carlo simulations and I am hopeful that it exists. Your mission, should you decide to accept it, is to find such a program available online for free or for purchase. |
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There is no answer at this time. |
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Subject:
Re: Specific Retirement Planning Software Sought
From: ubiquity-ga on 01 Feb 2006 16:31 PST |
Two comments: First, looking to historical data is largely not used anymore, especially data that would cover the entire 20th century. Many financiers see historical data as irrelevant and prefer to use the random walk notion. Second, it is very difficult to design a program of the type you are asking for, not because the variable are difficult to understand, but because it could be a violation of securities laws to recommend securities to individuals. (That requires a securities license) |
Subject:
Re: Specific Retirement Planning Software Sought
From: alexduncan-ga on 02 Feb 2006 15:34 PST |
Hi! thanks for your comments. Just to clarify, I hold an FMA professional financial designaton so do have some knowledge in this area. With respect to your first point, while it is true that historical returns cannot predict future results, markets do exhibit some regularities within broad limits with a high level of probability. For example, it is highly improbable that tomorrow morning the markets will be 50% lower. Over the long term market returns are about 11%. There are regular bull and bear market cycles of varying severity, durations, recovery times, and intermittent intervals, within broad limits, superimposed on short term volatility that also exhibits certain characteristics. The notion that markets are totally random is an academic dogma that is becoming increasingly doubtful, especially amongst professional investors. Buckminster Fuller has stated this as long ago as 1938. That said, there are high levels of variability and that is why sophisticated modelling programs are so desirable. One cannot make any plan at all without making some sort of assumptions. The point is that Monte Carlo simulation is simplistic, and that tested against historical data, it fails. Consequently a more sophisticated model is desirable. With respect to your second point, such a program as I describe does not violate securities legislation, and such programs already exist. I instanced RRIFmetric, RetireWare, and Otar, and there are others. For one thing, the Securities Act prohibits the recommendation of specific securities. The program that I describe does not do this, or indeed "recommend" anything. Second, educators, writers and publishers are exempt from this restricton, provided any such "recommendation" is secondary to their educational, writing, or publishing activity. To apply this restriction to any of these areas would violate fundamental Constitutional liberties of freedom of speech and self expression. A Disclaimer such as the following would be sufficient to obviate any such restriction: "This software is intended for research and educational purposes only. Nothing herein shall be construed as advising others as to the selling or buying of specific securities." |
Subject:
Re: Specific Retirement Planning Software Sought
From: ubiquity-ga on 02 Feb 2006 19:00 PST |
With regard to your first rebuttal; well.. sure there is an expectation of return... and in equity markets historically it has been 11%. But to go by secotr or individual security, you'll find the deviations are too massive to be useful other than, yeah, things should go up over time. In your original post, i was unable to glean your purpose. I assumed it was to help people to choose investments thatthey would actually invest in. |
Subject:
Re: Specific Retirement Planning Software Sought
From: alexduncan-ga on 03 Feb 2006 15:19 PST |
Thanks for your continuing interest. All such comments are more than welcome. Hopefully they will be useful to others too. Well, retirement programs don't go by sector or individual security. Actuaries use asset class, typically cash, real estate, bonds, Canadian stocks, U.S. stocks, and international stocks, and there are meaningful average differences between these categories over the long term (all retirement plannng should be long term, you really should have an explicit retirement plan in place by age 40 at the latest - the shorter your time horizon the more uncertain your plan). A retirement plan is typically built up based on percentage allocations to different asset classes based on risk tolerance and need for return (also based on one's general philosophy of markets and investing and what one is willing or able to do). ULTIMATELY, of course, one has to choose specific securities, but this goes beyond retirement planning per se, as you pointed out. Good financial planning works from the "outside in," and is synthetic or holistic - SYNERGY. Specific securities selection is actually the last, not the first, step. Many people err in this regard, however. An interesting way of introducing long term cycles to retirement planning in a programming environment might be emphasizing more recent severities, durations, recovery times, and intervening intervals more than older periods, like the difference between a moving average and a weighted moving average (used by technical analysts). Whether this would make for better planning who can say? I don't have corrections data for longer than the period from 1960 to the present. I'm not sure reliable numbers are available for much further back than the early 20th century. This whole area is still extremely new, and there are opportunities for far more refined analysis than what exists. I recommend you take a look at RetireWare (www.retireware.com) and Otar (www.retirementoptimizer.com) to see what's been done. Then you will have a much deeper understanding of what is still possible. I wish I had the programming skill myself to develop these ideas further. I would like to develop these skills myself, or perhaps work on a collaborative basis with someone who would like to explore these possibilities, in which we could educate each other, but there are only so many hours in the day. Hence my interest in finding a program that already does this. |
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