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Subject:
The concept of Hell in Judaism around AD 30
Category: Relationships and Society > Religion Asked by: oz1cz-ga List Price: $50.00 |
Posted:
05 Sep 2005 01:40 PDT
Expires: 05 Oct 2005 01:40 PDT Question ID: 564381 |
Background: The Old Testament in the Bible tells us that around the 8th century BC apostate Israelites would sacrifice children to heathen Gods in a place known as "Hinnom's valley" or "Hinnom's son's valley" (for example in 2 Chronicles 28:3). Hinnom's valley is located outside Jerusalem and allegedly later became a rubbish dump. However, when Jesus started preaching, he referred to Hinnom's valley as a place of eternal punishment. The Hebrew words "ge Hinnom" (Hinnom's valley) became "gehenna" in Greek, and this word is translated "Hell" in most English bibles. For instance, Jesus said: "Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell." (Matthew 10:28) It is interesting to note that Jesus never explains what he means by "Hell". Apparently, it was obvious to his audience what he meant. It appears to have been common knowledge back then that eternal punishment took place in Hinnom's valley, or in a place that was symbolically referred to as "Hinnom's valley". So, at some time between the end of the Old Testament (around 400 BC) and the time when Jesus preached (around AD 30) the Jewish religion started associating the expression "Hinnom's valley" with a place of eternal punishment. Now for my question: When and how did Judaism associate eternal punishment with Hinnom's valley? |
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Subject:
Re: The concept of Hell in Judaism around AD 30
Answered By: easterangel-ga on 05 Sep 2005 03:32 PDT Rated: |
Hi! Thanks for a very interesting question. This is a very interesting question and it seems the consensus is that even before the Jews were brought in exile, Hinnom?s valley was already being treated as a symbolism of hell. It is true that at the outset, this was used in pagan sacrifice ceremonies such as the burning of children. But as the time of Josiah came, this valley was then transformed. ?The valley of Hinnom is part of the pleasant wadi or valley, which bounds Jerusalem on the south. Josh. 15: 8; 18: 6. Here, in ancient times and under some of the idolatrous kings, the worship of Moloch, the horrid idol-god of the Ammonites, was practiced. To this idol, children were offered in sacrifice. II Kings 23: 10; Ezek. 23: 37, 39; II Chron. 28: 3; Lev. 28: 21; 20: 2. If we may credit the Rabbins, the head of the idol was like that of an ox; while the rest of the body resembled that of a man. It was hollow within; and being heated by fire, children were laid in its arms and were literally roasted alive. We cannot wonder, then at the severe terms in which the worship of Moloch is everywhere denounced in the Scriptures. Nor can we wonder that the place itself should have been called Tophet, i.e., abomination, detestation, (from toph, to vomit with loathing)." Jer. 8: 32; 19: 6; II Kings 23: 10; Ezek. 23: 36, 39.? "After these sacrifices had ceased, the place was desecrated, and made one of loathing and horror. The pious king Josiah caused it to be polluted, i.e., he caused to be carried there the filth of the city of Jerusalem. It would seem that the custom of desecrating this place thus happily begun, was continued in after ages down to the period when our Savior was on earth. Perpetual fires were kept up in order to consume the offal which was deposited there. And as the same offal would breed worms, (for so all putrefying meat does of course), hence came the expression, 'Where the worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.' " Stuart's Exegetical Ess., pp. 140-141. ?THE BIBLE HELL? http://www.tentmaker.org/books/TheBibleHell.html ------------------ Eventually, when the Israelites returned from the exile, they followed the practice adapted by Josiah. ?After their return from the Babylonian, the Jews turned the Hinnom Valley into the city dump where garbage and anything deemed unclean (including the bodies of executed criminals) was incinerated. For that purpose, a fire was kept constantly burning there. Even though it was no longer used for evil worship, with all the filth and thick smoke it remained a very dark and dreary place.? ?Valley Of Hell? http://www.keyway.ca/htm2001/20010215.htm ------------------ So following this idea we can say the following in terms of dates: Josiah?s reign ? (640-609 b.c.e.) http://www.oxfordscholarship.com/oso/public/content/religion/0195133242/toc.html 2 Kings 22:3 says that Josiah got started performing reforms at the 18th year of his reign so this will probably mean that Jews first got the idea of a picture of hell in Hinnom at around 622 b.c.e. ------------------- Another theory is that Isaiah may have showed this imagery much earlier than Josiah?s time. The book of Isaiah is believed to be written in 740 - 680 B.C. ?Topheth has long been prepared; it has been made ready for the king. Its fire pit has been made deep and wide, with an abundance of fire and wood; the breath of the LORD, like a stream of burning sulfur, sets it ablaze. - Isaiah 30:33 (New International Version) ?The place of these abominable sacrifices is also called Tophet, Isaiah 30:33 Jeremiah 7:31. According to some, this name is derived from the Hebrew toph, drum, because drums are supposed to have been used to drown the cries of the victims. But this opinion rests only on conjecture. King Josiah defiled the place, 2 Kings 23:10, probably by making it a depository of filth. It has been a common opinion that the later Jews, in imitation of Josiah, threw into this place all manner of filth, as well as the carcasses of animals and the dead bodies of malefactors; and that with reference to either the baleful idolatrous fires in the worship of Moloch, or to the fires afterwards maintained there to consume the mass of impurities that might otherwise have occasioned a pestilence, came the figurative use of the fires of Gehenna, that is, valley of Hinnom, to denote the eternal fire in which wicked men and fallen spirits shall be punished. This supposition, however, rests upon uncertain grounds.? Croosmap: Hinnom http://dictionary.crossmap.com/definition/hinnom.htm ?When was the Bible written and who wrote it?? http://www.carm.org/bible/biblewhen.htm Search terms used: Hinnom Hinnom?s valley Josiah, Isaiah I hope these links would help you in your research. Before rating this answer, please ask for a clarification if you have a question or if you would need further information. Thanks for visiting us. Regards, Easterangel-ga Google Answers Researcher | |
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Subject:
Re: The concept of Hell in Judaism around AD 30
From: justme22-ga on 05 Sep 2005 11:39 PDT |
The Valley of Hinnom (Gehenna) was outside the walls of Jerusalem. For a time it was the site of idolatrous worship, including child sacrifice. In the first century Gehenna was being used as the incinerator for the filth of Jerusalem. Bodies of dead animals were thrown into the valley to be consumed in the fires, to which sulfur, or brimstone, was added to assist the burning. Also bodies of executed criminals, who were considered undeserving of burial in a memorial tomb, were thrown into Gehenna. Thus, at Matthew 5:29, 30, Jesus spoke of the casting of one?s ?whole body? into Gehenna. If the body fell into the constantly burning fire it was consumed, but if it landed on a ledge of the deep ravine its putrefying flesh became infested with the ever-present worms, or maggots. (Mark 9:47, 48) Living humans were not pitched into Gehenna; so it was not a place of conscious torment. At Matthew 10:28, Jesus warned his hearers to ?be in fear of him that can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.? What does it mean? Notice that there is no mention here of torment in the fires of Gehenna; rather, he says to ?fear him that can destroy in Gehenna.? By referring to the ?soul? separately, Jesus here emphasizes that God can destroy all of a person?s life prospects; thus there is no hope of resurrection for him. So, the references to the ?fiery Gehenna? have the same meaning as ?the lake of fire? of Revelation 21:8, namely, destruction, ?second death.? |
Subject:
Re: The concept of Hell in Judaism around AD 30
From: pugwashjw-ga on 08 Sep 2005 22:56 PDT |
The valley of Hinnom was, as the other commenters say, an outside incinerator for the bodies of dead stock and even executed criminals. The fire was kept going by adding sulphur. The Apostle John, when writing Revelation, used the concept of total annihilation by comparing to it to the Hinnom valley, which the people of the time understood, along with its effects. At Revelation 20;10 the Bible states that the Devil is hurled into the 'lake of fire' together with the 'wild beast' and the 'false prophet'. The Devil is a spiritual being and is unaffected by physical pain as we know it, so 'eternal torment' for the Devil would be to be rendered powerless. For him that would be torture. The 'wild beast' and the 'false prophet' are both organisations, again unaffected by physical pain but very able to be rendered powerless. Revelation 21;4 states that death will be no more, done away with. And 20;14 says that the same death, and its companion, Hades [ Greek for Hell] will ALSO be hurled into the same 'lake of fire'. So you have Satan the Devil, two organisations, and two 'conditions', all in the same place or situation...rendered null and void. Torment does not necessarily equate with experience of pain. Organisations and conditions cannot experience pain. So what is 'Hades'. As a companion of death, it can only be man's grave. No death, no graves. |
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