hello child,

my question is about sitcoms.  I can only think of two really 
well-drawn characters in a sitcom -- Rev. Jim Ignatowski on "Taxi" and
Dietrich on "Barney Miller."  Kramer on "Seinfeld" maybe a distant 
third.  I know this is a subjective question but can you think of any
others and why is there a dearth of memorable characters on sitcoms? 
is it the script or the actor's interpretation that's lacking?  feel
free to be creative with this one.  links are okay too though.

bonus question:  off the top of your head, what's a fair price to
charge a struggling writer per page to read and edit a script ...
nothing technical -- just straight copy.

ever curious,
GB

Dear Granny Bing,

I certainly agree that Reverend Jim and Dietrich are well-drawn sitcom
characters, but in my view they are only two of a pantheon (if we may
deify fictional characters) of richly textured characters who have
graced the Idiot Box. Here are my suggestions of five other characters
who seem to me just as well-drawn as your exemplars:

1. Homer Simpson, of "The Simpsons." Although this loveable boob is a
2-D animated 'toon, his personality comes through in 3-D. Homer is one
of the reasons "The Simpsons"  stays watchable year after year. He is
everyone's favorite nitwit neighbor, everyone's remembered dummy dad,
and his buffoonery is often weighted by a genuine pathos. I give
credit both to the writing and to the incredible vocal performance of
Dan Castellanetta. You can't really separate Homer's lines from
Castellanetta's voice. Try to imagine anyone else saying "Mmmmm...
floor pie" or the immortal "D'oh!"

2. Alice Kramden, of "The Honeymooners." I know many sitcom buffs
would pick Ralph instead. To those sitcom buffs I say "You want a trip
to the moon?" Alice's personality is quite vivid, even in the
oversized shadow of Ralphie Boy. Those of us who love this show are
deeply touched by Alice's odd, longsuffering patience in her marriage
to one of the great blowhards of all time. For a character like Alice
to be memorable, considering the subordinate position of her role and
the scarcity of her punchlines, is quiet a coup. (Note that I am
referring to Alice as performed by Audrey Meadows. As far as I am
concerned, Audrey owns that tacky little apartment for eternity;
Sheila MacRae doesn't live here any more.)

3. Lou Grant, of "The Mary Tyler Moore Show." If it weren't for Ed
Asner's quirky charm, Lou Grant would have come across as a villain
and a bully (especially in the show's early seasons.) As the writers
warmed up to Lou's comic possibilities, Lou became more and more
human, and his flaws (stubbornness, irascibility, the tendency to
belittle the weak) became endearing. When Lou got his own show, the
character went into the dumper without even jumping the shark. The
very first episode of the "Lou Grant" show made it clear that Lou was
IMPORTANT. And, of course, that meant that now he wasn't funny.

4. Miss Piggy, of "The Muppet Show." Yes, I know she is full of
herself, but what do you expect of someone who has upholstery rather
than skin? I honestly think that Piggy is one of the most deftly drawn
characters in all of comedy. "The Muppet Show" was, in some ways, a
set of mini-sitcoms that recurred each week, and the interaction
between the lovestruck Miss Piggy and the amphibian of her dreams
could have become very trite (these interspecies romances never seem
to work out.) The multi-layered Piggy managed to combine sultriness,
ebullience, arrogance, loyalty, and general pigheadedness into one
plump package. By comparison, Kermit the frog is a mere stick figure.

5. Marshall Teller, of "Eerie, Indiana." As played by young Omri Katz,
Marshall is that rare being, a truly nonconformist teenager. This show
(which almost nobody saw) was one of the wildest, funniest things to
hit television since Ernie Kovacs took his last ride in a Corvair. The
glue that held all the wackiness together was Marshall, who managed to
be morose and cheery at the same time, and whose oddball qualities
seemed ordinary in the setting of a town which Marshall describes in
this way: "In Eerie, Indiana, when you scrape away the surface
weirdness, what you find is... more weirdness."

I would have liked to add Tony Soprano to this list, except that most
folks would not consider "The Sopranos" to be a sitcom. Dunno about
that; the show contains so much dark humor that classifying it is
tough. I think it's a comedy of sorts, in the same way that the
looney, looney, looney "Twin Peaks" was a comedy. Maybe I'm just bent.

The only reason I can think of to explain why there are so few good
characters in TV sitcoms is that audiences seem to have become more
interested in event-driven plots than in character-driven plots. This
is certainly true in many of today's movies. For several decades we
have had a plenitude of car crash shoot-em-up action movies, and a
paucity of movies that are actually about people. Apparently most
folks don't want people in their entertainments, preferring to watch
pratfalls, explosions, and nude scenes that show everything except a
raw personality.

In case you would like to browse online sites that deal with American
television programs, here are links to two of my favorites:

Yesterdayland
http://yesterdayland.com/

Television Without Pity
http://www.televisionwithoutpity.com/

Regarding your bonus question on copyediting a writer's script, I
asked a friend who has done this on occasion, and she said she
wouldn't ever do it again for any amount of money. That is not a very
good answer, but it may serve as a caution.

My colleague journalist-ga is a professional writer and editor whose
word I would accept on virtually anything. It is my hope that she will
post a comment on this matter that may be of assistance to you.

Thanks for requesting my input here, Granny. Being able to blather and
be compensated for it is one of the great blessings of researcherdom.
Everyone should be so lucky.

Live long and prosper.
pinkfreud

---

Request for Answer Clarification by badabing-ga on 17 Sep 2002 13:55 PDT

such a lovely answer and comments.  someone has tied up granny and set
fire to her hair.  will be back when the flames die down, kids. 
thanks for all your time and serious input.  granny needs to drop and
roll now....later.

---

Clarification of Answer by pinkfreud-ga on 17 Sep 2002 15:09 PDT

Granny,

Please drop back by Google Answers once your hairdo has stopped
smouldering. Thank you for enabling me to expound upon one of my
favorite subjects, lowbrow entertainment. ;-)

~pinkfreud

---

Clarification of Answer by pinkfreud-ga on 06 Oct 2002 16:16 PDT

Many thanx for the five stars, Gran. I sprinkled 'em on my evening
bowl of Lucky Charms, which made this sugary treat even more Magically
Delicious than usual.

As one who eats breakfast at any hour of the day or night, I am quite
a cereal killer: I was thinking about dumping some "Sweet Simplicity"
hare remover on the Trix rabbit, but that's another depila story...

~pinkfreud

thought I forgot about ya?....nevah!  granny's no longer fully
engulfed so she can now pay you just desserts on this superbly written
and gustified essay.  you wax poetically on sitcoms like a west coast
promo-woman!  I'm afraid granny is clueless on some of these folks
you've mentioned and those in the gratitudinous comment section. 
granny better refrain from making sweeping wiskbroom statements when
she's obviously not done the 360-dial sitcom circuit.  as you might
guess from my moniker, I'm a *huge* Tony Soprano fan because the
series is so well stocked with malapromistic metaphors. it always
knocks me outta my rocker.  thanks again for offering some of your
fa-bu insight on comedy.  maybe there should be a "Pink Freud Show." 
I'd watch.  you're quite the cut-up, kiddo.  absolutely bang up job. 
viva Mrs. Pynchon and Corvairs!

May I add that sometimes there are actors, whose mere persence
upgrades the series in several levels. The best example is Fyvush
Finkel, (IMDB: <http://us.imdb.com/Name?Finkel,+Fyvush>) who done low
and high sitcoms (as well as drama), but is always what's you're
looking for in a comedian. Also Wallace Shawn, but he doesn't really
does TV.

So maybe the answer is in actor. 

Other candidates: 
Bender the Robot 
Newman the Postman (which reminds me of the next category)
The 3rd Rock from the Sun cast, mainly Dick (John Lithgow) and Harry
(French Stewart) (A small remark: what does it say about me if my
favourite comedians are French Stewart and Wallace Shawn? I am
apparently not over that 2-year-old-child stage where you like funny
voices).

Your loving granddaughter

To pink's most excellent list, I'd also add these as well-drawn (if
often verging on parody) characters...

Stephanie Vanderkellen (Julia Duffy) of Newhart, a self-involved
heiress who was a maid at Bob's inn.

Steve Urkel (Jaleel White) of Family Matters. The nerd as hero.

Nearly any character (except Sondra :-)) from Cosby.

Personally, I think there's a dearth of memorable sitcom characters
because there's currently a dearth of memorable sitcoms.  The current
pendulum swing is at the far range of dramatic series.  It will swing
back -- as it always does.

I can't help but comment on your question of reading/editing a script,
as script editing is something I've done in my somewhat checkered
career. Straight reading and spelling/grammar editing market rates run
in the $35-50 an hour range, say around $750-1,000 (pax to all who say
they could get it for you higher/lower. I'm just giving my opinion)
for a typical 90 to 120 page screenplay script. "Coaching" or ghosting
editing would run significantly higher.  Not a solicitation, by the
way. :-) If you're looking for someone to do that sort of work, I'd
recommend checking out agencies in your area, or eLance.

regards,

rico

Regarding the editing, a fair price would be $1.00 to $2.00 per page
for general content text editing.  On a side note, aren't most of us
writers struggling?  ;)

thanks, folks, for your comments on sitcoms and editing!

grandottir:  *love* Wallace Shawn!  yeah, I agree that writers can
wrap their lines around a particular actor's quirks.  seems to be a
50-50 proposition.

rico:  I agree that is in the neighborhood of what a decent editor is
*worth*; I'd just feel creepy charging that much.  thanks for your
input.  I've taken a pass on the project since I had too much on my
plate.  it was a cute premise but needed lots of rewrite and with
writers being a fairly touchy group, it  could get ugly.

journalist:  thanks for your comment.  that was my ballpark estimate
also {$3/page}.  appreciate the confirm and muchas gracias!

strugglin'
grannyb

I've always been a little partial towards Mr. Bentley (The Jeffersons).