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Q: End Times Research ( No Answer,   10 Comments )
Question  
Subject: End Times Research
Category: Relationships and Society > Religion
Asked by: livealot-ga
List Price: $5.00
Posted: 24 Mar 2005 17:27 PST
Expires: 23 Apr 2005 18:27 PDT
Question ID: 500015
I have a growing interest in end time theory.  I have had my gambit of
religious involvements and my fair share of experience (which I
consider to be a priceless education).  I am not religious but have
been growing stronger in my faith lately. (Meaning I used to belong to
various church groups but choose now to follow my own belief system). 
I have come across several web sights relating to End Times.  They are
not representative of the type of research I would like to be doing. 
I am trying to avoid cult sights and the like.  My main goal is to
find material or data that relates to different religions believing
that the world ?as we know it? will end in the year 2012.  I know that
the Mayan calendar, the Katun, ends on December 2(?) at 6a.m.  I also
recall hearing information about the Hopi Indians having a set date
for the End Times.  Please find information that could potentially
correlate the belief systems of different cultures past or present. 
ie. Mayans and Hopis have __ in common in regards to End Time theory. 
I believe I will be expanding and narrowing this question but for the
5 dollars I have to offer I think I should leave it at that.
Answer  
There is no answer at this time.

Comments  
Subject: Re: End Times Research
From: pugwashjw-ga on 24 Mar 2005 20:19 PST
 
My comment will be Bible based, as opposed to 'religion' based. A lot
of ancient races with their religions had a common story of "the end
of the world". As well as the 'legend' of a worldwide flood. Psalm
49;1 mentions inhabitants of 'the system of things'. Jesus said in the
Book of Matthew that there would be 'the conclusion of the system of
things' . Matt.12;32 "whoever speaks a word against the Son of man
[Jesus] it will be forgiven him, but whoever speaks against the holy
spirit  [God's operating force], it will NOT be forgiven him, no, not
in this system of things nor in that to come". This conclusion or
ending is mentioned at verses 39, 40, 49 Matt.24;3, 28.20. Ephesians
2;7 mentions the coming systems of things and First Corinthians 10;11
mentions the 'ends' of the systems of things. So unless the Bible is
wrong, the world we know today is coming to and end. But is the earth
to be destroyed in some way? Isaiah 45;18 sets out the purpose of the
earth..made by God to be inhabited. First Chronicles 16;30 ...also the
productive land is firmly established, NEVER will it be made to totter
[or be destroyed]. Psalm 93;1, 96;10, 104;5 "He has founded the earth
upon its established places,it will not be made to totter to time
indefinite or forever". So it seems as if it is the political and even
religious systems that are going to be drastically changed , and even
done away with. And the earth we live on will remain. But will people
remain?. Psalm 37; 9-12, 28,29 & 34. "And he will exalt you to take
possesion of the earth, When the wicked ones are cut off, you will see
it". And what might the conditions on the earth in the 'new' system?.
Revelation 21;4. It cannot be too far off.
Subject: Re: End Times Research
From: livealot-ga on 24 Mar 2005 20:49 PST
 
Thank you for your comments pugwashjw.  Not really addressing my
question (I guess indirectly) but appreciated none-the-less.  As I
mentioned in my question, I have my own belief system.  What I am
looking for is more of a history lesson.  More scientific data, in
this case religious documentation, or at least stories about different
religions from different cultures having the same belief system.  More
specifically, I requested info on Mayan and Hopi culture and how their
belief systems may relate or match.  Other religions may have similar
matches.  I know plenty of Christians that believe the Second Coming
will occur in 2012.  This is my first post and realize that the info I
am looking for may take more than 5 dollars worth of work,  If that be
the case and I feel the need to expound, then I can always alter the
price.  Thank you.
Subject: Re: End Times Research
From: livealot-ga on 24 Mar 2005 21:03 PST
 
One other thing ? I believe strongly that the Bible is of God and
study scripture to become stronger in faith.  What I am doing here is
more of an exploration.  Please do not respond to this question with
scripture as this is not a debate over our personal beliefs in regard
to the rapture, but rather other cultures and sects beliefs in regard
to their End Times.
Subject: Re: End Times Research
From: slakemoth-ga on 25 Mar 2005 07:45 PST
 
Here are some key words to help you with your research. The word you
want to Google search is  "Millenarianism" This will give you lots of
hits and comparisons on "end time beliefs" with various belief
systems. Here is one of the pretty good ones I found.

http://mb-soft.com/believe/text/millenar.htm

try searching a combination like "Millenarianism Mayan" or
"Millenarianism Hopi" to get hits related to the various beliefs you
are trying to compare. Good luck.

I also feel compelled to throw my 2 cents in here. I teach adult
Sunday School classes ( for many years) and have done extensive
research into many oddball beliefs and concepts. End time beliefs are
a very intresting subject to delve into, but please be aware that this
can become dangerous the moment you start to obsess on the ideas and
let them start to rule your life. I have seen more than one person let
their lives go down the tubes because they became overly wrapped up in
impending end of the world as we know it. These scenarios HAVE NEVER
COME TO PASS, and in my opinion never will. It is nothing more than
the "free beer tomorrow" sign at the local watering hole... ever
present, but always one day away. There have of course been many lives
lost or ruined subscribing to this type of philosophy. There are many
people who are making a good living pepetuating this fear. ( LaHaye
and Jenkins for one), which is wrong on so many levels..... OK enough
of that....have fun with your research and use your new found
knowledge wisely.

Slakemoth
Subject: Re: End Times Research
From: pugwashjw-ga on 26 Mar 2005 05:17 PST
 
Hi Livealot. The scriptures I cited from the Bible are available to
every "Christian" religion and are not from any particular 'belief
system". I have tried to leave my personal beliefs out of the comment,
but the scriptures do make things plain. It is not really possible to
believe just one part of the Bible and not another. Jesus warned
people of the end of the system of things, still future, and because
it has not happened yet, leaves the possibility of doubting what he
said. But he also warned the inhabitants of Jerusalem that when they
saw the Roman Army surrounding the city, to flee to the mountains.
This actually occured in 66 C.E.[ 33 years after Jesus warned them]
and the residents of Jerusalem who took no notice suffered terribly
with starvation. The ones who obeyed the warning and fled were spared
the trauma. This is historical fact. It is an example we should heed.
Subject: Re: End Times Research
From: livealot-ga on 28 Mar 2005 11:14 PST
 
Thank you slakemoth, your info is very helpful.  I also concur with
your two cents.  It is dangerous whenever you obsess about anything,
much less a subject as heavy as this.  I appreciate your concerns but
just wish I had that kind of time.  I have a nine year old and a six
month old.  I am pretty much forced to live in the here and now.  Once
again, great info and thanks.  I haven?t had a lot of time to delve in
yet, but what I see is excellent info.

pugwasjw ? thank you for commenting again.  Good info and I appreciate
that it is Biblical.  Not really what I?m looking for though.  Do you
know any Bible passages that match up with history relating to the
Mayans or Hopi?

Researchers ? I would be happy to rephrase the question to more of a
5-dollar question if you would like.  Just let me know.
Subject: Re: End Times Research
From: pugwashjw-ga on 29 Mar 2005 03:05 PST
 
Hi Livealot. I do know of a scripture that might fit. Granted that you
accept that Almighty God and Jesus are two separate individuals, and
that after his baptism, Jesus had full knowledge of his pre-human
existence [Proverbs 8;22-30] and that he truly reflected all his
Fathers qualities, and maybe knowledge, then he would have had
knowledge of any people living in the Americas. There is even some
scant evidence that the Americas were known of in Jesus' day.
Therefore, the scripture at Matthew 24;14 could suit. But in Jesus'
day, it may not have been suitable to God's plan to "spread the good
news" to those in the Americas. But it is certainly being done these
days to their descendants. Matthew 24;14 " And the Good News of the
Kingdom WILL be preached in ALL THE INHABITED EARTH, for a witness to
all the nations, AND THEN THE END WILL COME".
Subject: Re: End Times Research
From: slakemoth-ga on 15 Apr 2005 12:22 PDT
 
Livealot, 
   While looking for something else I came across this most excellent
site from PBS's "Frontline" series. It is a brilliant and in depth
look at the "Apocalypse" as well as the history, and writings that
shape it. There are various areas that address your question above. I
haev provided 3 links to various parts..1) the main page, 2) a section
on the various end time beliefs, and 3) their "links" section, which
will give you countless other resources to
explore.....Enjoy.....fascinating stuff

Main Contents page:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/apocalypse/

Apocalypticism Explained:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/apocalypse/explanation/

The links portion of above site...lots of things that will interest you
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/apocalypse/etc/links.html
Subject: A few references
From: ulu-ga on 17 May 2005 00:04 PDT
 
THE MILLENNIUM, AND END-OF-THE-WORLD PROPHECIES
http://www.religioustolerance.org/end_wrld.htm
http://www.religioustolerance.org/end_wrl1.htm

Calendar Applet
http://emr.cs.iit.edu/home/reingold/calendar-book/Calendrica.html

Bad Astronomy
://www.google.com/search?q=site%3Abadastronomy.com+2012+mayan

I could not find any specific dates for the Hopi.  Their original
calendars might not even count the years, but were more concerned
about what happened during the year.

TOP 10 PROPHECIES FOR THE YEAR 2000
http://www.atlantisrising.com/issue2/ar2topten.html
WHAT HAVE THE HOPIS, MAYANS, AND OTHER NATIVE AMERICAN PEOPLES
FORESEEN ABOUT THE DESTRUCTION OF THE WORLD IN THE YEAR 2000?
Both the Hopis and Mayans recognize that we are approaching the end of
a World Age. But the former, however, offer no time limits, while the
latter have a calendar system whose grand Thirteen Baktun cycle will
end either on December 24, 2011 or June 6, 2012 (depending on your
method of calculation). In both cases, however, the Hopi and Mayan
elders do not prophesy that everything will come to an end. Rather,
this is a time of transition from one World Age into another. The
message they give concerns our making a choice of how we enter the
future ahead. Our moving through with either resistance or acceptance
will determine whether the transition will happen with cataclysmic
changes or gradual peace and tranquillity. The same theme can be found
reflected in the prophecies of many other Native American visionaries
from Black Elk to Sun Bear.

This concept that we can make choices concerning our future destinies
is one found not only in Native American prophecies but is really an
essential ingredient in all true prophetic pronouncements. True
prophecy is meant to be a reflection on the hidden natures and
motivations of human behavior, both individually and collectively, as
well as the future options based on the human ability to make a
choice. True prophecy is thus more than merely a forecast. Its purpose
is to provide the lesson that is to be learned from a potential future
prognostication so that, if possible, the lesson is accepted and
processed beforehand. Thus the course of the future can actually be
changed, and a different pathway of prophesied events can be
manifested into reality.

Hopi Tribe
http://www.hopi.nsn.us/history.asp
http://www.hopi.nsn.us/contact.asp

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vedic_timekeeping
Years are grouped into yugas (ages):
The Four Yugas 1,728,000 solar years Satya Yuga 
1,296,000 solar years Treta Yuga 
864,000 solar years Dwapar Yuga 
432,000 solar years Kali Yuga 

One cycle of the above four yugas is one mahayuga (4.32 million solar years) 
A manvantara consists of 71 mahayugas (306,720,000 solar years) 
After each manvantara follows one Sandhi Kala of the same duration as
a Krita Yuga (1,728,000 solar years). (It is said that during a Sandhi
Kala, the entire earth is submerged in water.)
A kalpa consists of a period of 1,728,000 solar years called Adi
Sandhi, followed by 14 manvantaras and Sandhi Kalas for a total of
1000 mahayugas or 4,320,000,000 (4.32 billion) solar years.
Two kalpas constitue a day and night of Brahma; the life cycle of
Brahma is one hundred years of Brahma, or 311 trillion years.
The current Kali Yuga (Iron Age) began at midnight 17 February / 18
February in 3102 BC in the proleptic Julian calendar.

Ghostbusters II (1989)
http://www.angelfire.com/tx3/80schild/ghost1.html
Milton: Well, I predict that the world will end at the stroke of
midnight on New Year's Eve.
Peter: This year? 
Milton: Mm-hmm. 
Peter: Well, that's cutting it a little bit close, isn't it! I mean-
just from a sales point of view! I mean, Your book is just coming out,
you're not going to see any paperback sales for at least a year, it'll
be at least another year before you know whether you've got that
mini-series or movie of the week kind of possibilities- I mean, just
devil's advocate, Miltie! Shouldn't you have said, "Hey, the world's
gonna end in 1992!" or better yet, 1994!
(Of course in the movie, it almost did end at the predicted time)
Subject: Re: End Times Research
From: livealot-ga on 18 May 2005 16:41 PDT
 
I just wanted to thank all of you who have commented.  I feel there is
a wealth of knowledge (and a bit of fluff) within the information left
on this thread.  I could dig as deep as I wanted into this and never
hit the bottom.  Slakemoth and Ulu, I have a feeling I could learn a
lot from you two.

Bye-the-way, the world (as you know it), is going to end this evening
shortly after you fall asleep.

I hope you enjoy tomorrow!

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