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Subject:
Grammar/Punctuation
Category: Reference, Education and News > General Reference Asked by: nelson-ga List Price: $5.00 |
Posted:
13 Apr 2005 06:42 PDT
Expires: 13 May 2005 06:42 PDT Question ID: 508736 |
I still prefer to type two spaces after a sentence-terminating period. I am 30 and was taught two. Apparently with the introduction of variable-width letters, we are now supposed to use only one. Am I alone? How many spaces do most people type? What do "experts" say? |
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Subject:
Re: Grammar/Punctuation
Answered By: pinkfreud-ga on 13 Apr 2005 13:45 PDT Rated: ![]() |
Howdy, Nelson. You're certainly not alone. Millions of people have been taught to put two spaces after a period at the end of a sentence. I never took typing classes in school. I learned (in the 1950s) from a book called "Typing Made Simple," which emphasized the importance of placing one space after a comma and two spaces after a period (or other sentence-ending punctuation, such as a question mark or exclamation point). In the days before home word processing and desktop publishing became common, the norm was two spaces. I continued to use two spaces well into the 1990s, when I accepted a job that involved transcribing and summarizing television news stories. The employer's stylebook specified one space after a period, and I taught myself to comply (which was not easy: the force of habit tends to wear ruts in the brain!). If you prowl around quite a bit online, as I do, you'll find many, many instances in which two spaces are used after periods. This is still so common that I doubt that anyone can call it wrong or substandard. However, most stylebooks these days recommend one space. Browsers that display text from HTML code typically turn two [or more] consecutive spaces into one. "When preparing text-only docs with a monospaced font (e.g. Courier), it's still a good idea to use two spaces. Otherwise, one space is the way to go as proportional fonts are designed to use the appropriate amount of space required by each character." Channel 9 Forums: Bill Hill - There is only one space after a period http://channel9.msdn.com/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=112 "The use of proportionally spaced type makes two spaces at the end of a sentence unnecessary (if they ever were). The extra spacing is often distracting and unattractive. It creates 'holes' in the middle of a block of text - trapped white space on a smaller scale... The Bottomline: Professional typesetters, designers, and desktop publishers should use one space only. Save the double spaces for typewriting, email, term papers, or personal correspondence. For everyone else, do whatever makes you feel good." About Desktop Publishing: Use One Space Between Sentences http://desktoppub.about.com/cs/typespacing/a/onetwospaces.htm "How many spaces go after a period? The current opinion is that one space should be typed after any punctuation. Many of us learned in typing class that two spaces should be typed after a period. This convention was used because of nature of the fixed font of typewriters. Computers, however, usually use proportional fonts and justification, which create the proper white space between sentences automatically when one space is typed." Junket Studies: 11 Rules of Writing http://www.junketstudies.com/rulesofw/faqs.html From the Chicago Manual of Style, one of the most respected authorities on usage and punctuation: "The view at CMS is that there is no reason for two spaces after a period in published work. Some people, however - my colleagues included - prefer it, relegating this preference to their personal correspondence and notes. I?ve noticed in old American books printed in the few decades before and after the turn of the last century (ca. 1870-1930 at least) that there seemed to be a trend in publishing to use extra space (sometimes quite a bit of it) after periods. And many people were taught to use that extra space in typing class (I was). But introducing two spaces after the period causes problems: (1) it is inefficient, requiring an extra keystroke for every sentence; (2) even if a program is set to automatically put an extra space after a period, such automation is never foolproof; (3) there is no proof that an extra space actually improves readability - as your comment suggests, it?s probably just a matter of familiarity (Who knows? perhaps it?s actually more efficient to read with less regard for sentences as individual units of thought - many centuries ago, for example in ancient Greece, there were no spaces even between words, and no punctuation); (4) two spaces are harder to control for than one in electronic documents (I find that the earmark of a document that imposes a two-space rule is a smattering of instances of both three spaces and one space after a period, and two spaces in the middle of sentences); and (5) two spaces can cause problems with line breaks in certain programs. So, in our efficient, modern world, I think there is no room for two spaces after a period. In the opinion of this particular copyeditor, this is a good thing." Chicago Manual of Style: One Space or Two? http://www.press.uchicago.edu/Misc/Chicago/cmosfaq/cmosfaq.OneSpaceorTwo.html Here's an excellent discussion of the one space/two spaces issue: WebWord: One Versus Two Spaces After a Period http://www.webword.com/reports/period.html Another interesting discussion, on a forum devoted to issues related to typography: Typophile Forums: Double-spacing after periods http://www.typophile.com/forums/messages/30/27993.html?1078892522 Google search strategy: Google Web Search: "one space" "two spaces" "after a period" ://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%22one+space%22+%22two+spaces%22+%22after+a+period%22 I hope this is helpful. My own view of the matter is that, since one space is becoming the new norm, and since it saves a tiny amount of time and effort, I'll use one space after a period. However, if I see someone using two spaces, my lip will not curl into a sneer. I reserve my Billy Idol impersonation for more serious matters. ;-) Best, Pink |
nelson-ga
rated this answer:![]() As always, I appreciate the great research. Thank you. |
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Subject:
Re: Grammar/Punctuation
From: probonopublico-ga on 13 Apr 2005 06:50 PDT |
You are indeed alone! And deservedly so ... Have you not considered the unnecessary waste that results from your actions? If everybody were so similarly wasteful, it would mean the loss of another five rain forests, every year. |
Subject:
Re: Grammar/Punctuation
From: nelson-ga on 13 Apr 2005 07:36 PDT |
I see your point. I'll start using a smaller font, too, since that would use up less RAM and therefore less electricity. :-) |
Subject:
Re: Grammar/Punctuation
From: myoarin-ga on 13 Apr 2005 12:43 PDT |
I was taught to, too -two- and still do, because it really is easier for the eye to recognized the end of a sentence, or to find the beginning of one when you have glanced away. And since we do this in a paperless world, Probo's rain forests remain intact (but they aren't used to make paper, anyway. And Sweden has twice as much forest as it did 100 years ago, and Germany also more than back then, the UK probably to - reforestation in Scotland). Wanted to check what others here do, but will do that later. Cheers, and remember, it's like being sent to prison: after one sentence, you should leave more space before you start the next one. |
Subject:
Re: Grammar/Punctuation
From: pinkfreud-ga on 13 Apr 2005 17:02 PDT |
Nelson, Thank you very much for the kind words, the five stars, and the nice tip! ~Pink |
Subject:
Re: Grammar/Punctuation
From: dps1-ga on 15 Apr 2005 02:06 PDT |
I learned to type in a typing class on a typewriter. I went to school to become a graphic designer and learned about typography. Most fonts on computers are set to use proportional spacing based on the size of the character, so smaller letters take up less space. The double-space is automatically taken into account on characters which should end a sentence on a computer. If you double-space after a period on a computer, it's technically like putting 4 spaces between sentences. Some fonts are exceptions to the rule. They are monotype fonts where every letter is equally spaced. Monotype fonts follow typewriter rules. And, yes, when on a typewriter, TWO spaces is correct. When on a computer, 99% of the time, ONE space is correct. So, the real question is are you typing an old-fashion typewriter or are you typing on a computer? |
Subject:
Re: Grammar/Punctuation
From: marcadamianut-ga on 19 Apr 2005 10:15 PDT |
I learned typing on a typewriter in the 80s, so was taught to use two spaces between sentences. Some time after that, I heard this rule of thumb about word processing and proportionally spaced fonts eliminating the necessity for two spaces and retrained myself to use only one. Some time after that, I started grad school and found that the thesis requirements included following APA style, which is to use two spaces between sentences, and retrained myself once again. This made me look into the subject and it all comes down to 1) personal preference and 2) the guidelines expected for the situation. There is no blanket "right" or "wrong" for all situations, only rules and guidelines for specific situations. In terms of personal preference, I have chosen to stick with the classic approach in most situations. In addition to two spaces between sentences, I follow the old rules of two spaces after a colon, a space between each dot of an ellipsis (even though many word processing programs autoformat and compress the three individual dots into a single three-dot character), and most importantly (in my opinion), I keep the good old serial comma (1, 2, and 3 not 1, 2 and 3). I have primarily made these choices based on my sense of readability--I believe that use of an extra space between sentences and the serial comma ease comprehension and increase reading speed. For style guidelines, the business, technical, legal, and journalism worlds usually favor a single space between sentences (and no serial comma) and the academic and scientific worlds keep the two-space rule. It is almost unanimously considered "wrong" in the journalism community to use either the double-space between sentences or the serial comma, but I plan to keep using and endorsing both for a long, long time. |
Subject:
Re: Grammar/Punctuation
From: myoarin-ga on 19 Apr 2005 18:37 PDT |
Marcadamianut, A man (woman?) after my own heart! Rules of spelling and punctuation are for pedants who know how but not what they want to express. ;-) (Any rebutals can only come fron pedants. More grins!) Someone sent me this site, but I am afraid to look at it: http://owl.english.purdue.edu/ myoarin |
Subject:
Re: Grammar/Punctuation
From: stressedmum-ga on 24 Apr 2005 23:22 PDT |
And what about the practice of using double quotation marks " rather than singles '. Think of the rain forests that will continue to stand proudly if every newspapers, book publishers etc. had a quote quota. |
Subject:
Re: Grammar/Punctuation
From: nelson-ga on 25 Apr 2005 03:50 PDT |
StressedMum, you must be British. We use double quotes this side of the pond. It must be creeping into Jolly Olde England.. |
Subject:
Re: Grammar/Punctuation
From: myoarin-ga on 25 Apr 2005 06:52 PDT |
Let me say this about that: "If you are going to write: 'Stressedmum must be British,' then you should know that there are lots of stressed mums in the UK, but only one 'Stressedmum', thus you could write: 'The well-known commenter, "Stressedmum", appears to prefer Birtish usage.'" (I know, commas - before or after the Q-marks? "I did it my way.") |
Subject:
Re: Grammar/Punctuation
From: stressedmum-ga on 02 May 2005 17:03 PDT |
In addition to being stressed I'm also confused because I'm a British gel gently brought up in the Antipodes so to Brits I sound like Kylie and to Aussies I sound like, well, Kylie (because she's got an English accent these days). When it comes to double spaces and single spaces, I'm in publishing and it's definitely a case of singles in print nowadays -- I haven't worked on any publication that permits double spaces after full stops, colons etc. You'll find that many early publications had a style whereby they actually inserted a space before any sentence-ending punctuation . (Like that !) But when it comes to double- and single quotation marks it seems that no matter what I use, the informed 'others' are using the other. So, dear nelson it matters not what side of the pond we're on, both sides (up, down or is that east, west?) are battling it out with singles and doubles and when there is a result, will someone let me know please? ;) And dear myoarin, there's also a healthy debate about what is correct usage of punctuation within or outside quotation marks. I have a style sheet pro forma which I complete for every publication I work on. There are several schools of thought on this and so it's easier (and fiscally necessary) to comply with the client's preferred style rather than adhere to one style. I am, however, staging a one-woman battle against the use of apostrophes to create plurals (e.g. video's, do's). It's rife here in Australia and I wish our ever-taxing governments (state and federal) would introduce an apostrophe tax with offenders being fined for incorrect usage (and a manadatory gaol/jail term for teachers doing it -- they seem to be the worst offenders!); or the use of an apostrophe to indicate the possessive in pronouns (e.g. it's instead of its, your's instead of yours) -- and my particular pet hate, the use of "your" when what is meant is "you're". When I go out with friends to a restaurant, they get me to proof read the wine label before we select it and if there's a typo, we won't get it because we figure if the wine company is so careless about something as important as their label, then they mustn't be very careful with the bottle's contents either! Cheers Stressedmum |
Subject:
Re: Grammar/Punctuation
From: myoarin-ga on 02 May 2005 19:02 PDT |
Stressedmum! You ain't got no problems like the Germans got: with apostrophies. German does not have them for the possessive, but they are starting to appear all over, wrong usage in German, wrong usage if it were English. "Spiegel" magazine (a "Time" - like weekly) has a column on its website about grammar that hits all the misusage (or is it missusage? Looks like the princess of something a nice girl wouldn't want to volunteer for.). The column even include a declention or conjugation table now and then, 'cause the natives don't learn their language in school any more. Whatever, you and Archae0pteryx can stick with one space after a full stop. I still like my two. And buy "cleanskin" wine and you'll have no trouble with the labels. And since you're here; what does "yar Orrong" mean? A street name in Toorak that someone asked about. Cheers, and have frosty Foster's for me. They know that they can't spell, just 4 Xs on the label. Myoarin |
Subject:
Re: Grammar/Punctuation
From: archae0pteryx-ga on 03 May 2005 00:30 PDT |
Uh-oh, tagged me wrong again, Myoarin. I always type two spaces after a period, and I will type two spaces forever, just as I have done for more than four decades. I don't even try to do otherwise because I dislike the airless, ill-proportioned look of the single space. Programs like FrameMaker that deliver only one space when I type two are a ceaseless annoyance to me. So put me down as a confirmed double-spacer. Archae0pteryx |
Subject:
Re: Grammar/Punctuation
From: nelson-ga on 03 May 2005 03:37 PDT |
I'm glad to see my little question has fostered such discussion. Thanks for all your comments! |
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