Hi, Obama's book is very hard to find in the original hardback
edition.  It was published by Times Books, a division of Random House.
 "First Printings" are being described having the 98765432 number
line, following Random House convention for first printings.  Through
online conversation with another bookseller, I learned that some
booksellers who collect and watch for Obama's book have come to
believe that this is the first printing; they have never seen a 1 in
the number line.
However, my McBride guide does not mention this disparity for Times
Books; also Zempel's guide (4th edition) states Times Books first
printings as marked "First Edition" with subsequent printing marked 2,
3, etc.  Other Random House-owned publishers do not follow this
disparity.
How can I find out definitively if this book did indeed go into a
second printing, and how the first printing is identified?  Thank you.

Hi cdprice20,

Very interesting question!  Here was my first reaction to your question...

1. If the book states "First Edition" but no additional printings
(NAP) are mentioned,  then it is a first printing of the first
edition.

(from my Zempler's, 1988 Statement: "The first edition/first printing
is marked 'First Edition.'" Period)

2. If the book states "First Edition" with 23456789, then it is the
second printing of the first edition.

(from my Zempler's, 1988 Statement: "Subsequent printings are marked 2, 3, etc.")

...supported by two books published by Times Books (ISBN 0-8129...)
which have the number "1" in string.

1. First Edition (stated) / First Printing / Number string 1-10
(published 1989, after the Zempler statement)
http://dogbert.abebooks.com/servlet/BookDetailsPL?bi=70731050

2. First Edition (so stated on copyright page), First Printing (Number
series, "1" present). (published before the Zempler statement)
http://dogbert.abebooks.com/servlet/BookDetailsPL?bi=31025374

I couldn't find a 1995 edition of a Times Books publication 
mentioning "1", but here are some mentioning stated "first printing".

3. FIRST PRINTING of the First Edition (stated) (1995) ISBN: 08129...
http://dogbert.abebooks.com/servlet/BookDetailsPL?bi=203948302

4. Book Description: New York: Times Books : Random House, 1995, New York
FIRST PRINTING of the First Edition (stated). (1995)
http://dogbert.abebooks.com/servlet/BookDetailsPL?bi=255253352

5. stated 1st edition (& 1st printing) (1995)
http://dogbert.abebooks.com/servlet/BookDetailsPL?bi=261656400

And finally, here is your book, "First Edition, First Printing".

6. Did you email this bookseller?  He states, "First Edition, First
Printing" of your book.  Ask him what evidence he has that it is a
first printing. Generally, when stated this way, "First Printing" or
"1" is stated on the copyright page. If he can confirm that for you,
you have your answer.
Bookseller: 86 Books
Contact:    Jeremy Moberg-Sarver
Address:    276 12th St., #3B, Brooklyn, NY, U.S.A., 11215
E-mail:     86books@gmail.com
http://dogbert.abebooks.com/servlet/BookDetailsPL?bi=415866958

Have you tried calling Random House?  I think that would be the next
step to take if 86 Books doesn't pan out. Unfortunately, Henry Holt
seems to have acquired Times Books since your book was published, so
Random House no longer lists Times Books in their contact lists.

Random House Contact Us
http://www.randomhouse.com/about/contact.html

Times Books / Henry Holt
http://www.henryholt.com/timesbooks.htm


Short biography
http://www.dkosopedia.com/index.php?title=Barack_Obama&printable=yes

I was happy to work on this, I hope 86 Books can make the confirmation
for you. If you have any questions, please post a clarification
request and wait for me to respond before closing/rating my answer.

Thank you,
hummer

Search Strategy: along with using my own bookmarks and reference
material, I search for the title, author, and publisher along with the
terms "first edition", "first printing", "number 1" and "number 2".

---

Request for Answer Clarification by cdprice20-ga on 18 Nov 2005 20:52 PST

I think you have a lot of good ideas...unfortunately I have already
pursued them.  I mentioned McBride and Zemplers in the original
question.  The bookseller I mentioned actually was the guy from 86
Books.  He firmly believes that this is a Random House type first
printing with a 98765432 number line, and that no '1's" exist.  I've
already checked out Obama's websites and emailed Random House as well.
 So I think your ideas are great and right on...but already done!
I own 3 of these books, so have a strong interest in finding out if
they are firsts or seconds.  I'm still hoping to find out how get
publishing information for this book.  Any other ideas for that?  Or
if I talked to someone who's seen "Dreams" with a 1 in the number
line, that would sure put it to rest!

---

Clarification of Answer by hummer-ga on 19 Nov 2005 06:41 PST

Hi cdprice20,

It would seem you have covered all of your bases except one. You have
to phone Random House. You could try the number listed on their
website -

Random House, Inc.
Distribution Center
400 Hahn Road
Westminster, MD 21157
(410) 848-1900
(800)726-0600 Customer Service
http://www.randomhouse.com/about/contact.html

However, I would try the number for Random House listed in Bowker's
"Books in Print: Publishers, 1995-96" (where Times Books is still
listed as an imprint) first: 1-800-726-0600. I just tried it and it is
still a good phone number. Make sure you have the book in hand when
you phone. I don't know if anyone is there on Saturday, you may have
to wait until Monday. Let me know how you make out!

Regards,
hummer

---

Request for Answer Clarification by cdprice20-ga on 19 Nov 2005 10:09 PST

Hey hummer, this is not another request...just a thanks for the "book
community" information.  Very interesting sounding groups.
Many thanks.
Carol

---

Clarification of Answer by hummer-ga on 19 Nov 2005 10:35 PST

You're welcome, Carol.  If anything else pops into my brain, I'll let you know. H

---

Clarification of Answer by hummer-ga on 21 Nov 2005 09:05 PST

Hi  Carol, I have some news!  We actually got a response to an email
enquiry that we sent to RH. It would seem my initial instincts were
correct.  They told us that for a first printing of the first edition
of their Times Books imprint, you would need on the copyright page:

First Edition:September 1995
10  9  8  7  6  5  4  3  2  1 
or
First Edition
or 
First Edition, First Printing


If there is a number line, the last number in the number line
indicates the printing. For example, 2468753 is a third printing,
2368754 is a fourth printing, etc.  In other words, if there is a
number line, there has to be a "1" and it has to be in the last
postition to be a first printing.

You could still call RH to confirm that, but their email is pretty convincing.
hummer

This person had several good ideas; one of them is a very promising
lead for me.  Thank you,  hummer.

Thank you for your thank you, cdprice20, I appreciate it.

Here's another thought, if you are interested in joining a "community
of book people". Most book people are more than happy to share their
knowledge, but joining any group sort of implies a willingness to
share (rather than joining for the sole purpose of asking a question).

rec.collecting.books
Group description: Issues related to collecting books of all types.
http://groups.google.com/groups/dir?sel=33611553&expand=1

Bibliophile Mailing List
http://www.bibliophilegroup.com/

Bookfinder Insider
http://lists.bookfinder.com/mailman/listinfo/insider

Here's hoping RH can confirm your first printings.  I commend your
efforts to do your own homework instead of just listening to others.
It can so easily happen that one bookseller posts erroneous
information and then everyone else follows suit.

Good luck!
hummer

Hi Carol,

Still thinking about you and found three interesting postings, nothing
definitive but interesting.

Help with Times Books 1st please 
TimesBooks edition question 
Bertelsmann/Random House [was Re: Bantam paperback number line] 

From the third one:

 >So do all the Random House Imprints mark their first editions with
a number
>line that start with 2?
No, only RH, Villard, and the defunct (I believe) Turtle Bay
imprint.  Nearly all the rest use ordinary 1-10 lines, except the
few (Knopf, for instance) that continue to use the system they used
before they became part of RH. 
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.collecting.books/search?group=rec.collecting.books&q=%22times+books%22&qt_g=1&searchnow=Search+this+group

Regards,
hummer

Thanks again for more information.  So the mystery continues...
I appreciate the further information.  I actually signed up for
Google's book collecting group this morning, after reading what you
sent.  Would love to sign up for the others too, but will stick to one
for now, leaving time for my day job of teaching school and my after
hours passion of collecting and sometimes selling books.
Regards,
Carol