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Q: Clarification on the "Do Not Call" list ( Answered 5 out of 5 stars,   3 Comments )
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Subject: Clarification on the "Do Not Call" list
Category: Miscellaneous
Asked by: 11boomer-ga
List Price: $40.00
Posted: 16 Jan 2005 06:53 PST
Expires: 15 Feb 2005 06:53 PST
Question ID: 458043
I think the companies of 5 employess or less are exempt from the "Do
Not Call" list. Can you verify that with a governmental agency? The
donotcall.com website didn't cover it. And is it 5 or less, or under
5?

Request for Question Clarification by denco-ga on 16 Jan 2005 14:06 PST
Howdy 11boomer-ga,

As my colleague joey-ga quite correctly points out below, there does not
appear to be any exemption to the "Do Not Call" rules as you describe.

If you want, I can provide the Federal Trade Commission (FTC) and Federal
Communications Commission (FCC) exemptions that do exist.

Looking Forward, denco-ga - Google Answers Researcher

Request for Question Clarification by cynthia-ga on 17 Jan 2005 04:19 PST
11boomer,

In regards to the Federal Do Not Call Registry, there are Federal, and
State Exemptions.

California has an exemption that allows businesses with not more than
5 employees or independant contracctors to call within a 50 mile
radius.  Other states have exemptions, however California is the only
one with a "5 employee" rule.

If you would like source material, and links to all the different
state exemptions, I would be happy to post those as the Answer.

~~Cynthia

Clarification of Question by 11boomer-ga on 17 Jan 2005 05:14 PST
Thank you Cynthia, I qualify for the 50-mile rule, so I would like to
see the specific California state laws, and whether or not they
supercede the FTC's laws.  Other states don't matter, so don't worry
about those, Thanks for your help, boomer
Answer  
Subject: Re: Clarification on the "Do Not Call" list
Answered By: cynthia-ga on 17 Jan 2005 14:47 PST
Rated:5 out of 5 stars
 
11boomer,

Some states have enacted law that gives exemptions to the FTC's Do Not
Call Registry.  Indeed, California is the only state that has passed a
bill to allow calls from businesses with five or less employees.  This
included part-time employees and independent contractors.

..."By an individual businessperson or a small business employing no
more than five full or part-time employees or independent
contractors..."


Here is the source material I have:

BILL NUMBER: SB 771 (cached.. so you can scroll to the relevant text)
APPROVED BY GOVERNOR  OCTOBER 10, 2001
PASSED THE SENATE  SEPTEMBER 12, 2001
PASSED THE ASSEMBLY  SEPTEMBER 12, 2001
http://216.239.63.104/search?q=cache:7W3U81MqOioJ:info.sen.ca.gov/pub/01-02/bill/sen/sb_0751-0800/sb_771_bill_20011010_chaptered.html+%22no+more+than+five+full+or+part-time+employees%22++california&hl=en

Here it is again at FindLaw:

BUSINESS AND PROFESSIONS CODE SECTION 17590-17594
http://caselaw.findlaw.com/cacodes/bpc/17590-17594.html


The California Exemption (see number 5):

..."

1) Pursuant to the express agreement in writing of the subscriber to place calls
2) Pursuant to the express request of the subscriber (but not calls
made 30 business days after the last date on which the subscriber
contacted a business with an inquiry about a potential purchase; calls
made 30 business days after the last date the subscriber consented to
being contacted; calls made after a request not to be called; or calls
made 30 business days after a product or service becomes available);
3) In connection with the collection of a debt or the offer by a
creditor of an extension of credit;
4) When there is an established business relationship within the 18
months immediately preceding the date of the call;
5) By an individual businessperson or a small business employing no
more than five full or part-time employees or independent contractors;
6) Solely to verify that a subscriber has terminated an established
business relationship;
7) By tax-exempt charitable organizations;*
8) For the purpose of soliciting a donation without the purchase of
goods or services;
8) Business-to-business.

..."


Here's a great chart showing all the exemptions by state:

DNC List - Order Information By State
http://www3.dncsolution.com/marketing/reginfo/reginfo6.asp


The State of California - Office of the Attorney General:

Do Not Call List FAQ's
http://caag.state.ca.us/donotcall/faq.htm#q.htm  
..."The law does allow calls from charities and debt collectors, and
from businesses with which you have an established business
relationship. It also allows calls from the owner of local businesses
within 50 miles of your home. For more information on established
business relationships, see question 10. By federal law, you may ask
businesses to put you on their own do not call lists..."


FTC - Do Not Call Information:
TOLL FREE:  1-888-382-1222

CA Attorney General's Public Inquiry Unit for the "Do Not Call" Registry: 
PHONE:  1-888-398-7867
I called it, it's geared for consumer complaints and does not mention exemptions.


If I can be of further assistance in regards to the five employee/50
mile radius telemarketing (DNC) exemption in California, please don't
hesitate to ask via the "Request For Clarification" feature.


~~Cynthia


Search strategy used at Google:
"Do Not Call" "state exemptions"
"no more than five full or part-time employees"

Request for Answer Clarification by 11boomer-ga on 17 Jan 2005 16:23 PST
Cynthia, you are a goddess - do you know if the State law overrides
the fed? It must, it was made about the same time

Clarification of Answer by cynthia-ga on 17 Jan 2005 20:14 PST
There is some confusion in regards to whether State or Federal Law
supercedes.  I'll provide all the conflicting information, most recent
first, and let you decide...

The most recent information is this:

Feb 2004 - Do-Not-Call Rules Enforcement Begins
http://www.phoneplusmag.com/articles/421feat04.html
Effect on state do-not-call lists. The federal rules and registry
constitute a floor and supercede any less restrictive state
do-not-call rules. Many states may have their own registries and rules
regarding intrastate telemarketing, however, any telephone numbers
within that state on the national registry also must be placed on the
state registry. Telemarketers placing intrastate telemarketing calls
must also be aware of these state registries and regulations to
prevent violating state-specific rules. The FCC?s rules do not specify
whether federal regulation will preempt state regulation of interstate
telemarketing calls.


Oct/Nov 2003 - This is written  in regards to Realtors, but is still applicable:
http://www.ncmar.com/donotcallquestions.html
What if my state has a "do not call" rule that provides an exemption
for real estate licensees or other real estate activity exemption?
Does the FCC rule still apply to intrastate calls that are permitted
under my state's law?

Yes. The FCC action preempts state law that is less restrictive. A
state do not call law that provided an exemption for real estate
licensees would be considered less restrictive and therefore
preempted, prohibiting real estate professionals in that state from
making intrastate calls to persons on the Federal list,
notwithstanding the state exemption. It is also important that other
exemptions in the state law such as those for existing business
relationships be considered when determining compliance requirements.


Prior to that, here's information at the Newspaper Association of America web site:

Federal Trade Commission Revisions to the Telemarketing Sales Rule
Establishing a National "Do Not Call" List
Updated - February 4, 2003
http://www.naa.org/artpage.cfm?AID=4769&SID=1043
State Do Not Call Lists: The FTC rule does not preempt state "do not
call" lists. Although the FTC is attempting to harmonize the national
registry with state lists, the FTC has not fully explained how it will
handle state exemptions. Six states out of 27 have exempted newspapers
specifically from obligations to comply with state "do not call"
rules.


The FCC seems to be taking a more stringent stance:

States' "Do Not Call" Lists
http://www.sia.com/state_affairs/html/do-not-call.html
..."States are not required to discontinue the use of their own
do-not-call lists once the national do-not-call registry goes into
effect. The federal rules constitute a "floor" and therefore, states
may adopt more restrictive do-not-call laws governing intrastate
telemarketing.

Comment: The commission did not preempt state-administered do-not-call
lists but will coordinate with the states to harmonize their lists
with the national registry.  Nothing done in the FCC's rule prohibits
states from enforcing state regulations that are consistent with the
federal law in state court. SIA believes the FCC rules preserve the
authority of the states to address violations of their do-not-call
list but (1) the state lists must be part of the national list and (2)
violations would include calling a person on the national list even
though the state had its own exception for such a call......The states
could not be more restrictive than the federal commission in terms of
do-not-call provisions. So, for example, a state could not prohibit
calls from a nonprofit if such calls are permitted under federal law.
Similarly, states could not provide exemptions to permit certain
businesses (e.g., securities) to make calls if such exemptions are not
included in the federal rules..."


You will want to keep an eye on this page at the National Association
of Attorneys Genneral (CA is a participant):

Multistate Actions: Don?t preempt state No Call efforts, Attorneys
General tell FTC regarding national No Call registry proposal
http://www.naag.org/issues/20020412-multi-no_call.php


Here's a discussion relevant to your query:

FEDERAL TRADE COMMISSION - RULEMAKING WORKSHOP - WEDNESDAY, JUNE 5, 2002
STARTS ON LINE 13 OF PAGE 19: 

13 Well, let's get right to the issue of interplay
14 between the proposed FTC national do-not-call list and
15 state lists and laws, and the opening question is, how
16 should the state programs, lists and laws interface
17 with an FTC rule and national registry should it be
18 adopted? What should the interface be? 


DOING BUSINESS? The Law & You 
Prospecting Alert - Careless cold calling could be costly.  

..." In 2001 alone, eight states?Colorado, California, Indiana,
Louisiana, Texas, Virginia, Wisconsin and Wyoming?passed do-not-call
laws, and all the remaining states have legislation
pending......Generally, the ensuing state laws establish do-not-call
lists on which consumers may register. State laws often further
protect consumers by expanding call curfews, as is the case in
Kentucky, where the call curfew is 6 p.m. to 10 a.m. State violations
can result in fines ranging from $2,000 (New York) to $25,000
(Oregon).

States often exempt certain types of callers, including charities,
non-profits, and political groups from their do-not-call law.

A few states?Alaska, Arkansas, and Indiana?have specifically exempted
real estate salespeople (sometimes referred to as "state licensees").
And other state exemptions may apply to the real estate industry. The
most common state exemption permits calls to consumers if a prior
business relationship existed within a certain time period, up to as
long as three years ago in some cases.

However, even if real estate salespeople are exempt from the law in
your state, take heed. Consumers registered on do-not-call lists
aren't likely to be aware of these exemptions and may believe that
your call violates the law. Making calls to these already irritated
consumers could hurt your business..."

Additionally, there are 5 tips near the bottom of that link:

..."How to protect yourself - Here are precautions you can take to avoid fines:

1. Know the laws. It's your responsibility to be aware of applicable
state and federal laws, including specifics such as call curfews,
dinner hour restrictions, and Sunday and holiday curfews. ..."  [more
at the link above]


=========================================================================

In a perfect world... the State Law preempts the Federal Law.  Since
state law was enacted to provide for these exemptions, by a majority
of the citizens, a complainant would have to challenge the State LAW,
not you, or your company -personally.  Complaints would be made to the
FTC or the State of California.  If a consumer was unhappy with the 5
employee/50 mile radius exemption they would be refered to the
California Attorney General's Office.

If I were you, I would craft a carefully worded letter to the
California Attorney General and get a written determination.  I think
it would be in your favor, but considering the confusion, I could be
wrong.


~~Cynthia


Additional search terms used at Google:
"do not call" state exemptions preempt
11boomer-ga rated this answer:5 out of 5 stars and gave an additional tip of: $10.00
Excellent research when 4 other googlers were wrong, thanks a million

Comments  
Subject: Re: Clarification on the "Do Not Call" list
From: joey-ga on 16 Jan 2005 13:43 PST
 
I can't find any such exemption anywhere in any of the FTC rules,
bulletins, and updates in the Federal Register, nor in the legislation
by Congress.

I think you may have been misinformed.

--Joey
Subject: Re: Clarification on the "Do Not Call" list
From: denco-ga on 19 Jan 2005 13:18 PST
 
Howdy 11boomer-ga,

Before you go out and buy new phones, you might want to consider this press
announcement from the FCC (Federal Communicationsommission) which spells
things out very clearly.  It is dated dated June 26, 2003.
http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DOC-235841A1.pdf

"The Federal Communications Commission today updated its rules implementing
the Telephone Consumer Protection Act of 1991 (TCPA) and established a national
do-not-call registry for consumers who wish to avoid telemarketing calls. The
registry is nationwide in scope, includes all telemarketers (with the exception
of certain non-profit organizations), and covers both interstate and intrastate
telemarketing calls.
...
The federal rules constitute a floor and therefore supercede all less
restrictive state do-not-call rules. States may adopt more restrictive
do-not-call laws governing intrastate telemarketing. When Congress enacted
the TCPA it gave the Commission jurisdiction over both interstate and
intrastate telemarketing calls with the intent generally to promote a uniform
regulatory scheme."

You might want to pay particular attention to the following sentence incuded
above:

"The federal rules constitute a floor and therefore supercede all less
restrictive state do-not-call rules."

I would suggest strongly that you contact the FCC for their opinion, but
the above language does not appear to contain any ambiguity at all.

http://www.fcc.gov/cgb
888-225-5322
fccinfo@fcc.gov

Looking Forward, denco-ga - Google Answers Researcher
Subject: Re: Clarification on the "Do Not Call" list
From: cynthia-ga on 19 Jan 2005 14:42 PST
 
11boomer,

THANK YOU so very much for the 5 stars, the kind words, and the
Generous tip!  The cool thing about Google Answers is that we all have
our niches.  I knew *how* to search for your information.  There are
many examples of my being wrong and other Researchers knowing *how* to
search for a given query.  Having access to over 500 Researchers is a
wonderful thing.  Thanks for using our service, and I hope you refer
us, and use us again.

~~Cynthia

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