Google Answers Logo
View Question
 
Q: Inside the mind of schizophrenics ( Answered,   6 Comments )
Question  
Subject: Inside the mind of schizophrenics
Category: Reference, Education and News > Homework Help
Asked by: umcp_rush-ga
List Price: $4.50
Posted: 07 Dec 2005 14:48 PST
Expires: 06 Jan 2006 14:48 PST
Question ID: 602840
I'm trying to find a source that states that some schizophrenic
patients of institutions are unaware of their
captivity and live out most of their "reality" inside their minds. 
Could you help me find such a source?

Request for Question Clarification by sublime1-ga on 07 Dec 2005 15:36 PST
What is the basis of this idea? Institutionalized
schizophrenics are typically carefully medicated,
and provided with carefully structured schedules,
the combination of which limits their engagement
with delusions and hallucinations, and allows them
a relatively normal degree of orientation to time,
places, and persons.

The single exception to this would be the unusual
diagnosis of catatonic schizophrenia, which is
characterized by a state of withdrawal and often
immobility, though this is becoming increasingly
rare subsequent to the use of modern medications.

Would a resource for this diagnosis satisfy your
interests?

sublime1-ga

Clarification of Question by umcp_rush-ga on 07 Dec 2005 16:19 PST
The reason I need to find a live source of this instance is because I
am writing a paper for my Philosophy class in which I have to refute
the four forms of skepticism.  One of the theories is that of the
"illusions and hallucinations" theory.  This states that because human
beings are capable of hallucinating objects that do not really exist,
we can never be sure if our entire reality is nothing but a
hallucination.  I originally refuted this point by bringing up the
patient in the movie "Identity" and how when one of his split
personalities was brought from the head of the schizophrenic into our
plane of reality, he did not believe that his entire existence was a
hallucination.  Basically, I need to find evidence that cases such as
this exist where the patient (or the patient's personalities as they
were) is completely unaware of their outter surroundings and entirely
content with living in their world of hallucinations, rather than the
plane of reality that the rest of us exist in.

Request for Question Clarification by sublime1-ga on 07 Dec 2005 18:27 PST
I recently saw Identity. The patient in that movie was
one with a diagnosis of Multiple Personality Disorder,
recently revised to Dissociative Identity Disorder.

A pretty thorough examination of DID, which is the
subject of considerable skepticism, even amongst
psychiatric professionals, despite the official 
recognition of the diagnosis in the DSM IV, the
Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders,
is given on this page at the Skeptic's Dictionary:
http://skepdic.com/mpd.html

Dissociative Identity Disorder has a diagnostic
reference number of 300.14. BehaveNet provides a
capsule description of the diagnostic criteria:
http://www.behavenet.com/capsules/disorders/did.htm

Two of the criteria exclude the kind of total withdrawal
and absorption in unreality which you seem to be looking
for:

"A. The presence of two or more distinct identities or
 personality states (each with its own relatively enduring
 pattern of perceiving, relating to, and thinking about
 the environment and self). 

 B. At least two of these identities or personality states
 recurrently take control of the person's behavior."

In simple terms, this means that 2 or more of the identities
rotate in taking control of the body. When one is in control,
the other identities may or may not be aware of the actions
of the one in control. Quite often, they are completely
unaware of each other. These are not separate entities, as
might be thought of in the cases of alleged possessions,
but are fragments of the person's divided primary consciousness.

Such fragmentation is said to occur as the result of severe
trauma, such as sexual and/or physical abuse in the very young.
At least one of the identities is typically quite functional,
and is oriented to external reality quite well. There may be
more than one that is equally well oriented. The main problem
which occurs is that the primary identity may experience what
amount to blackouts when another identity holds sway in the
conscious realm, and exhibit behaviors that are antithetical
to the other(s).

The scenario presented in the movie is not realistic and does
not accurately portray either schizophrenia or MPD/DID. To my
knowledge, there is no real-life disorder in which a person's
consciousness is submerged into internal fragments with no
connection with external reality. I worked in the field of 
mental health for 25+ years. I don't believe you can refute
the "illusions and hallucinations" theory on the basis of
actual cases.

I think you'd be better off refuting this theory by focusing
on the fact that hallucinations are seldom shared to the 
extent that we seem to share our common experience of what
we call external reality. The argument against this would
be that we have been indoctrinated since childhood to see
and experience the world in the same way as our elders, so
that the shared reality we experience is not so much a
hallucination as tunnel vision amounting to hypnosis, which
blinds us to a narrow bandwidth of the infinite possibilities
of perception which are available to us at birth.

Many philosophers and mystics, such as Gurdjieff, Ouspensky,
and Carlos Castaneda's Don Juan Mateus have asserted that
this is, indeed, the case, and use this to explain the
capacity of some psychics, shamans and seers to access subtle
realities which are every bit as consistent as our own view
of the physical world. Such visionaries consider the average
man to be sleeping, even while they think they're awake.

Let me know where this takes you...

sublime1-ga

Clarification of Question by umcp_rush-ga on 07 Dec 2005 19:15 PST
That's some awesome and very helpful information there.  All I needed
was a source of information and all this help has been really great. 
After reading all of these opinions, I was easily able to finish my
paper.  I will most definitely use Google Answers again in the near
future.

Request for Question Clarification by sublime1-ga on 07 Dec 2005 19:58 PST
umcp_rush...

Unfortunately, only one Researcher (designated by a hyperlinked
username) can post a formal answer and claim a percentage of the
fee you've designated. Neither my colleague cynthia-ga nor I 
have done so as of yet, due to our uncertainty about what you
would find to be truly helpful.

We leave you with the daunting task of picking a winner...  : )

sublime1-ga

Clarification of Question by umcp_rush-ga on 12 Dec 2005 07:14 PST
While cynthia helped a lot, the majority of the information I used
came from sublime.  Rather than using a specific person as an example,
I brought together several generic facts about paranoid schizophrenics
to build my argument using the links sublime gave me.  Therefore, if
there is to be said "winner," I suppose sublime would be them.  Thanks
everyone for your help!
Answer  
Subject: Re: Inside the mind of schizophrenics
Answered By: sublime1-ga on 12 Dec 2005 12:19 PST
 
umcp_rush...

Thanks for confirming my input as your answer. I'll post
it here in the answer box for the sake of future readers.

--------------------------------------------------------

Institutionalized schizophrenics are typically
carefully medicated, and provided with carefully
structured schedules, the combination of which 
limits their engagement with delusions and 
hallucinations, and allows them a relatively 
normal degree of orientation to time, places, 
and persons.

The single exception to this would be the unusual
diagnosis of catatonic schizophrenia, which is
characterized by a state of withdrawal and often
immobility, though this is becoming increasingly
rare subsequent to the use of modern medications.

---

I recently saw Identity. The patient in that movie was
one with a diagnosis of Multiple Personality Disorder,
recently revised to Dissociative Identity Disorder.

A pretty thorough examination of DID, which is the
subject of considerable skepticism, even amongst
psychiatric professionals, despite the official 
recognition of the diagnosis in the DSM IV, the
Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders,
is given on this page at the Skeptic's Dictionary:
http://skepdic.com/mpd.html

Dissociative Identity Disorder has a diagnostic
reference number of 300.14. BehaveNet provides a
capsule description of the diagnostic criteria:
http://www.behavenet.com/capsules/disorders/did.htm

Two of the criteria exclude the kind of total withdrawal
and absorption in unreality which you seem to be looking
for:

"A. The presence of two or more distinct identities or
 personality states (each with its own relatively enduring
 pattern of perceiving, relating to, and thinking about
 the environment and self). 

 B. At least two of these identities or personality states
 recurrently take control of the person's behavior."

In simple terms, this means that 2 or more of the identities
rotate in taking control of the body. When one is in control,
the other identities may or may not be aware of the actions
of the one in control. Quite often, they are completely
unaware of each other. These are not separate entities, as
might be thought of in the cases of alleged possessions,
but are fragments of the person's divided primary consciousness.

Such fragmentation is said to occur as the result of severe
trauma, such as sexual and/or physical abuse in the very young.
At least one of the identities is typically quite functional,
and is oriented to external reality quite well. There may be
more than one that is equally well oriented. The main problem
which occurs is that the primary identity may experience what
amount to blackouts when another identity holds sway in the
conscious realm, and exhibit behaviors that are antithetical
to the other(s).

The scenario presented in the movie is not realistic and does
not accurately portray either schizophrenia or MPD/DID. To my
knowledge, there is no real-life disorder in which a person's
consciousness is submerged into internal fragments with no
connection with external reality. I worked in the field of 
mental health for 25+ years. I don't believe you can refute
the "illusions and hallucinations" theory on the basis of
actual cases.

I think you'd be better off refuting this theory by focusing
on the fact that hallucinations are seldom shared to the 
extent that we seem to share our common experience of what
we call external reality. The argument against this would
be that we have been indoctrinated since childhood to see
and experience the world in the same way as our elders, so
that the shared reality we experience is not so much a
hallucination as tunnel vision amounting to hypnosis, which
blinds us to a narrow bandwidth of the infinite possibilities
of perception which are available to us at birth.

Many philosophers and mystics, such as Gurdjieff, Ouspensky,
and Carlos Castaneda's Don Juan Mateus have asserted that
this is, indeed, the case, and use this to explain the
capacity of some psychics, shamans and seers to access subtle
realities which are every bit as consistent as our own view
of the physical world. Such visionaries consider the average
man to be sleeping, even while they think they're awake.

Best regards...

sublime1-ga


Additional information may be found from an exploration of
the links resulting from the Google searches outlined below.

Searches done, via Google:

"catatonic schizophrenia"
://www.google.com/search?q=%22catatonic+schizophrenia%22

"Dissociative Identity Disorder" 300.14
://www.google.com/search?q=%22Dissociative+Identity+Disorder%22+300.14

"multiple personality disorder"
://www.google.com/search?q=%22multiple+personality+disorder%22

DSM4
://www.google.com/search?q=DSM4
Comments  
Subject: Re: Inside the mind of schizophrenics
From: cynthia-ga on 07 Dec 2005 16:27 PST
 
If you haven't seen it yet, now would be an excellent time for you to
rent the astounding film:

A Beautiful Mind
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0268978/
The story of Nobel Prize winner (and schizophrenic) John Nash.
Subject: Re: Inside the mind of schizophrenics
From: umcp_rush-ga on 07 Dec 2005 17:06 PST
 
I have seen it -- phenomenal movie...  A case such as that may work
for my paper as well...
Subject: Re: Inside the mind of schizophrenics
From: cynthia-ga on 07 Dec 2005 18:08 PST
 
THis sees to back up sublime's hypothesis:

..."For example, many chronically ill [institutionalized]
schizophrenic patients, when properly medicated, can be given grounds
privileges and weekend passes, and taken on trips outside the
hospital; whereas without medication they are too acutely disturbed to
do any of these things." (pp. 66-67) ..."

Meaning, these patients are institutionalized because they need to be
in a controlled enviornment to remain symptom-free...

John Nash, as I understand it, has continued to refuse medication
because it affects the quality of his life, makes him unable to be
intimate with his wife, and he can't think well while on
anti-psychotics. (no surprise there) He decided that to have any kind
of good life, his logical mind would have to be stronger than the
desire to believe those events and people he had earlier determined to
be hallucinations.

What an incredible man. I think John Nash is indeed an excellent
choice for your paper because if you remember, he was
institutionalized when he was finally confronted with the proof of his
delusions. Can you imagine the strength of his mind --to live with
delusions and simply with the power of his mind, refuse to acknowledge
them?  Wow.

I think any other examples would have to be taken from history, before
there were effective drugs.
Subject: Re: Inside the mind of schizophrenics
From: cynthia-ga on 07 Dec 2005 18:09 PST
 
Whoops, the link:
http://www.mentalhealth.com/book/p40-sc03.html
Subject: Re: Inside the mind of schizophrenics
From: cynthia-ga on 07 Dec 2005 18:30 PST
 
Found these:

Disorientation in Chronic Psychiatric Patients (2nd from the bottom)
The Incidence of Delirium in Psychiatric Inpatient Units (3rd from the bottom)
http://www.cpa-apc.org/Publications/Archives/CJP/1997/Oct/engabstr.htm

Recent Findings in Schizophrenia
http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/443974

You can get more results with this search string:

"institutionalized schizophrenics" chronic OR chronically incidence
hallucinations OR delusions
://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=+%22institutionalized+schizophrenics%22+chronic+OR+chronically+incidence+hallucinations+OR+delusions&btnG=Search
Subject: Re: Inside the mind of schizophrenics
From: hummiz-ga on 12 Dec 2005 04:00 PST
 
hey,

take a look at that,it should help ya :)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizophrenia

good luck

Important Disclaimer: Answers and comments provided on Google Answers are general information, and are not intended to substitute for informed professional medical, psychiatric, psychological, tax, legal, investment, accounting, or other professional advice. Google does not endorse, and expressly disclaims liability for any product, manufacturer, distributor, service or service provider mentioned or any opinion expressed in answers or comments. Please read carefully the Google Answers Terms of Service.

If you feel that you have found inappropriate content, please let us know by emailing us at answers-support@google.com with the question ID listed above. Thank you.
Search Google Answers for
Google Answers  


Google Home - Answers FAQ - Terms of Service - Privacy Policy