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Q: Hacking websites - need real Internet guru ( Answered 5 out of 5 stars,   13 Comments )
Question  
Subject: Hacking websites - need real Internet guru
Category: Computers > Internet
Asked by: archae0pteryx-ga
List Price: $27.19
Posted: 17 Apr 2005 15:55 PDT
Expires: 17 May 2005 15:55 PDT
Question ID: 510561
Serious question here.

Is it possible for someone to hack into a personal website and make it
inaccessible to the owner (such as by changing the password for
website services) or even to cause the whole site to disappear from
the host service?  Someone in my family has had a website of long
standing suddenly become inoperable, as in gone--the URL comes up as
an error.  No e-mail comes or goes.  The name cannot be found in the
host website services.

I'm not interested in responses that ask if he's checked this
connection or that setting.  Anyone trying to access the website from
anywhere will get a "could not be found" message.  This is not related
to anything taking place on his local system.

So far the host service has been unresponsive.  And of course there's
no phone number--online contact only.

There is some reason to suspect foul play because of other
e-communications dysfunctionalities that have come upon him in the
past year.  I just want to know how far someone could really go,
presuming he had the knowhow and the will, to disrupt someone else's
website.

Please answer:
1.  What can a third party do to interfere with someone's maintenance
of his or her own personal website?
2.  How could such interference be detected?
3.  What can the website owner do to counteract and/or defend against
such an attack?

Thank you,
Archae0pteryx
Answer  
Subject: Re: Hacking websites - need real Internet guru
Answered By: hammer-ga on 18 Apr 2005 14:09 PDT
Rated:5 out of 5 stars
 
archae0pteryx-ga,

Per your instructions, I'm posting my main comment as an answer.
Additional information is available in my other comments, viewable
below.

By the way, the comment I wrote about disparaging remarks was not
intended as either a judgement of the web content or an excuse for the
hacker. You asked about whether a person would be motivated to attack
a web site that they considered to be a thorn in their side. The
comment was intended to illustrate what might motivate such a person.
In this case, it is the potential hacker's perceptions that are at
issue, as opposed to an unbiased evaluation of the site content.

--- FROM COMMENTS --
To answer your questions:
<<1.  What can a third party do to interfere with someone's maintenance
of his or her own personal website?>>

If they hack the server, anything they want. Since servers sit out
there 24 hours a day, the hackers have plenty of time to find a way
in.

<<2.  How could such interference be detected?>>

By evaluating the symptoms and digging throgh log files looking for
missing information. Hackers often cover their tracks by deleting
pieces of key log files.

<<3.  What can the website owner do to counteract and/or defend against
such an attack?>>

Nothing. The owner of the server computer (the hosting service) is
responsible for locking down the server. The individual websites do
not have access to the necessary settings, unless they have root
access to the server. This access is available with certain hosting
packages, but I don't know if you have one of these.

--------------------------

I hope the information I provided helps you to get to the bottom of
your disappearing site mystery.

- Hammer
archae0pteryx-ga rated this answer:5 out of 5 stars
Many thanks, Hammer.  Your answers have helped create a realistic
picture of the situation and the possibilities that exist.  I don't
know how this one is going to turn out, but I'm a website owner too,
and it is scary to see how vulnerable we are.

Archae0pteryx

Comments  
Subject: Re: Hacking websites - need real Internet guru
From: steph53-ga on 17 Apr 2005 17:32 PDT
 
Hi Tryx....

No offence, but the subject of your question makes it look like you
may be a hacker ( I KNOW that you aren't ) but when I first read it
w/o seeing your name, thats what I was thinking.

IMHO only :(

Steph53
Subject: Re: Hacking websites - need real Internet guru
From: archae0pteryx-ga on 17 Apr 2005 18:02 PDT
 
Yikes.  Thanks, Steph.  *** NO *** I am not a hacker!  As a relative
of the presumed victim, I am trying to find out something about what a
hacker could do to someone.  The website is completely down, gone, no
such URL, and all the mail that comes through it
(username[at]thatwebsite.org] is stopped.  Because the website owner
has been embroiled in some internal organizational politics and
because some antagonistic members do possess considerable Internet
savvy, he thinks it is more than coincidence that his key web e-mail
accounts have been disabled or corrupted to the point that they were
lost or closed, and now his website.  I just want to know if someone
can really do that to another person's website or domain name.

Tryx
Subject: Re: Hacking websites - need real Internet guru
From: crythias-ga on 17 Apr 2005 19:40 PDT
 
With a password in hand... the sky's the limit. Or, rather, the
Hosting Site's limits are the limit..

Good idea to change passwords. :)
Subject: Re: Hacking websites - need real Internet guru
From: archae0pteryx-ga on 17 Apr 2005 19:49 PDT
 
Crythias, I don't really understand your comment.  A person with a
password can make someone's entire domain name seem not to
exist?--i.e., get nothing but an error message in response to the URL?
 Wouldn't they have to know where it was hosted and what the account
name was and everything?

Archae0pteryx
Subject: Re: Hacking websites - need real Internet guru
From: hammer-ga on 17 Apr 2005 20:00 PDT
 
archae0pteryx-ga,

Without the help of the people who own/adminster the server computer,
getting the details you ask for will be impossible.

In brief, someone with a password into the server machine can easily
render the website inaccessible via several methods. If the password
allows maintenance of email accounts, then email can also be
disrupted.

A decent hacker can sometimes parlay a limited access password into
full root access, at which point they can reassign IP addresses, kill
the web server process, muck with name services, etc.

You are not being specific enough about the error messages or the
nature of the web service to give your more information about what may
be going on. For example, if the site has its own domain, you can try
pinging it. Ping should give you back an IP address. You can then
confirm that IP address with the web server to make sure they match,
but you'll need to be able to contact the hosting service for that.

Bottom line: Yes, someone with a password could cause the behavior you
describe. So could the hosting service messing up a cofiguration
setting. Only the host really has the access needed to figure this
out.

- Hammer
Subject: Re: Hacking websites - need real Internet guru
From: hammer-ga on 17 Apr 2005 20:08 PDT
 
archae0pteryx-ga,

I'm sorry, I just realized that you never said the person had a
password. I was confused by a comment.

To answer your questions:
<<1.  What can a third party do to interfere with someone's maintenance
of his or her own personal website?>>

If they hack the server, anything they want. Since servers sit out
there 24 hours a day, the hackers have plenty of time to find a way
in.

<<2.  How could such interference be detected?>>

By evaluating the symptoms and digging throgh log files looking for
missing information. Hackers often cover their tracks by deleting
pieces of key log files.

<<3.  What can the website owner do to counteract and/or defend against
such an attack?>>

Nothing. The owner of the server computer (the hosting service) is
responsible for locking down the server. The individual websites do
not have access to the necessary settings, unless they have root
access to the server. This access is available with certain hosting
packages, but I don't know if you have one of these.

- Hammer
Subject: Re: Hacking websites - need real Internet guru
From: archae0pteryx-ga on 17 Apr 2005 20:51 PDT
 
Hammer,

It sounds like you know the answer and will probably want to post it. 
I'd just like to clarify a point.  You said, "You are not being
specific enough about the error messages or the nature of the web
service to give your more information about what may be going on."

Here is a nonexistent domain name.  I just made this up.->  jkljkl.com
 If you try to go there, you get the same error message that we get in
typing in the domain name in question, which was a working site for
many years up until a few days ago.

The website owner has a domain name that is currently registered until
about 2009.  He also said that he has a very strong and unguessable
password for his account that was put in place a while back, well
before this problem arose.

So, Hammer, are you saying that someone can get into a server directly
and mess with a person's website without going through any kind of
account access or password process?  How would they even know what
server the website was on?  Is that something that your ordinary
hacker could do, or would it require special equipment and some kind
of genius?  Is it a whole lot of trouble?  Is it something a person
with good Internet skills would be likely to go to the trouble of
doing just to shut up someone who was a thorn in his side?

How do you ping a site?

Thanks,
Archae0pteryx
Subject: Re: Hacking websites - need real Internet guru
From: hammer-ga on 18 Apr 2005 05:11 PDT
 
<<He also said that he has a very strong and unguessable password for his account>>

Famous last words... :)

<<So, Hammer, are you saying that someone can get into a server directly
and mess with a person's website without going through any kind of
account access or password process? >> 

That's what hacking is all about. Getting access to a computer via any
number of means. This can include exploiting flaws in the operating
system, using automated password crackers, or "social engineering"
(tricking someone into revealing their password). Once the hacker has
even limited access to the server, that access can be parlayed into
full root access. At that point, they can affect accounts other than
the one they hacked in through.

<<How would they even know what server the website was on?>>

That part is easy. Your website has an IP address. That IP address is
registered as being within the range belonging to a particular server.

<<Is that something that your ordinary hacker could do, or would it
require special equipment and some kind of genius?  Is it a whole lot
of trouble?>>

Depends on the server and how much attention they pay to security. You
can download a set of scripts from the Internet that will sit there
pounding on servers for you.

<<Is it something a person with good Internet skills would be likely
to go to the trouble of doing just to shut up someone who was a thorn
in his side?>>

You don't actually need much skill. A combination of malice, boredom
and a hacking script you don't actually understand is often
sufficient. I've seen people do some truly insane things because of an
Internet posting. Keep in mind that, by being a thorn in someone's
side in an Internet environment, you have said something upsetting
and/or embarassing in a place which is very public and strangely
permanent. Imagine if someone walked into your office evey morning and
 wrote something disparaging about you on the wall where everyone
would see it. If you couldn't make it stop, and you couldn't clean the
wall, it would become very upsetting day after day. Upset people do
things. If this is a hack, this person may consider it to be an act of
self-defense. The combination of anonymity and the intangible quality
of digital property can cloud a person's judgement sometimes. A person
who would never vandalize your house, doesn't see the parallel in
vandalizing your website.

As to figuring out if this is malice or simply a misconfigured web
server, again, you will need the help of the host.

- Hammer
Subject: Re: Hacking websites - need real Internet guru
From: archae0pteryx-ga on 18 Apr 2005 13:56 PDT
 
Thanks, Hammer.  I think you should post as an answer (ok with me if
it just points to the comments).  I think you answered everything I
asked and more.

Just to clear up one point--he is not posting disparaging things about
people.  He is allowing space for open discussion of factual
information that others, for their own reasons, would prefer to
repress.  It's all very political, not personal.  But regardless, it
can't be legal to cut off someone's access to his own personal,
legitimate, legal, and paid-for web service.

Archae0pteryx
Subject: Re: Hacking websites - need real Internet guru
From: archae0pteryx-ga on 18 Apr 2005 16:11 PDT
 
And--to take your analogy--it is more as if I wrote something on *my*
wall that someone over there in another cube didn't like (even though
it was not about him), and he came in and took out my wall.
Subject: Re: Hacking websites - need real Internet guru
From: peroxide-ga on 25 Jun 2005 10:26 PDT
 
RedTyphoon - You've either watched Hackers one too many times, or you
forgot to mention the real author of the hacker's manifesto. It's The
Mentor. =)
Subject: Re: Hacking websites - need real Internet guru
From: sharedinterest-ga on 22 Sep 2005 06:01 PDT
 
People forget that hacking isn't just about sitting at a computer and
typing script. Hacking is also a social event as well. Many hosting
companies only ask for trivial security information to obtain access
to key things such as passwords or ftp access.

Domain hi-jacking is a big concern as many people ignore what they
think to be junk mail, only to find out it is a domain transfer
request. The best thing to do is registrar lock your domain names, and
request that the account be locked unless a keyword is used. A good
site I found that can explain hacking password protected websites is
www.hackerscatalog.com.
They have a CD there that has tools one would use to hack into
password protected websites, such as ftp:///yourdomain.com. and so on.

If you want to learn how or why it happened to you, look at domain
hi-jacking on the internet and go to the site above and see some of
the material they carry and learn some of it. When you understand how
it happens, you can guard against it.

SharedInterest
Subject: Re: Hacking websites - HackersCatalog.com
From: kissmymoore-ga on 16 Jan 2006 07:45 PST
 
The last comment in this thread was to check out the
hackerscatalog.com website and learn some of the things there. I did
in fact take the advice of the thread and pick up the hacking password
protected cd-rom you speak of. I also picked up a couple more titles.
Needless to say, before reading this article, I didn't know sites like
this existed. I in fact have leared allot since then with the help of
other blogs, threads and materials obtained through the site mentioned
that I have tighted up my computer systems and I am not so nieve
anymore. Thank you again for your recommendations and a quality
website recommendation.
Mr. Moore

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