How were buildings torn down before we had heavy motor-driven
equipment like wrecking balls, backhoes, and steam shovels?  Maybe a
lot of buildings weren't torn down, but if they were, what were the
equipment and the labor like?  Was it just a whole lot of men with
mallets and shovels?

This is a simplified version of my #469528, which, like a lot of my
other Qs, is (I guess) either too hard or else too boring.

Thank you,
Archae0pteryx

P.S.  I've never seen anyone else comment on this, but selecting a
question category is usually very frustrating.  Most of my questions
want categories that aren't there, such as 'history' and 'language.' 
I've assumed, perhaps incorrectly, that the category you select
influences which researchers look at it.  Maybe GA would consider
adding a few major classifications to the list?

---

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 06 Feb 2005 14:01 PST

Hello once again,

As for me, I rarely pay attention to a question's category...it either
looks interesting or it doesn't.


As for demolition, you might want to peruse the old issues of The
Manufacturer and Builder magazine from the 1870's.  There are lots of
references to demolitions, though I didn't see any sort of
comprehensive write-up from my quick look.

It certainly seems to be a labor-intensive exercise, though:


-----
http://cdl.library.cornell.edu/cgi-bin/moa/moa-cgi?notisid=ABS1821-0004-548

The Manufacturer and Builder
November 1872



THE Drexel building is manifestly fast rising to
the height of its destiny?to be the most magnificent
banking-house in New-York...

During the early months of the year negotiations
were quietly made for the purchase of the several lots
of ground, with the buildings thereon...About the middle of March
the announcement was made that the sale had been
completed. 

...Notice was given to all tenants to vacate
the premises on May 1. At noon on May 1, a force of
some six hundred workmen commenced the demolition
of the old buildings, and for two weeks thereafter,
during day and night, the vicinity was noisy with the
fall of stones and timbers as the busy workmen threw
them from their old positions... 
-----


And do forget, they certainly had explosives by well before the turn
of the century.


Hope that helps,

paf

---

Clarification of Question by archae0pteryx-ga on 06 Feb 2005 14:40 PST

Hi, paf, and thanks for looking into this.  I don't actually see a
request for clarification.  What did you want me to answer?

Tryx

---

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 06 Feb 2005 14:53 PST

Actually, the thing you can clarify has nothing to do with my actual
RFC, but is this:


--When researchers post a comment, rather than an RFC, are you
notified about it?  That is, do you get a GA email notification?


I often post RFC's rather than comments on the presumption that the
customers are notified of the former, but not the latter.  However, I
sometimes forget to actually *ask* the customer to clarify anything. 
So now I'd like some clarifications about the clarifications...

Kapish?


paf

---

Clarification of Question by archae0pteryx-ga on 06 Feb 2005 15:53 PST

Hi, paf,

I think that depends on the option that the questioner has selected. 
At least with respect to comments, it does; not sure about requests
for clarification.  I've chosen the option that gives me an e-mail
notification whenever there's a comment or request for clarification. 
Other options, as I recall, are daily-digest notification and no
notification.  Once in a while I get a notification of new postings on
a question that was closed a long time ago.  I always think it's
especially interesting when someone finds his or her way back to an
old question (like mine on researchers' languages) and adds something.

Let me ask you back:  do researchers get notifications when a customer
has rated their answers?--and when they've been tipped?  Some
researchers are quick to acknowledge high ratings and tips (even small
ones--recalling that *all* tips are voluntary extras), and some don't
acknowledge at all--even large ones.

Tryx

---

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 06 Feb 2005 16:17 PST

It sounds like my notification isn't all that different from yours,
but to tell the truth, I cruise the Q&A's so often, I usually know
what's being posted long before any notification arrives!

Thanks for the info...

paf

Hi Tryx,

Thank you for a very interesting question.  As requested, I'm posting
my findings for you as the answer.


=========
The House 
========= 

"A typical house in a typical village (if there was such a thing)
would be built to last for twenty years or so. When it began to
disintegrate, a new one would be built. The old structure, if it could
still stand, would be used as an out-building. By the 14th century
houses were being built to last twice as long, but nevertheless there
seems to have been no particular attachment to the "old homestead",
and sons tore down old houses and put up new. Even in villages such as
Wharram Percy, where houses were built of stone, this pattern was
followed"
http://scholar.chem.nyu.edu/tekpages/peasanthouses.html

=========

"The house we are staying in was built around 1510 and was spared
destruction during the French Revolution while the peasants tore down,
brick by brick, most of the surrounding buildings to construct their
own dwellings."
http://www.abbiorca.com/bike/cross/reports/Gina-Hall/2004/jan-8-2004.html



=========
Demolition process
=========

A house was torn down brick by brick, stone by stone.  Handheld tools
used were sledgehammers, ropes, pick-axes, and shovels.

"No shopkeepers were going to stand in the way of progress. The Boss
made certain of that. While his hastily assembled demolition crews set
to work the night of Sept. 3, 1872, with their ropes and sledgehammers..."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=article&node=&contentId=A63030-2000Nov27&notFound=true



=========
What happened to the debris... how was it hauled from the area?
=========

Patiently waiting in the street was a heavy draft horse.  This horse
was called The Original Great Horse of Flanders aka Black Horse of
Flanders aka Great Horse of the Middle Ages.  The horse was tethered
to a cart or wagon which was pulled from the area.

"By the early Medieval period (500 to 1,000 A.D.), a particular type of
heavy horse known as the "Black Horse of Flanders" had settled in the
European low country, in what is presently Belgium and Northern
France. This would be the father of all modern draft horses."
http://homepage.mac.com/msb/163x/faqs/horse_pow.html


SWORDS INTO PLOWSHARES 

"The original Great Horse of Flanders is the ancestor of the modern-day
draft horse. He was also known as the Great Horse of the Middle Ages,
and the Black Horse of Flanders.

Belgium is regarded as his homeground. His descendants are, to name a
few: Belgians, Clydesdales, Percherons, Shires, and the Suffolk Punch.
In the Middle Ages, he was both a war charger and a field horse, and,
as such, played an important role in daily life. The heavy soil that
made him strong required a heavy horse to till it."
http://aranglen.tripod.com/Horses/horses.html

=========

Ground tools used were wheelbarrows and buckets. 


=========
Final cleanup
=========

After the heavy debris was removed from the area, a "besom" was used
to finalize the cleanup. It was a bundle of twigs tied to a handle and
was used to sweep.

"Meanwhile, back in Europe, the birch or besom broom industry, as it
was called, had prospered since Saxon times in the sandy heath areas
of south-east England, where the birch grows profusely. Known as Besom
Squires, the craftsmen were numerous along the Surrey-Sussex border,
and they employed assistants who worked individually in the coppices.
The brooms were made of birch twigs attached to a handle of ash, hazel
or chestnut."
http://www.broomshop.com/history/

See pictures of besoms:

http://www.and1e.freeserve.co.uk/menu/pich.htm
http://www.and1e.freeserve.co.uk/menu/picd.htm
http://www.and1e.freeserve.co.uk/menu/picg.htm

=========

keyword search:

medieval houses torn down
medieval demolition tools
history of broom
besom
construction tools late 1800's europe
european life late 1800's houses buildings
house demolition late 1800's europe
ancient civilizations demolish houses
late 1800's europe tools
draft horses

=========

Best regards,
tlspiegel


p.s.  I  never look for questions by category.  I browse the new
questions minute by minute.

p.p.s.  As for me, I have never been notified when a customer rates a
question or tips my answer.  I assume the same goes for all
researchers.

---

Request for Answer Clarification by archae0pteryx-ga on 06 Feb 2005 21:27 PST

The matter of notification is a side issue to the present question,
but I'm curious anyway:  do you see tips as an aggregate sum, or will
you see a reckoning somewhere that shows an amount of $3.03 coming
from me for this question?

I recently tipped a researcher the biggest tip I have ever given
anyone on GA, and the researcher did not appear to notice a thing. 
Not that acknowledgment is obligatory, of course, but I'd like to at
least know that the researcher is aware of having received it.

Tryx

---

Clarification of Answer by tlspiegel-ga on 06 Feb 2005 22:01 PST

Hi tryx,

Thank you for the 5 star rating, comments and generous tip!  (I love
working on your history questions.)


In answer to your RFC re: tips.

Our Invoice page looks like this:

Date         Answers                                     Earnings

03 Feb 2005  RESEARCHER EARNINGS for Q: XXXXXXXXXXXX      $XX.xx 
02 Feb 2005  TIP for Q: XXXXXXXXXX                        $XX.xx 
01 Feb 2005  RESEARCHER EARNING for Q: XXXXXXXXXXXXX      $XX.xx
30 Jan 2005  Tip for Q. XXXXXXXXX                         $ X.xx


In other words, answers are shown line by line with amount (75% of the
listed price goes to researchers).

And tips are shown as a separate entity, also line by line as given by customer.
Researchers receive 100% of tips. 

Does this make sense?  I hope this clarifies the tip issue for you. :)  
Please let me know if this isn't clear.


Signed,
tl aka tlspiegel

Thanks, tl.  You kept at it until I really had what I needed.

Archae0pteryx

Tryx --

Dymanite began being used for demolition purposes in the late 19th century:

"Dynamite certainly wasn't new; in the late 19th century, Alfred Nobel
created dynamite from nitroglycerin; wisely anticipating the fear such
a product would inspire, he named it "safety blasting powder." But
explosives had largely been used in massive jobs like mining and
highway-building. Jack was the first to use small amounts of
explosives to weaken a structure's integrity, thereby causing the
structure to fall by its own weight?to implode rather than to explode.
He was the first to prove that implosion could be a cheap, safe, and
efficient way to demolish buildings that had outlived their
usefulness."

University of Georgia: Making an Impact
http://www.uga.edu/gm/399/FeatImp.html 


Before that, what?  If noone gets to your question before tomorrow, I
will have a look.

markj-ga

Hi, markj--

Thank you for your interest in my question.

I'm not so concerned about what was used before dynamite as I am with
what was used when (or where) dynamite wasn't feasible.  For example,
suppose a residential structure had to come down without destroying
neighboring structures.  Suppose a fire destroyed or severely damaged
a stone house that was built on a wood frame (or several with shared
walls, such as in an urban European setting).

And in any case, dynamite or no, how would the unusable remains be
cleared away for new construction?  An army of guys with wheelbarrows?

Thanks,
Tryx

Hi Tryx,

Does this help any?

"A typical house in a typical village (if there was such a thing)
would be built to last for twenty years or so. When it began to
disintegrate, a new one would be built. The old structure, if it could
still stand, would be used as an out-building. By the 14th century
houses were being built to last twice as long, but nevertheless there
seems to have been no particular attachment to the "old homestead",
and sons tore down old houses and put up new. Even in villages such as
Wharram Percy, where houses were built of stone, this pattern was
followed"

http://scholar.chem.nyu.edu/tekpages/peasanthouses.html

=========

"The house we are staying in was built around 1510 and was spared
destruction during the French Revolution while the peasants tore down,
brick by brick, most of the surrounding buildings to construct their
own dwellings."

http://www.abbiorca.com/bike/cross/reports/Gina-Hall/2004/jan-8-2004.html

Thanks, tlspiegel, it does help some.  But here is what I'm getting
at:  an article of value is hidden in or near a house of medieval
construction.  The article is discovered centuries later--but prior to
1900--as the house is being turn down.  By what method is it being
torn down?--and therefore by what manner of workman, in the midst of
what manner of activity, is the article found?

Tryx

Does this help?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=article&node=&contentId=A63030-2000Nov27&notFound=true

No shopkeepers were going to stand in the way of progress. The Boss
made certain of that. While his hastily assembled demolition crews set
to work the night of Sept. 3, 1872, with their ropes and
sledgehammers--releasing a horde of displaced rodents to the frenzied
terriers--Shepherd was at his D.C. estate entertaining the judge who
might have otherwise issued an injunction against the work at hand.

Yes, some, thanks, tlspiegel.  A picture is slowly emerging, but it
isn't there yet.

Tryx

Quite possibly debris from demolished structures was carried away in
the same manner as they were built.

Pack horses, Oxen, and mules pulled wagons and carts for supplies.

To that end I wondered just what horse breeds/types were around in
17th century Europe.

Here is a survey of horse breeds of Europe. I've included some modern
(18th, 19th, & 20th century) breeds to cover the "But what about (fill
in the breed here)?" questions. Also below are two short sections
presented to give some background on draft horses.

Heavy Draft Horses

From the International Museum of the Horse on draft horses in America
and why they bred them bigger in the 19th century. Note: This is Horse
History Lite and refers to the USA.

By the early Medieval period (500 to 1,000 A.D.), a particular type of
heavy horse known as the "Black Horse of Flanders" had settled in the
European low country, in what is presently Belgium and Northern
France. This would be the father of all modern draft horses.

http://homepage.mac.com/msb/163x/faqs/horse_pow.html

=========

SWORDS INTO PLOWSHARES 
The original Great Horse of Flanders is the ancestor of the modern-day
draft horse. He was also known as the Great Horse of the Middle Ages,
and the Black Horse of Flanders.
Belgium is regarded as his homeground. His descendants are, to name a
few: Belgians, Clydesdales, Percherons, Shires, and the Suffolk Punch.
In the Middle Ages, he was both a war charger and a field horse, and,
as such, played an important role in daily life. The heavy soil that
made him strong required a heavy horse to till it.

http://aranglen.tripod.com/Horses/horses.html

Good going, tlspiegel (may I call you tl?), but don't get too medieval
on me.  The house was in use in the early 1400s, but demolished in
1887.  I can change the year of demolition a little bit if it suits
the history better.

As you appear to have correctly surmised, the house is in the region
known as Flanders.  (And I might have other uses for that horse. 
Thank you.)

You guys are going to know my whole story before I get it all put
together, I think!

Tryx

Hi Tryx,

Yes, you may call me tl. Many people in real life and online do!

Where do we go from here?  

We have wagons, carts, ropes, sledgehammers, mules, oxen, horses, sons
who tore down houses brick by brick, stone by stone.  Lots of dust and
debris.

Are we getting closer?

Thanks,
tl

Oh, let's hide the article inside a harpsichord!   :)

http://www.sankey.ws/history.html

"1400

What we know today as a harpsichord seems to have evolved in the early
1400s in Flanders. The earliest ones had the thick cases typical of
later Flemish instruments, ..."

tl,

Yes.  A crew of men (10? 100?) is tearing down a single house in
Belgium in 1887.  The implements in their hands are x and y, and the
ground tools are z.  X seems to be sledgehammers.  Is y shovels?  Is z
wheelbarrows?  I can't see a yard full of carts and mules or horses. 
Too hard to navigate, and too valuable to endanger.  They are probably
waiting on the street.

I would love to know the size of the crew, too, but it probably
doesn't matter and wasn't in my question.

Looks like this one is going to end up in your lap, tl.

Tryx

Handheld Implements: 
X's and Y's = shovels, ropes, pickaxes, sledgehammers

Ground tools: 
Z's =  wheelbarrows and buckets

Forgot to add:

brooms and dustpans - clean up smaller debris

They used a bundle of twigs tied to a handle.  It was called a "beson"
(pronounced BEE-zum).

=========

Meanwhile, back in Europe, the birch or besom broom industry, as it
was called, had prospered since Saxon times in the sandy heath areas
of south-east England, where the birch grows profusely. Known as Besom
Squires, the craftsmen were numerous along the Surrey-Sussex border,
and they employed assistants who worked individually in the coppices.
The brooms were made of birch twigs attached to a handle of ash, hazel
or chestnut.
http://www.broomshop.com/history/

=========

http://www.workingwoodlands.info/besommaking.htm

Hey, tl--I have the picture.  I think it's about time to do a little
answer-posting.

Thanks,
Tryx

P.S.  Sorry, no, the article is actually sealed inside an earthenware
vessel and buried.  A harpsichord would not have been sitting in the
parlor for 500 years, I'm afraid, and anyway in all that time somebody
would surely have peeked to see why it was going
plinkety-plinkety-clunk.

Captain Corelli's Mandolin did not go 'plink-plink' :)

The way I see it a modest Belgian town house damaged by fire would be
collapsed inwards (someone mentioned ropes above) by knocking out
supporting walls.

The rubble would certainly have been carted away, the cart would have
been loaded by a chain gang - as wheel barrows get in the way of each
other in a confined space. They are also a bitch to get up to / into a
skip or cart.
- only of use for distance travel.

The initial 'collapse' could be handled by about three guys - one to
climb the structure and pull up the ropes, another to feed the ropes -
and the third to coordinate things. After that one or two reckless
individuals attack the supporting walls.

I can base this on personal experience as we once demolished the
interior of a friend's Victorian cottage (interior walls, chimney
stack etc) with a 4lb hammer, some equally ineffective tools and heavy
shoes.  The rubble went out of the back window - chain gang.
The operation was fuelled on beer - purportedly from Belgium.

Hi Archeo. Its a very interesting question. Having been in the game,
of demolition, for a couple of years, I can confirm that it is
possible to demolish any building with a hammer and a crowbar. It is
done from the top down, just about in exact reverse to the building
up. First the internal fittings, architraves, floorboards, anything to
be recycled. then the roof, tin or tile, then the roof structure,
mostly mainly timber, then the walls. Just those two tools, and maybe
a screwdriver, are all that is needed.