Do we all go to heaven when we die?. From my Bible study, I already
know we do not, but am very interested in other views. And considering
Revelation 14;1, 144,000 chosen ones will,or have already, ...who have
been bought [paid for] from the earth...Romans 3;23, 6;23..Genesis
3;19,..Ecclesiastes 9;5,10...Psalm 146;4..Ecclesiastes 9;6..Isaiah
26;14.

Nope.

Certainly not ALL of us.

Just us goodies.

From your question, I infer you are interested in non-Biblical
positions, since you already know what the Bible teaches on the
subject.  So are you interested in what, e.g., the Quran, the Bhagavad
Gita, and the I-Ching have to say about life after death, or are you
interested in the GA communities' various Biblical interpretations?

No, not everyone.
It's just you, me and some dude named Floyd. 
See you there.

As Billy Joel sang, "I'd rather laugh with the sinners than cry with the saints."

Ill tell you when I get there, meanwhile........

Work like you don't need the money.
Love like you've never been hurt. 
Dance like nobody's watching.
Sing like nobody's listening. 
Live like it's Heaven on Earth.

Anne-Marie

Do we all go to heaven? -- well, we go somewhere - I figure it this
way, some get to go to nice neighborhoods and other get to go to bad
neighborhoods.  Now me, I'd like to go to Pinkfreud block. :-)

I'm not sure if I believe in Heaven or even Hell.

Some people feel that life is a living hell.

Me? When its my time, I'd rather go with the *fun* crowd :)

Steph53

Not immediately, but you will eventually end up there.  You may need
to repent and do other things before you are ready for heaven.

http://www.otherplane.com/para/release.htm

http://www.allaboutcounseling.com/BBoards/BBContentv.cfm?BBId=3&ThreadID=6216&UID=1168&DateSelect=-600&GO=1

http://www.vast-horizons.com/Intro_/Author/TofC_Intro_/Chapter_1/Chp__2/chp__25.html

I hope not.  I'd rather go someplace real, even if it's just the
compost heap, than spend eternity in a state of delusion.

Pul-eeze. Transcension to a place of mythology would indeed be a great
feat. Hellish place anyway -- full of Christians.

The Bible, Panchatantra, Koran, Egyptian Book of the Dead etc -- take
your pick. Interesting stories.

See you in Valhalla -- or perhaps not.

Funny thing ...

Anyone else want to take a stab at what I noticed on this peanut gallery session???

Steph53

Steph53,

I'll bite.  Was what you noticed a lack of comments from researchers?

--efn

To all commenters; I am amazed at the response. But it seems everyone
has their own personal view on the subject. Some tended to ridicule a
bit [ their attitude is and was noted [ Second Peter 3;3,4]. Only
Crythias stated outright, No! and although being correct, did not
expand on the answer. For Ipfan, are there other religious texts that
specifically mention the subject. Personal views from researchers
would be interesting. Lets see if you motley crew [ that's seaman's
talk] can back up your comments with hard facts and references. Again
respectfully, Pug.

Well spotted, Steph53, I do believe that pugwashjw-ga has seriously
challenged The Respected 500.

I bet that they've all been frantically Searching the 8,058,044,651
web pages, using Advanced Search and stuff and none can find the
Answer.

Surely someone?

How about Omniscient? He must have seen something up there in the clouds.

Or Indiana Digsalot? Still digging? Or not yet finished his supper?

Or Answerfinder? Britain's finest.

A little extra for Bowler. In the three links you posted, they are all
about three individual views. Nary a scripture in sight to back up
what they think/believe. This could go on for a while.

Actually, I met a woman a few weeks ago who told me that she had died twice.

On the last occasion, when she arrived in Heaven, the angels grabbed
their harps and started playing for her.

She reponded by grabbing her guitar and joining in.

But then St Peter arrived and told her that she was obviously not ill
enough to be in Heaven and so he sent her back to Earth.

So, beware ... You might get to Heaven but you might then get kicked
out unless St Peter takes a shine to you.

Me? I'm looking forward to meeting lots of old friends up there but
evidently not Crythias ... I feel quite sure that he's the type who
would start banging away on his guitar and ruin the place for the rest
of us.

I hope you didn't take my response as anything but perfectly sincere.

I would expect researchers to avoid trying to answer an unanswerable
question.  That prospect doesn't deter those of us who are
hair-trigger opinionators.

Archae0pteryx

Of course, my church affiliation is Baptist, so the belief system is
the standard: For all have sinned and come short of the Glory of God.
The wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through
Jesus Christ our Lord.
For God so loved the world that He gave his only begotten Son, that
whosoever believeth in Him, should not perish, but have ever lasting
life. God sent not His Son into the world to condemn the world, but
that the World through Him might be saved.
Jesus is going to prepare a place for His followers. In His father's
house are many mansions. If it were not so, Jesus would have told
them.  "And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and
take you to be with me that you also may be where I am."

John 17:
I pray also for those who will believe in me through their message,
21that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am
in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you
have sent me. 22I have given them the glory that you gave me, that
they may be one as we are one: 23I in them and you in me. May they be
brought to complete unity to let the world know that you sent me and
have loved them even as you have loved me. 24?Father, I want those you
have given me to be with me where I am, and to see my glory, the glory
you have given me because you loved me before the creation of the
world. 25?Righteous Father, though the world does not know you, I know
you, and they know that you have sent me. 26I have made you known to
them, and will continue to make you known in order that the love you
have for me may be in them and that I myself may be in them.?

So, this is my very exclusive stance. Since the 144,000 are
representatives of the twelve tribes of Israel (read: Jewish), I doubt
I, or most JW's for that matter would make the cut. I think most
people would rather play the lottery and have better odds.

Before asking that question, one might ask themself three others:
1. Does matter give rise to mind (consciousness)?
2. Does matter exist parallel with the mind?
3. Does mind give rise to matter?

Once your belief is unyielding, the original question need not be asked.

I thought pugwashjw-ga was simply interested in other views. 
Hopefully mainstream views, and not unique personal beliefs.  I once
saw a chart comparing Christian religions and their differing beliefs.
 This was very interesting to me, and I will try to find it again.  It
probably talked about this.  It only lists Christian religions though.
 Differing beliefs of what heaven is would also be interesting.

Revelation 7:4-8
"Then I heard the number of those who were sealed: 144,000 from all
the tribes of Israel. From the tribe of Judah 12,000 were sealed, from
the tribe of Reuben 12,000, from the tribe of Gad 12,000, from the
tribe of Asher 12,000, from the tribe of Naphtali 12,000, from the
tribe of Manasseh 12,000, from the tribe of Simeon 12,000, from the
tribe of Levi 12,000, from the tribe of Issachar 12,000, 8from the
tribe of Zebulun 12,000, from the tribe of Joseph 12,000, from the
tribe of Benjamin 12,000."

These are the 144,000 you refered to Pug.  Now read about the "multitude":

Revelation 7:9
"After this I looked and there before me was a great multitude that no
one could count, from every nation, tribe, people and language,
standing before the throne and in front of the Lamb. They were wearing
white robes and were holding palm branches in their hands."
And I quote "a great multitude that NO ONE COULD COUNT".  I'm certain
that I could count to 144,000 given some time, and I'm also certain
that many people in this world are far better counters than myself. 
Go beyond 1 or 2 million and I doubt my ability to count that many
people.

So who are these people of the great multitude?

Revelation 7:13-17
"Then one of the elders asked me, ?These in white robes?who are they,
and where did they come from?
I answered, 'Sir, you know.' 
And he said, 'These are they who have come out of the great
tribulation; they have washed their robes and made them white in the
blood of the Lamb.' Therefore, they are before the throne of God and
serve him day and night in his temple; and he who sits on the throne
will spread his tent over them. Never again will they hunger; never
again will they thirst. The sun will not beat upon them, nor any
scorching heat. For the Lamb at the center of the throne will be their
shepherd; he will lead them to springs of living water. And God will
wipe away every tear from their eyes."

It sounds to me that this great multitude that cannot be counted will
be in heaven with God.  So from this we can gather that a great
uncountable multitude of people will be in heaven after the great
tribulation.  And from what others have posted it seems clear (and I
agree) that not everyone will go to heaven.

So the answer to you question Pug is that: No, not everyone will go to
heaven.  But unless 144,000 is uncountable then more than 144,000
people will go to heaven.

Nowhere does the Bible does it teach that anyone goes to heaven,it's
called the Kingdom OF Heaven not the Kingdom IN Heaven.

Mister, that is an interesting comment.  I'm curious as to what
difference you take that to mean (the difference between kingdom in
heaven vs kingdom of heaven).  If the arguement you're making is
simply that the Kingdom encompasses all of Heaven as opposed to the
Kingdom only being a part of Heaven then I see where the word of might
be more appropriate, however not necessary since you can be in
something and still take up the entire space within the object.  Or if
your arguement is that Heaven is the Kingdom, I think that is also
understood clearly with the terms that have been used "kingdom in
heaven" however again, I'll agree that "kingdom of heaven" is more
specific.

If there is a more sophisticated arguement that you're making that I
should have pulled from your brief statement then I'm most interested
and would love to hear more of what you have to say about this.

That depends upon your definition of "heaven". if you mean "eternal
peace", then yes. If you mean some place made up of clouds and winged
angels, then of course not, since no place like that exists except in
Hollywood, and most people don't go there when they die.

It would take too long to explain all of what I believe and
why,however I'd like to think my beliefs are scriptural and
not(overly)influenced by any religious denomination(as I assume
everybody does)Think of it this way,The Kingdom of Heaven is used as a
synonym for the Kingdom of God which makes no sense as th Kingdom IN
God,although this may be hair splitting,it may be a good idea to try
to take God at HIS word.Amen

mister2u-ga, this makes no sense at all. Heaven is heaven and God is
IN heaven, and Jesus is IN heaven, at the right hand of God. Jesus
isn't IN God, and God isn't IN Himself...

But the extrapolation is that if God is ubiquitous, then the
encompassing of God's ubiquitousness (ubiquity?) (heaven) must also be
everywhere, and so God's presence in us is heaven where we are (based
upon what can be inferred from mister2u-ga that God doesn't exist
outside of heaven). It follows from that point of view that where God
is, heaven must also be. Further, nobody has to "go" to heaven,
because heaven must be a superset of where God is, and since God is
everywhere, heaven is everywhere.

pugwashjw,
I have a question for you about one of your comments. "Lets see if you
motley crew [ that's seaman's talk] can back up your comments with
hard facts and references."

Do you believe that there are "ANY" hard facts about a subject such as this? 
If so, could you provide me with one?

This question is coming along nicely. And its probably wise of the GA
researchers to just sit back and watch.
For Jack ; tHE 144,000 are a specific number of ones chosen by God,
out of all the billions who have ever lived [ a very small percentage]
These one have always done what God wants [ love God and their fellow
man] Bible translators such as Wycliffe and Martin Luther may be among
them. The Popes who executed them because they went against the [then]
established church will NOT be.
Revelation 4 verse 9 states.."AFTER these things [ the 144,000] I saw
and look!, a great crowd,

contd.  ..which no man was able to number...out of all nations and
tribes  and peoples and tongues, standing before the throne in white
robes, and there were plm branches in their hands". These ones are
separate from the 144,000 because NO MAN was able to number them. IF
they were in heaven, where no man exists, God himself would know their
exact number and the scripture would be superfluous. It is only on
earth that the scripture makes sence. The rest of the verses 11 to 17
relate to "those who come out of the great tribulation"..the cleansing
of earth by God, verse 14.
verse 15 says they will continue to worship God and not suffer anymore
[ Rev. 20;4] they will not hunger or thirst because the earth has been
restored to a breadbasket [ paradise] and verse 17 says they will
continue to follow Jesus' instructions. This is backed up by Psalm
37;11, 29 and 34, which Jesus himself had access to and did not
refute. ...and he will exalt you to take possession of the earth. So
the 144,000 will go to heaven to be kings and priests with Jesus [
Rev. 5;10] as spiritual beings and the rest of humanity will be
resurrected back to the earth [ I know..billions..but a productive
earth can support them.

for Joatman..Yes! I am very interested in everything that is said. It
would be nice though if commenters could give us an idea of where and
when they came to their conclusions, e.g. via their priest, or family
or books.
for Crythias.. Your one of the few to actually quote the Bible. But
God left us the WHOLE Bible. If you take some scriptures by
themselves, they can be misleading. I feel it must be taken as a
complete whole. About heaven and where it is, it must be on a
different "plane of existence" to that of physical earth, but it is
certainly NOT on or around earth [ Rev. 12;12] The Devil has been
ejected from heaven to the vicinity of earth. And woe to us because of
that.
for Sucker 5..The hard facts are all around us. Simply, God [ and
Jesus] made the earth and everything we are aware of. No man can make
a tree. And the theory of Evolution is just that..a theory. And the
Bible, both parts, has been around longer than any other known book.
As to whether it has been altered drastically over the years, well,
God would make sure that its message was not contaminated. Revelation
22 verse 18.."[ written by John, the last surviving Apostle] I am
bearing witness to everyone that hears the words of the prophecy of
this scroll [Bible] ; If anyone makes an addition to these things, God
will add to him the plagues that are written in this scroll; [19] and
if anyone takes anything away from the words of the scroll of this
prophecy, God will take his portion away from the trees of life, and
out of the holy city, things which are written about in this scroll.
and verse 5 "Write, because these things are faithful and true".

Just a small word on Pug's "And the Bible, both parts, has been around
longer than any other known book":

This is not actually the case. We have quite a large number of books
from centuries before the New Testament was written, or before the
events in it took place. Some are religious, some less so. (Plato,
Aristotle, Socrates, Confucius, Mencius, the Babylonian cuneiform
writings, and so on.) We even have some writings that date back to
near the time of the Old Testament or even before (though here dating
becomes tricky): principally, the Vedas of India, but ancient Chinese
and Greek writings, as well.

Also, Pug wrote: "As to whether it has been altered drastically over
the years, well, God would make sure that its message was not
contaminated."

Unfortunately, we do not have *one* Bible today (and I'm not talking
about different translations here). Catholic, Protestant, and Orthodox
Christians all use slightly different versions of the Bible (in
particular, concerning the Apochrypha), and Jews have, through the
centuries, not included the New Testament in their Bible, nor have
they ordered the Old Testament Books in the way Christians have. These
changes may be small (look at the different versions of the Ten
Commandments, for instance), but in a book as important as the Bible,
it's hard to say that even a small change doesn't effect "its
message."

pugwashjw: I'm not happy with your statement regarding the "whole"
bible. Time and space and translation and religion and viewpoint (pick
any two) prevent me from quoting the whole Bible to present my point.
As do you conveniently choose verses that represent YOUR point. As for
my last statement regarding heaven being on earth, It was intended as
mild sarcasm and "extrapolation" of someone else's comment. It didn't
represent *my* view, and certainly didn't represent biblical view.

I agree; the Devil is the ruler of the earth. I agree that heaven is a
different plane than earth.

I don't agree with the Jehovah's Witnesses' view that the "new earth"
is the destination for believers. It *might* be the 1000 year
destination, but not the final destination. If it is the 1000 year
destination, after the devil has been thrown, shackled, into the pit,
I don't want to be here after he's released.

for Rogerwilco. I agree there are many translations but if you compare
the scriptures, the basic thought has been maintained. Even in
Matthew, Mark and Luke, the same story is told in different ways, from
their point of view. As for he other books that you claim to be older
than the Bible, None are in general use and most , if existant from a
laymans point of view, are only accessable by vetted scholars. The
Vatican holds many ancient transcripts and is loathe to make them "Too
public". It knows its traditions go against basic Bible truths. Even I
am still searching for any scripture which says it is o.k. to even
bend God's basic rules. An understanding of the " big Picture" is not
easy to come by but the two scriptures in Ecclesiastes regarding death
are very plain. Ecc. 3;19 about the eventuality of men and
beasts...they are the same...As man dies, so do beasts and verse 20
says they are both going to the one place...not heaven but the common
grave in the ground.
And Ecc. 9 verse 5...the dead are conscious of nothing at all. 
Looking forward to your follow up.

for Crythias; my apologies if anything I said upset you.  Not many are
aware of he thousand years period. This time is for people who survive
" The Great Tribulation" to put in effort and work towards the same
perfection that was enjoyed by Adam and Eve before they sinned and
were ejected from the Garden of Eden. The cost of that sin was to grow
old and die, which they eventually both did. We have inherited that
fault. There is not a doctor in the world today who can explain why
our bodily cells happily regenerate up to the age of about thirty but
from then on go into decline resulting in old age and death.
As you rightly know, at the end of the thousand years, Satan the Devil
will be released for a short while do "do his worst" and all those who
think they have reached perfection will be tested for the last time.
Some will fall by the wayside, which is sad considering they were
faithful during the trying time of Armageddon [Rev. 16;14,16..Jeremiah
25;33] Armageddon will bring in the Kingdom prophecied at Daniel 2;44
and prayed for at Matthew 6;9,10.
All these scriptures are dependant on people existing on the earth.
All the scriptures promise a ceasing of death, pain and suffering. IF
it was God's plan to have every person who has died, living the good
"spiritual" life in heaven, why would he bother tryng to reduce our
suffering while we are alive. Its because He loves us, and from the
days of Adam and Eve, perfect humans were never meant to die...
The subject has generated 36 comments so far and I'm wondering how
many Bibles are being scrutinised???

Hi Pug. I think you've seriously misread me. 

First, I wasn't talking about different *translations* of Scripture --
I'm talking about different *Scriptures* that differ in the original
Greek (or Hebrew) between the Catholic, Protestant, and Orthodox
versions (never mind Jewish and Muslim ones). And if you want to argue
that all of these versions contain the same "basic thought," you
should make it clear that some things many Christians view as central
to their faith are therefore not part of that basic thought -- such as
the Virgin Birth, for example, which is not mentioned by two of the
Gospels at all.

Second, the idea that those books older than the Bible are not in
general use (or at least, not in use by anyone who isn't a specialized
scholar) is simply not true. In the courses I teach, I require my
students (college undergrads, generally about 20 years old) to read
parts of two books considerably older than the New Testament ? Homer's
_The Odyssey_ (8th century BC) and Aristotle's _Poetics_ (4th century
BC). Very few students have much trouble reading them (though some are
too lazy to do the work -- a sepearate problem). Of course they read
them in translation, but isn't that also the case for the Bible? (Do
you read it in the original Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek?) And the Vedas
have been used pastorally, ritually, religiously, politically, and
popularly in India for thousands of years. If this doesn't qualify as
'general use,' I don't know what does.

What religions believe that hell or purgatory is a temporary place
that some people will go to before going to heaven and that in heaven
there are many mansions, so your place in heaven may not be the same
as someone else?s?

I do not believe that all religions base their beliefs solely on the
Bible, or the same Bible if they do.  I would like to see a chart
comparing the various religious beliefs on the original question.

I am not religious, nor do i have any sort of philosophy eduction. In
fact, i'm just a ormal 20 year old british bloke. However, i have done
a little thought on the subject in the past.
In order to go to hell, you must deliberatly commit an evil act, of
your own free will.
However, if all our decisions are ultimatly based on our nature or
nurture, then none of our decisions are truly free. Hitler was not
evil because he was mentally unbalanced (not his fault) and had been
brought up to believe jews were less than human (not his fault). This
view requires you to believe there is little or no free will.
If you think someone can freely decide to commit an action they know
to be evil (not merely wrong)then you can believe in hell. I do not
believe anyone could (or would)do this, and so i think we all go to
heaven (though as an agnostic i am unsure such a place exists. What
can i say, i haven't come to know my own mind yet).

Hi again Rogerwilco, We are getting away from the original question a
bit, and it was put to garner other's views and to see how wide
ranging they are. But specifically, the books you mentioned, even
though they may be older than SOME parts of the Bible, are still only
the writings of men, albeit philosophers. Even they had access to the
"Old Testament" . Genesis was completed by MOSES in 1657 B.C.E.,
JOSHUA IN 1450 B.C.E. and Second Samuel in 1040. I personally believe
in Second Timothy 3;16, that ALL scripture is INSPIRED of God and
beneficial....Can that be claimed for the philosophers?
for Joatman..That is why I asked the question...to see all the various ideas.
for Drums.."Hell" is a bit like fools gold. It looks like the real
thing but isnt. Translators have rendered the Hebrew word "she'ohl"
and the Greek word "hai'des" as "Hell" and credited it as a place of
torment. In actual fact, those two words should translate as the
common grave.
The original question mentioned a number of scriptures pertaining to
exactly this. I had hoped commenters would read them first to see
where I am coming from.
Looking forward to more.

Pug, sorry I was slow to respond (i was away for a day).

Back to the 144,000, you said "The 144,000 are a specific number of
ones chosen by God, out of all the billions who have ever lived [ a
very small percentage]
These one have always done what God wants [ love God and their fellow
man] Bible translators such as Wycliffe and Martin Luther may be among
them."
This is clearly not the case.  

Romans 3:22-24
"This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to
all who believe. There is no difference, for all have sinned and fall
short of the glory of God, and are justified freely by his grace
through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus."

Therefore even the 144,000 have sinned (not done what God wanted)
since "ALL HAVE SINNED" and they would not go to heaven if it were not
for the redemption that Jesus freely gives.

Is the multitude who turned to Jesus not forgiven by the same grace
that Jesus freely gave to the 144,000?

I went and read the original scriptures.  They did not help me see how
you came to your conclusion though.

In Ecclesiastes 9:5 it says "For the living know that they shall die:
but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward;
for the memory of them is forgotten."  From this it sounds like no one
will go to heaven.  In Revelation 14:4 it says about the 144,000:
"These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are
virgins.  These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth.
These were redeemed from among men, being the first fruits unto God
and to the Lamb."  While it does not seem to indicate that these
144,000 people are the only ones in heaven, what about the command in
Genesis 1: 28 and Genesis 9: 1 to "Be fruitful, and multiply, and
replenish the earth"?  They did not seem to do this.  And why are
women left out of the 144,000?

So I looked up some other scriptures.  I could not find a lot on
requirements to enter heaven, but came up with some using ?Kingdom of
God?.  Scriptures for the list are at the end.  My list of people
entering heaven are those who:
  
Believe in Christ			John 3:16
Are Born of Water and of the Spirit 	John 3:5
Go through much tribulation 		Acts 14:22
Repent 			Matthew 4:17 (why are we told to repent) 
Are righteous  		1 Corinthians 6:9   
Don?t tempt Jesus	Matthew 21:31  (the priests were trying to trick Jesus)
Are not rich		Mark 10:25 (Probably putting money before other things)
Do the will of God.	Matthew 7:21 
Become as little children.	Matt. 18:3

This is not a complete list, but these scriptures do more to make me
feel like I won't make it than answer the question.  It is hard enough
to do some of these things, why not make it perfectly clear what I
need to do in one simple list?  Yet when I read other scriptures such
as:

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten
Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have
everlasting life.

Rom. 8: 16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we
are the children of God:

Matthew 6:26 Behold the fowls of the air: for they sow not, neither do
they reap, nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feedeth
them. Are ye not much better than they?

I can?t believe that most all of us (Gods children) won?t go to some
sort of heaven.  We will be judged and have our reward of course (John
14:2).  I think you need to do a whole lot of evil things with a
strong knowledge of what you are doing is wrong not to go to a place
that is better than here.  I do not think that not being baptized, not
ever hearing of Jesus, not standing up in public and making some
statement of belief, or not properly repenting of your sins is
justification to live forever in eternal torment.  This is of course
because of Jesus Christ.  I think hell is a temporary place that some
people go to to suffer for their sins and prepare for heaven.  Too bad
I can?t find a scripture for that though.

Much of these thoughts could be expanded upon, but I hope the general
belief came across.

Referenced Scriptures:
Matt. 11: 25 At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O
Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things
from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten
Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have
everlasting life.

John 3:5  ?Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a
man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the
kingdom of God.?

Acts 14:22 Confirming the souls of the disciples, and exhorting them
to continue in the faith, and that we must through much tribulation to
enter into the kingdom of God.

Matthew 4:17  From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say,
Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.

1 Corinthians 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit
the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor
idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves
with mankind,

Matthew 21:31 Whether of them twain did the will of his father? They
[the chief priests and the elders of the people] say unto him, The
first. Jesus saith unto them, Verily I say unto you, That the
publicans and the harlots go into the kingdom of God before you.

Mark 10:25  It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a
needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter
into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father
which is in heaven.
Matt. 18: 3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted,
and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of
heaven.

Matthew 6:26 Behold the fowls of the air: for they sow not, neither do
they reap, nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feedeth
them. Are ye not much better than they?

John 14:2 In my Father?s house are many mansions: if it were not so, I
would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

Well asked, sucker5-ga.  If there were any solid, objectively
verifiable facts, they would make the whole idea of faith pretty
pointless, would they not?  Very tidy circle.

Just as tidy from the outside as from the inside.

Since I've been pastoring a Christian church for well over 20 years,
it might seem odd that I like the response am777-ga gave (on 24 Jan
2005 13:00 PST)

He said:
 
        Ill tell you when I get there, meanwhile........

        ...Live like it's Heaven on Earth.

If you think of "heaven" as a geographical location somewhere in our
universe (or a parallel universe...?), then you've got a problem of
figuring out how to get from here to there -- and I can't safely find
my way from Palo Alto to the Golden Gate Bridge, much less find
"heaven"!

But think about this: Whatever "heaven" is, it's dotta be tied to the
Presence of God. You know, His Throne, the Heavenly City and all that.

But God's Present RIGHT NOW and RIGHT HERE -- in fact He's Present
"every-now" and "everywhere".

So -- like am777-ga said, souldn't we begin living in the Presence of
God NOW -- HERE?

Here's the heart of my comment: If God (Who's at the center of
whatever Heaven is) is HERE -- NOW, then we have a chance to begin
experiencing life in "heaven" HERE -- NOW.

That is -- we have a chance if we really DO want God in our lives in
any real, personal way. Some people think that "everybody" gets to "go
to heaven". But consider this: If God is Present in THIS WORLD, HERE -
NOW, and people don't like Him (!!!) and ignore His Presence (!!!) and
don't want any connection to Him NOW -- why in tarnation will they
want to spend Eternity with Him?

I think hell exists, but I think it's basically a place where in His
profound Love God has withdrawn His Presence as much as is possible --
and he lets people go there who have spent their lives HERE - NOW
trying to ignore Him and keep away from Him in any personal way.

You know -- like one of the other comments says, if you think God's
not any fun, and you want to have "fun", why would you want to spend
Eternity with a Cosmic Killjoy?

Of course, I don't think He's a Killjoy -- He's the only reason I have
Joy in my life even now (it's a BLAST getting to know Him more!)

Listen, pugwashjw-ga -- from the list of Scriptures at the bottom of
your question, I think I've got a tip you'ld really find interesting:
You obviously are (1) wanting to think things through for yourself,
and (2) have some awareness of and respect for the Scriptures. So I
suggest you train yourself to learn the skills (hermeneutic) to
accurately interpret the Bible for yourself -- and be done with having
to swallow other people's, pre-digested interpretations of Scripture.
The best tool (only one like it I know of) for training yourself in
how to accurately study the Bible is an interactive computer-based
tutorial called "Rightly Dividing the Word", available at this site:
http://kingdomscribes.net/flashfolder/docs/H1.html

Check it out -- being able to interpret the Bible accurately yourself
means that when you hear people spouting off about what they think the
Bible means "here in such-and-so verse", instead of just swallowing
(or spitting out) their opinions, you'll have the skills and tools to
LOOK at those verses and determine whether that person's opinioins are
right or wrong.

I'm not advocating some sort of "unbelief" or "rebellion" -- it says
right in the Bible itself (book of Acts) that when the Apostle Paul
came to Berea, after he preached, the people there "gave serious
attention to his sermon, searching in the Scriptures every day, to see
if these things were so."

See? Even with the Apostle Paul, people weren't supposed to just
swallow his teachings. They picked up the Scriptures and checked them
out to see if Paul was right or wrong. And Paul's response? He
applauded their caution, calling them "noble minded"!

And THAT skill -- that place of YOU having the skills to rightly
interpret the Bible -- THAT skill should be in your hands.
 

Hi emandm,

"So -- like am777-ga said, souldn't we begin living in the Presence of
God NOW -- HERE?"

...actually that was not what I said...
what I wrote was:
Ill tell you when I get there, meanwhile........

Work like you don't need the money.
Love like you've never been hurt. 
Dance like nobody's watching.
Sing like nobody's listening. 
Live like it's Heaven on Earth.

Anne-Marie

I do not mind you interpreting my post wrong, since we are all
entitled to have our own perception...however, I do feel like giving
you my intention of why I put the post the way I did.
The message behind this post was: why bother about afterlife while it
is already hard enough to really LIVE LIFE.........

And for the matter of interpreting and "assuming", how come you
"pictured" me as being male...? .....just curious........

Anne-Marie

First of all I am a Christian too, I also believe in the divine
ispiration of the Holy Sciptures. But often our interpretations of the
Bible are not so accurate.

Secondly I am a Christian Universalist. I believe In that eventually
everybody will enjoy a happy afterlife. This teaching known as
Christian Universalism, finds support in the Bible, history, and basic
logical reasoning. For a more comprehensive piece on Universalism read
my article at: http://www.truth.info/future/universalism.htm

This is for EMANDM. I'm not sure if you will check back on the
question, but you mentioned a couple of things. You say you believe in
hell. From which source did you learn about the concept. You did not
mention ANY scripture, from ANY TRANSLATION. And that is noticeable
with all the other comments. I had hoped that by citing the various
scriptures, Bibles would be picked up and read, thereby putting to the
test all the ideas that people learn from the pulpits. Can you try and
prove the existence of hell?

It is my belief, from my study of the Bible, that only 144,000 chosen
ones will go to heaven.
There will be a resurrection of both the righteous and unrighteous.
For 1000 years Satan will be locked up. Then he will be set loose
again to see who will truly be loyal to God. Then Satan and those who
still reject God will be destroyed forever.  After that, the ones who
were loyal and faithful will live forever in paradise on Earth.
I know that not everyone agrees with this belief, but that is the way
it is with most religions.

you seem to be looking for many points of view...so here's mine:

When you die it's over.  No heaven, no hell, no dark room...nothing.
One's memories and personallity are all stored in the brain.  When the
body dies so does the mind.  The information stored within the brain
is lost, all that remains is a shell.  It's not a very romantic
outlook, and its a bit difficult to wrap ones mind around the idea of
it all being over but i find it to be the most beleivable theory.

Although i dont beleive in an afterlife i would like to think that one
stays alive in memory, every person makes a ripple in the world. 
Those who are remembered as being a good person stay 'alive' in
'heaven', those who are looked down upon may be in 'hell'.  Im not
sure what to compare being forgotten to.  Being dead as well as
forgotten is a concept to difficult for me to grasp.

-Fractl

Finally made it back, just in case anyone is backchecking on the
question. I agree with Flumper. What He/She states is backed by
scripture. And I appreciate Fractl's view. But for us to just die and
cease to exist would make Jesus' sacrifice...FOR US...pointless. And
God, his Father, does not do pointless things. His grand plan is just
as Flumper says. musicmusicmusic...The Bible TELLS us so
musicmusicmusic.  49 comments....pretty good!

Hello,

The following article defines in depth the concept of heaven (swarga
as we call it in hinduism). This essay relates to "Why are we born...
from where we come and after death where do we go?"


At that time of the big bang ... the total cosmos is but the size us
of half a thumb ... everything we call and know as Brahmaand (the
mighty Cosmos)! Something unbelievable from the point of view of a
common man ... yet, it is a true fact of life explained in detail in
the Bhagavad Gita also.

This size of the Cosmos ... a cluster of pure energy ... the combined
forces of all purified Atmans (souls) in the Brahmaand (cosmos) ... is
what we know as God, the Almighty Creator. The total sum of all
purified Atmans at a given period of time remains constant and this we
designate as the power of God, the Almighty Creator.

Every atman is but a miniscule form of the bigger Atman, the Parmatman
... God, the mighty Creator himself. Atman is but a part of the puzzle
... God, the Almighty Creator being the whole puzzle. No clustering of
thoughts ... everything is absolutely clear!

After the big bang has occurred ... all Atmans get scattered all over
the Cosmos ... their prime purpose being to get a body so that they
can cleanse themselves of all the impurities. For this it has to pass
through a chain of 8.4 million manifestations ... a total life span of
about 96.4 million years. Every atman starts on its cosmic journey as
an amoeba and subsequently as a mosquito, futther evoluting into a
tree ... then an animal and finally into a human being.

That is all there is to life ... the small span of 70 years in the
life of a human being is nothing compared to the total travel of 96.4
million years ... every atman (the soul within) has to travel in a
cosmic life span.

When the body decays and the atman looks forward to a new body ...
there are three stages it has to undergo ... the first stage being
that the atman (the soul within) immediately gets a new body ... if
the manifestation occurs immediately then there is no Swarga (Heaven)
or Naraka (hell).... the Atman (the soul within) has to pass through.
These stages are bypassed by the atman (the soul within).

The second and the third stage is when there are no suitable parents
available for the atman to manifest (for any atman to manifest ... it
needs matching chromosomes of the parents). If for any reason parents
with the matching chromosomes are not available then the atman (the
soul within) has to wait ... and the waiting is not in vain ... one
either gets to live in Swarga (Heaven) or Naraka (hell). Whether we
get Heaven (Swarga) or hell (Naraka) is simply dependent upon the
theory of karma. As we sow shall we get!

If we have done pious deeds and have earned Punya karma in result then
we are likely to get Swarga (Heaven) as an interim a stage. If our
deeds weigh us down and are full of sins then we are dumped into the
Naraka (hell) ... the making is all ours ... God does not interfere at
any stage ... why blame him all the time. It is the theory of mass
karma that USA suffered 9/11 episode. The doing of all the citizens of
the USA resulted in their getting what was due to them since a long
time. In the present times of democracy one cannot forcibly rule the
other ... might is not the order of the day. We suffer for our own
doings ... none other can be blamed for our sufferings be they on an
individual basis or a mass scale. God has made the system like that.

Every atman the soul within ... is always detached from the doings of
the body ... yet, the sweet small inner voice which prompts us on the
right path every now and then is the promptings of the atman to the
body to follow the right path all the time ... we need to practice
patience to be able to hear the sweet small inner voice. It is a
lovely experience, which can be expressed only by those who experience
it. People with higher spiritual frame of mind are able to hear the
voice more clearly than those at the lower level.

Human beings who almost behave like animals are those ignorant beings
who permanently suppress hearing the sweet small inner voice ... for
them human values have no meaning. For them their Atman (the soul
within) is a dead thing. This results in their carrying out heinous
crimes all the time ... never heeding to the advice of the spiritual
masters ... not that they do not want to but they have become so thick
skinned that the sweet small inner voice stops prompting them
permanently ... this is to say that the voice always prompts us but
our ignorance prevents us from hearing it.

The atman (the soul within) gets liberated from the cycle of birth and
death only after 8.4 million manifestations ... that is the cosmic
journey of 96.4 million years. The Sacred Bhagavad Gita and various
Upanishads corroborate this fact. This is what Bhagavad Gita is all
about. Only after that can we say that one has become enlightened ...
immortal (amar) forever. It is not that the atman (the soul within) is
liberated from day one ... but the sooner it liberates ... attains
moksha ... the journey gets completed.

Similarly as the iron within the iron ore cannot liberate itself
without the help of the mining machinery ... similarly every atman
(has to pass through) a chain of manifestations for it to get
purified. If we are two separate one KG of pure iron from a lump of
hundred KG of iron ore then we need to remove 99 KG of impurities
through the process of mining. Only after the impurities are removed
can we term one KG of pure iron as a liberated atman (a liberated
soul) ... in other words ... the atman has become free of all
liabilities and can be termed as having achieved the status of
becoming immortal (amar).

All purified Atmans ... man gods like Lord Mahavira, Buddha, Jesus
Christ and prophet Mohammed and even the likes of Ramakrishna
Paramhansa and Maharishi Ramana all fall in the category of immortal
souls ... those who in their lifetimes achieved liberation forever
from the cycle of birth and death leading to their immortality
(amaratva).

There is no shortcut path to immortality. In the form of a human being
one cannot become immortal. Immortality means the soul (the atman
within) has liberated itself from the cycle of birth and that forever.
While living these man gods were not immortal but the sooner they left
their body they became immortal souls never to return back to the
cycle of birth and death.

There is no power in the cosmos more powerful than God, the Almighty
Creator ... and as every atman is but a miniscule form of the bigger
atman, the Parmatman ... all properties of Parmatman by default exist
in every atman (the soul within) ... and does this mean the atman is
all powerful in the cosmos ... yes, there is nothing more powerful
than the atman in the cosmos only next to God.

Atman (the soul within) is our true inner nature ... it always prompts
us on the right path. No one can deny this absolute truth.

Mann (mind) of a human being has no relation whatsoever with atman
(the soul within) ... take one thing for granted that no individual
body has an independent mind ... bodies can only have an independent
brain ... a receiving and transmitting station for all thoughts.
Nothing less or more. When music is relayed from a broadcasting
station then two or more persons can simultaneously switch on their
transistors or radios and listen to the music.

Similarly, in the cosmic system ... all jnana (wisdom) contained in
the cosmos can be invoked by anyone by practicing concentration of our
thinking pattern. The thinking prowess every human being possesses has
no limits ... we all invoke the thoughts being transmitted from the
broadcasting station of the cosmos.... the mind plus or the mind minus
... if we invoke positive thoughts ... we invoke them from the
reservoir of mind plus. All negative thoughts emanate from the
reservoir of mind minus. Our brain only acts as the receiving or the
transmitting station ... nothing more or less.

Facts are absolutely clear ... we have only to assimilate them in
totality. Mind (whether plus or minus) is the total source of all
jnana (wisdom) contained in the cosmos. It is only through practicing
Neti and Shruti jnana can we reach the source of all wisdom (jnana)
... once we reach the source we don't need any textbooks to refer. I
have never gone through the Bhagavad Gita in my life yet, having
realized God in 1993 ... whatever is contained in Bhagavad Gita is
clear to me like ABCD ... it is as if I have written Bhagavad Gita in
one of my earlier manifestations. I know it all ... I have reached the
source of all wisdom ... there is nothing more for me to know in the
whole cosmos (Brahmaand).

Having reached Mount Everest of my spiritual life I have nowhere else
to go ... God forbid me to conduct any business after my realization.
I have but to impart whatever I have learnt by the grace of God before
I leave this mortal frame. This is the only goal of my last
manifestation. I can only attain moksha (salvation) in this life as I
have reached the cosmic goal of my life ... the end of 8.4 millionth
manifestation. Not necessarily I may have passed through the complete
life cycle of 96.4 million years ... I might have cut short my journey
in this very life.

This is possible and is explained thus- If I need to go to Bombay ...
I can start my journey on foot and subsequently board a bus and
finally a flight. Similarly we can cut short the spiritual journey by
having Satsanga and discourses with like-minded people of all
religions and faiths. Being a Jain does not mean all other religions
and faiths have no meaning for me. The source of all is the same ...
the destination of all is the same. We may take any path but we shall
all reach the same goal. God, the Almighty Creator is only one for all
religions and faiths. Man gods can be many yet God, the Almighty
Creator is only one.

The moment I realized God I had to change my name from Vijay Kumar
Jain to Vijay Kumar ... all religions had become one for me ... it was
just not possible for me to distinguish between various religions and
faiths ... I had to lose my surname for I had become free forever. I
cannot express in words the happiness (true Ananda) I experienced
after realization. Something that can ever be defined in words.

I had the strongest urge to meet God face-to-face within this life
when I was 13 years of age ... it took me full 25 years to achieve the
same ... no guilt as now I have the direct blessings of God all the
time ... my life was destined like that. To be able to talk to God all
the time every moment of my life is something I truly cannot express
in words ... one needs to experience the power of self realization to
understand the inner meaning of what God and the atman (the soul
within) is all about.

Vijay Kumar...
(The Man who Realized God in 1993)

no

I think there are a couple of things you should read which could help
you answer your question.

The first thing is the writings of Padre Pio.  He was an incredible
man who was apparently very close to God.  Many people (me included)
are very devoted to him.    You'll find more info on
http://www.padrepioesangiovannirotondo.it/ and a place to stay in
www.lamadonnina.biz.

The second is the story of Fra Daniele Natale.  He had been officially
declared dead, during a serious operation which had in some way gone
wrong, and he had in the meantime gone to the purgatory, where the
above mentioned Padre Pio came to bring him back.  I don't know the
story very well, but I suppose you can look it up - just search Fra
Daniele Natale!

Take a look at the doctrine of "universal reconciliation" and
especially the works of J. Preston Eby. Here's one link:
http://www.hisremnant.org/eby/articles/savior/heavens.html
This is also a good Christian article: http://www.pilgrimsplace.net/hhib.html

when you die, the blood stops flowing to your brain which is
responsible of your consciousness, or in another word - "your being",
or in other word - "your soul" or in other word - "you".

there is no heaven or hell.
man is the one who created those concepts and way of thinking.
there is no good and no evil, the meaning of everything (action or
knowledge) is in the way it feeds your perception.

religion is opium to the masses, it has great good intentions, but NO,
it is NOT TRUE.
there is no "god", and there is no "devil" - there is only doubt in
anything that is not knowable due to limitations of intelligence and
there is nothing wrong with that.

there is NO answers, only presumptions.
the only truth is not everyone is lieing.

the way I see it:
"live life as if you stole it from somebody else"

then die.

"there is NO answers, only presumptions.
the only truth is not everyone is lieing."

Gosh. Why are you here? I mean, how do you know not everyone is lieing
(lying)? That supposes that you must be telling the truth. Except,
there are no answers. So you can't be telling the truth. So you must
be lying. Which means everyone is lying. But if I can logically deduce
that, then I must be providing an answer. So you are lying again that
there are no answers. If I can deduce that you are lying about two
things in the statement, then I can reasonably deduce that anything
else that you might be saying is also a lie.

If there is no good or evil, then I guess we should abolish
government. These pesky laws are just in the way of our freedoms
anyway. There's no right or wrong. It's just perception. This moral
outrage that we feel when people rape and kill children... we're just
being silly. We shouldn't care. Those rapists aren't evil. There
actions are just perceived that way. For the time being, we consider
that activity to be punishable. Not that there is any reason to feel
that that action must be punishable. Those stupid moralists guilt the
populace into feeling that those actions must be punishable. (oh, if
there *is* a good and evil, from whence does it originate?)</sarcasm>

When you are able to walk through walls because the presumption of the
currently established fact of the wall being solid has changed, then
we can talk about answers versus assumption. When you start to realize
that your world is bigger than your senses perceive or can measure,
then it's time to talk. In the mean time, good luck with your moral
relavitism.

All that are in Christ at the ressurection will inherit the KINGDOM OF HEAVEN.
No man has ascended to heaven except Christ.  The Kingdom is coming to
earth, (revelation).  Jesus said he is coming and bringing our reward
with him.  The meek shall inherit the EARTH not HEAVEN.  Do you think
we are going to heaven only to be put back in our bodies to be
ressurected?...this doesn't make sense.  If the dead in christ are
ressurected...tell me how they are in heaven before.  Nowhere in the
scriptures does it say we go to heaven.

Hmm. Jesus said that he is going to prepare a place for us, so that
where He is, we will be also.

Jesus ascended to heaven, as you say, so either Jesus is preparing a
place for us in his father's house, which has many mansions, or Jesus
is preparing the earth for us, which begs the question... why did He
leave?

As for the one who said that jesus is going to prepare a place for us,
he is talking about the 144,000.  Jesus went back up and cast the
devil and his angels down to earth. If you start reading at Revelation
12:7 it speak of the war in heaven between satan and jesus. It says
that neither was their place found anymore in heaven.  In verse 9 it
says that he is cast out onto the earth, and his angels were cast out
with him.  That was the room that jesus was going to make.

 	Hell is a place of non-existence.  The bible frequently uses the term
"fire" in the bible as a term for destruction.  If you read Jonah 2:2
you will see that jonah said that he was in the belly of hell.  Thus,
he was saying that he was in his grave, for sure there was no burning
fire in the belly of the wale.                                        
        
	If you read in Revelation
20:14, you will see that death and hades(hell), were cast into the
lake of fire.  Death is a state of existence and surely cannot burn. 
Some people belive that hell is the fire, why would god throw hell
into hell?  Like I said, fire means destruction.  The verse is saying
that death and hell will be destroyed.

    Once you die, you are sleeping just as jesus said that Lazaruth
was sleeping when he raised him from the dead.  Don't you think that
Lazaruth would of told of all the stories of hell, or heaven, if he
would have went.  When you die you go to hell(grave), you are there
until jesus comes back to judge the living and the "dead".  If you
read in John 5:25, you can see that the dead will hear the voice of
the son of man, and they that hear shall live. It didn't say those in
heaven or hell, it said those that are "dead".

   When we die we go into a state of non-existence.  As it is stated
in Ecclesiastes 9:5, The living are conscious that they will die, but
the dead know nothing.  In Psalms 146:4 it states that "his breath
goeth forth, he returneth to his earth, in that day his thoughts
perish."

   One thing that I do not understand about the Catholic belief is how
they listen to a priest and call the priest father.  The bible says
nothing of we needing man to get to our father.  In Matthew 23:1 , It
says that you must call no one on earth your father, since you have
only one father, and he is in heaven.  What is it that the catholic's
do not understand about that?  If you read in Matthew 6:6, it says to
go into a closet and pray to god, not to go say it to a man.  If you
look in 6:7, it says not to use repetitions for thinking that you will
be heard.  I have seen many catholics repeat many prayers over and
over again.  You are supposed to pray from your heart, not from
memorization.  There is only one mediator between god and us, and it
is not a priest.  As 1 timothy 2:5 says, that there is "one god and
mediator between god and me, Christ Jesus.

  
    Matthew 6: 9-12. Many catholics will refer back to the our father
prayer, it starts our as "you should pray like this: our father....". 
It doesn't state to directly pray that prayer.  It is a model on how
we should pray.  It speaks about giving us the food we need, forgive
us when we sin, deliver us from evil...etc.  This is how we should
pray when we pray from our heart, not memorization.

Yes, you'll be an angel weather you're male or female and ladies will
grow more prettier, the boys is the same, they grow youger but only
the ones who believe in god. Some people say that god is just a
figerment but I'm half evil and half good cuz I sometimes go pretty
mean and I sometimes just say thank you and stuff like that or if u
really belive in god and u don't belive in devil (like me) then that
means you're a chrstian or whatever religion you're in.

laborde2005-ga:

Jesus is going to prepare a place for only the 144,000. Really? I'd
expect that He'd tell us that there are only 144,000 rooms in His
father's house. Guess that's how many "many" is. (All scripture
reference King James Version, 'cause I know any other version gets
people's pants in a knot).

Revelation 12:7 "And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels
fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,"

Jesus isn't Michael, isn't Michael's angels, isn't the dragon (Michael
wouldn't fight Jesus, would he?), and isn't the dragon's angels.
Wonder where Jesus is in this fight. OK. let's read on...

Rev. 12:9 "And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called
the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out
into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him"

"That was the room that jesus was going to make." Really. No room for
God's house with Satan and Satan's angels there? But Jesus didn't say
he was going to clear out Satan. He certainly didn't need to build the
house that His father already had created. Jesus went to prepare a
place.
John 14:
   1Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.

   2In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would
have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

   3And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and
receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

Is Jesus preparing the place by 
a) building a house
b) providing hospitality OR
c) evicting the current guests/inhabitants?

Where did Jesus go? 
a) Heaven in general
b) a territory owned by God within the boundaries of Heaven

Jonah 2:2 
"And said, I cried by reason of mine affliction unto the LORD, and he
heard me; out of the belly of hell cried I, and thou heardest my
voice"

It would be of no consequence to suggest that KJV would be
inappropriate to continue this discussion if we cannot agree that
"hell" was mistranslated from sheol - the grave. However, one cannot
use a bad translation in one sense to prove that all such views are
inaccurate.

On the other hand altogether, Jonah's predicament isn't exactly in the
grave, either. He was in a big fish. Probably likely to be slowly
digested by his host. I'd consider that to be "on fire". But he was
neither in hell nor in the grave. Even to concede the accuracy of hell
with or without fire, I think the point is that hell is not a place
one would wish to be. In Jonah's case, I would like to think that he'd
be saying, "I'm in hell" in the same way we'd say "This sucks".
However, saying "I'm in the grave" would be "I might as well be dead".

Still, Jonah's hell isn't the best example. 

Besides, the question at the top is "Do we all go to heaven when we
die?" How did you answer that question?

I suppose only you christians will go to hell.  All those no good
jews, evil hindus and buddists, damned muslims, stupid athiests,
foolish taoists, other non-christians, etc. and anyone who died before
27AD will burn in hell - or do they get grandfathered in?  And what
about children who die before baptism?  Can a priest say something
over the corpse to get them in?

Also, isn't it true that only the Christian God and his Angels live in
Heaven?  I mean, per Revelation, everyone who dies actually goes to
purgatory - kind of a holding cell - until the final judgement.  Then
God will kill everybody whos bad and send them to hell, while he
brings his good dead followers back to life to experience Heaven on
earth.  Something like that, right?

Hope you're one of the 144,000!