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Q: The concept of Hell in Judaism around AD 30 ( Answered 4 out of 5 stars,   2 Comments )
Question  
Subject: The concept of Hell in Judaism around AD 30
Category: Relationships and Society > Religion
Asked by: oz1cz-ga
List Price: $50.00
Posted: 05 Sep 2005 01:40 PDT
Expires: 05 Oct 2005 01:40 PDT
Question ID: 564381
Background:

The Old Testament in the Bible tells us that around the 8th century BC
apostate Israelites would sacrifice children to heathen Gods in a
place known as "Hinnom's valley" or "Hinnom's son's valley" (for
example in 2 Chronicles 28:3).

Hinnom's valley is located outside Jerusalem and allegedly later
became a rubbish dump.

However, when Jesus started preaching, he referred to Hinnom's valley
as a place of eternal punishment. The Hebrew words "ge Hinnom"
(Hinnom's valley) became "gehenna" in Greek, and this word is
translated "Hell" in most English bibles.

For instance, Jesus said: "Do not be afraid of those who kill the body
but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy
both soul and body in hell." (Matthew 10:28)

It is interesting to note that Jesus never explains what he means by
"Hell". Apparently, it was obvious to his audience what he meant. It
appears to have been common knowledge back then that eternal
punishment took place in Hinnom's valley, or in a place that was
symbolically referred to as "Hinnom's valley".

So, at some time between the end of the Old Testament (around 400 BC)
and the time when Jesus preached (around AD 30) the Jewish religion
started associating the expression "Hinnom's valley" with a place of
eternal punishment.

Now for my question:

When and how did Judaism associate eternal punishment with Hinnom's valley?
Answer  
Subject: Re: The concept of Hell in Judaism around AD 30
Answered By: easterangel-ga on 05 Sep 2005 03:32 PDT
Rated:4 out of 5 stars
 
Hi! Thanks for a very interesting question.

This is a very interesting question and it seems the consensus is that
even before the Jews were brought in exile, Hinnom?s valley was
already being treated as a symbolism of hell.

It is true that at the outset, this was used in pagan sacrifice
ceremonies such as the burning of children. But as the time of Josiah
came, this valley was then transformed.

?The valley of Hinnom is part of the pleasant wadi or valley, which
bounds Jerusalem on the south. Josh. 15: 8; 18: 6. Here, in ancient
times and under some of the idolatrous kings, the worship of Moloch,
the horrid idol-god of the Ammonites, was practiced. To this idol,
children were offered in sacrifice. II Kings 23: 10; Ezek. 23: 37, 39;
II Chron. 28: 3; Lev. 28: 21; 20: 2. If we may credit the Rabbins, the
head of the idol was like that of an ox; while the rest of the body
resembled that of a man. It was hollow within; and being heated by
fire, children were laid in its arms and were literally roasted alive.
We cannot wonder, then at the severe terms in which the worship of
Moloch is everywhere denounced in the Scriptures. Nor can we wonder
that the place itself should have been called Tophet, i.e.,
abomination, detestation, (from toph, to vomit with loathing)." Jer.
8: 32; 19: 6; II Kings 23: 10; Ezek. 23: 36, 39.?

"After these sacrifices had ceased, the place was desecrated, and made
one of loathing and horror. The pious king Josiah caused it to be
polluted, i.e., he caused to be carried there the filth of the city of
Jerusalem. It would seem that the custom of desecrating this place
thus happily begun, was continued in after ages down to the period
when our Savior was on earth. Perpetual fires were kept up in order to
consume the offal which was deposited there. And as the same offal
would breed worms, (for so all putrefying meat does of course), hence
came the expression, 'Where the worm dieth not, and the fire is not
quenched.' " Stuart's Exegetical Ess., pp. 140-141.
 
?THE BIBLE HELL?
http://www.tentmaker.org/books/TheBibleHell.html


------------------
Eventually, when the Israelites returned from the exile, they followed
the practice adapted by Josiah.

?After their return from the Babylonian, the Jews turned the Hinnom
Valley into the city dump where garbage and anything deemed unclean
(including the bodies of executed criminals) was incinerated. For that
purpose, a fire was kept constantly burning there. Even though it was
no longer used for evil worship, with all the filth and thick smoke it
remained a very dark and dreary place.?

?Valley Of Hell?
http://www.keyway.ca/htm2001/20010215.htm 


------------------ 
So following this idea we can say the following in terms of dates:

Josiah?s reign ? (640-609 b.c.e.)
http://www.oxfordscholarship.com/oso/public/content/religion/0195133242/toc.html 

2 Kings 22:3 says that Josiah got started performing reforms at the
18th year of his reign so this will probably mean that Jews first got
the idea of a picture of hell in Hinnom at around 622 b.c.e.


-------------------
Another theory is that Isaiah may have showed this imagery much
earlier than Josiah?s time. The book of Isaiah is believed to be
written in 740 - 680 B.C.

?Topheth has long been prepared; it has been made ready for the king.
Its fire pit has been made deep and wide, with an abundance of fire
and wood;  the breath of the LORD, like a stream of burning sulfur,
sets it ablaze.
- Isaiah 30:33 (New International Version)


?The place of these abominable sacrifices is also called Tophet,
Isaiah 30:33 Jeremiah 7:31. According to some, this name is derived
from the Hebrew toph, drum, because drums are supposed to have been
used to drown the cries of the victims. But this opinion rests only on
conjecture. King Josiah defiled the place, 2 Kings 23:10, probably by
making it a depository of filth. It has been a common opinion that the
later Jews, in imitation of Josiah, threw into this place all manner
of filth, as well as the carcasses of animals and the dead bodies of
malefactors; and that with reference to either the baleful idolatrous
fires in the worship of Moloch, or to the fires afterwards maintained
there to consume the mass of impurities that might otherwise have
occasioned a pestilence, came the figurative use of the fires of
Gehenna, that is, valley of Hinnom, to denote the eternal fire in
which wicked men and fallen spirits shall be punished. This
supposition, however, rests upon uncertain grounds.?

Croosmap:  Hinnom 
http://dictionary.crossmap.com/definition/hinnom.htm
 
?When was the Bible written and who wrote it??
http://www.carm.org/bible/biblewhen.htm 


Search terms used: 
Hinnom Hinnom?s valley Josiah, Isaiah

I hope these links would help you in your research. Before rating this
answer, please ask for a clarification if you have a question or if
you would need further information.
                 
Thanks for visiting us.                
                 
Regards,                 
Easterangel-ga                 
Google Answers Researcher

Request for Answer Clarification by oz1cz-ga on 05 Sep 2005 04:34 PDT
Thank you for a very clear and useful answer.

Do you know of any Jewish writings from Jesus' time or from the time
between the two testaments that would help me understand what
perceptions Jesus' contemporaries had about Hell/Ge Hinnom?

Clarification of Answer by easterangel-ga on 05 Sep 2005 04:53 PDT
I'm glad you liked the research. 

Sorry I haven't found any ancient jewish writings that coincides with
this. Since this is a new angle to the question, it would be
appropriate in cases like these to post a new question so that another
researcher maybe able to get a crack at it.

Thanks again!
oz1cz-ga rated this answer:4 out of 5 stars

Comments  
Subject: Re: The concept of Hell in Judaism around AD 30
From: justme22-ga on 05 Sep 2005 11:39 PDT
 
The Valley of Hinnom (Gehenna) was outside the walls of Jerusalem. For
a time it was the site of idolatrous worship, including child
sacrifice. In the first century Gehenna was being used as the
incinerator for the filth of Jerusalem. Bodies of dead animals were
thrown into the valley to be consumed in the fires, to which sulfur,
or brimstone, was added to assist the burning. Also bodies of executed
criminals, who were considered undeserving of burial in a memorial
tomb, were thrown into Gehenna. Thus, at Matthew 5:29, 30, Jesus spoke
of the casting of one?s ?whole body? into Gehenna. If the body fell
into the constantly burning fire it was consumed, but if it landed on
a ledge of the deep ravine its putrefying flesh became infested with
the ever-present worms, or maggots. (Mark 9:47, 48) Living humans were
not pitched into Gehenna; so it was not a place of conscious torment.

At Matthew 10:28, Jesus warned his hearers to ?be in fear of him that
can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.? What does it mean? Notice
that there is no mention here of torment in the fires of Gehenna;
rather, he says to ?fear him that can destroy in Gehenna.? By
referring to the ?soul? separately, Jesus here emphasizes that God can
destroy all of a person?s life prospects; thus there is no hope of
resurrection for him. So, the references to the ?fiery Gehenna? have
the same meaning as ?the lake of fire? of Revelation 21:8, namely,
destruction, ?second death.?
Subject: Re: The concept of Hell in Judaism around AD 30
From: pugwashjw-ga on 08 Sep 2005 22:56 PDT
 
The valley of Hinnom was, as the other commenters say, an outside
incinerator for the bodies of dead stock and even executed criminals.
The fire was kept going by adding sulphur. The Apostle John, when
writing Revelation, used the concept of total annihilation by
comparing to it to the Hinnom valley, which the people of the time
understood, along with its effects. At Revelation 20;10 the Bible
states that the Devil is hurled into the 'lake of fire' together with
the 'wild beast' and the 'false prophet'. The Devil is a spiritual
being and is unaffected by physical pain as we know it, so 'eternal
torment' for the Devil would be to be rendered powerless. For him that
would be torture. The 'wild beast' and the 'false prophet' are both
organisations, again unaffected by physical pain but very able to be
rendered powerless. Revelation 21;4 states that death will be no more,
done away with. And 20;14 says that the same death, and its companion,
Hades [ Greek for Hell] will ALSO be hurled into the same 'lake of
fire'. So you have Satan the Devil, two organisations, and two
'conditions', all in the same place or situation...rendered null and
void. Torment does not necessarily equate with experience of pain.
Organisations and conditions cannot experience pain. So what is
'Hades'. As a companion of death, it can only be man's grave. No
death, no graves.

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