re: the Fugger family of Augsberg, Germany

Were they Jewish?  Did they follow the Catholic faith?  Any if on this
would be appreciated.

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Clarification of Question by timespacette-ga on 03 Feb 2006 01:22 PST

correction:  'any info on this would be appreciated.'

Dear Timespacette, 

First, on a personal note, nice to see you back on GA. 

The Fuggers were from Augsburg (with a "u"), a city in southern
Germany (today in Bavaria). They were Catholic. There is/was also a
chappel, "The Fugger Chappel", in St. Afra church in Augsburg
[Catholic Encyclopaedia, 1911: " The church of Sts. Ulrich and Afra,
built 1467-1594, in the Gothic style, contains the tomb of St. Ulrich,
the stone sarcophagus of St. Afra, the Fugger chapel with the memorial
to Hans Fugger, and three magnificent altars in rococo style.",
<http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/02073b.htm>].

The Fuggerei is another project funded by the family. It is a set of
low-income housing for Catholic artisans and day-labourers (I believe
that today we would have called it "council flats"), funded by Fugger
and partially by the Church.
Augsburg -- Old, Walled City of the Fuggers 
<http://www.tompgalvin.com/places/de/bayern/augsburg.htm> 

See: 
Europe's bridge to the modern age, in: "Family Business Magazine"
<http://www.familybusinessmagazine.com/pantheon.html> 

However, the Fuggers, despite not being Jewish, held Hebrew manuscripts: 
"Hebrew manuscripts have also been in the collections of non-Jews from
the medieval period on. In Augsburg, Germany, Johann Jakob Fugger
(1516-75) had an excellent collection, including the earliest
illuminated Hebrew manuscript from Germany." (SOURCE: "Forming the
Great Collections", The New York Public Library,
<http://www.fathom.com/course/72810016/session4.html>).

I hope this answers your question. Please contact me if you need any
clarification on this answer, before you rate it. My search terms
were: Fugger Augsburg church, Fugger Augsburg "jewish OR juedische",
Fugger Augsburg "catholic OR katholische", Fugger Augsburg , Fugger
Augsberg

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Request for Answer Clarification by timespacette-ga on 21 Feb 2006 13:39 PST

Hi pg-ga, Sorry it's taken so long for me to get back ... do you think
what frde-ga says below is correct?  Goldsmith = Jewish?

Your link to Family Business Magazine was interesting, especially the
comment about Anton and Hans Fugger coming to England.   I asked my
first question relating to the Fugger family here:

http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=234483

when I was trying to find the link between Germany and England, or
Ireland especially, where my known ancestors came from.  I wonder how
I could hone in on these two and see if any of their descendants went
over to Ireland?

I suppose I should post a new question . . .

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Clarification of Answer by politicalguru-ga on 22 Feb 2006 02:25 PST

Dear Timespacette, 

First of all, Mayoarin is right - Goldsmith doesn't have to be Jewish.
Moreover (regarding the Rothchilds), they have not married into
aristocracy, they have gained their titles themselves (in the early
19th century and onwards). In fact, the Rothchilds at first married
only closely trusted people, and were religious - married only Jews.
Later, some members of the family have married non-Jews, bringing them
into the aristocracy . See:
Mayer Amschel Rothschild family 
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mayer_Amschel_Rothschild_family> 

In addition, here's a genealogical list of Fuggers - I'm afraid that
none in that list (as far as I could tell, I might not have gone
thoroughly enough through it) has any connection to Ireland, though I
find it plausible that someone who was in England has found his way to
Ireland or married an Irish immigrant in England (thus making her
family distant relatives of the Fuggers).

Die Genealogie (Genealogy) der Fugger  
<http://www.gen.heinz-wember.de/fugger/> 

So, sorry, no help here. Perhaps you should ask Scriptor? If there is
anything out there, he'll find it.

Thanks so much for your help; that 'die Geneologie der Fugger' is a great find!  

So, does Scriptor read German?

Your question intrigued me, but the question was (justifiably) locked
when I came to post.

Basically it looks as if Fugger(one) was a weaver who made good as a trader

One of his kids married a Goldsmith's daughter (Goldsmith is
synonymous with banking) and astonishingly he became a banker.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fugger

|Hans Fugger's younger son, Jakob the Elder, founded another branch of
the family, This branch progressed more steadily and they became known
as the 'Fuggers of the Lily' after their chosen arms of a flowering
lily on a gold and blue background. Jakob was a master weaver, a
merchant and an alderman, and married Barbara Basinger, the daughter
of a goldsmith. His fortune progressed, and by 1461, he was the 12th
richest man in Augsburg. He died in 1469.|

My guess is that they were a sort of inverted Rothschild family, the
(Jewish)Rothchilds sort of married into the aristocracy, and it is
likely that the Fuggers merged with what might well be a Jewish
family.

I would suggest that if they were not originally, then they were
later, which would have been rather useful in the banking area.

I don't think one can make an immediate assumption goldsmith = Jew,
especially in Augsburg at that time, when there were many goldsmiths
there, organized in one or more guilds (Zunft), which are generally
considered not to have accepted Jews as members.

Here is a site with some information:
http://oit.boisestate.edu/sknox/dissertation/CH1.html

Timespacette, 

First of all, thank you for the rating and the tip. 

Scriptor (as well as myself) read German. I consider him the House
expert in genealogy - though I can find stuff, he can find the
unfindable.