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Q: How do protestant churches determine who is a "saint"? ( No Answer,   9 Comments )
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Subject: How do protestant churches determine who is a "saint"?
Category: Relationships and Society > Religion
Asked by: goldenboy5230-ga
List Price: $15.00
Posted: 05 Apr 2006 08:09 PDT
Expires: 28 Apr 2006 08:10 PDT
Question ID: 715709
If sainthood is something that is conferred by the Catholic Church
through the beatification process, how do other churches determine who
is a saint?  There are many non-Catholic churches named after one
saint or another.  It occurs to me that sainthoods conferred before
the various protestant splits from the Church may be carried through. 
Is that the answer?  Do any protestant churches or denominations
articulate who they consider to be saints?  Or is it simply a less
formal status than with the Catholic church?

Request for Question Clarification by tutuzdad-ga on 05 Apr 2006 08:22 PDT
Does this answer your question?

"Due to historical ties with the Catholic Church, some Protestant
churches may include some recognition of Saints in their doctrines. In
general usage, saint simply refers to someone who is widely considered
to be exceptionally virtuous, and may be applied equally to both the
living and the dead. In this secular use, the term "saint" may be
acceptable to use in non-Christian religious contexts. A "saint" is
thus one who is held up by the community as a good example, where the
story of their life is typically related for the purpose of inspiring
others."
WIKIPEDIA
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint

"Most Protestant churches, born out of the reformation, do not have
Saints today. Only the Anglicans and the Lutherans maintain feast days
for Saints. The Puritans rejected the idea that Saints, because they
had special grace, could intervene in people's lives. American
Unitarians and Universalists grew out of this tradition of Puritan New
England."
CAN A UNITARIAN UNIVERSALIST BE A SAINT?
http://www.cedarlane.org/98serms/s981101.html

Please let me know.

tutuzdad-ga

Request for Question Clarification by byrd-ga on 05 Apr 2006 10:11 PDT
Hi goldenboy5230-ga,

Actually there is no real concensus among Protestant denominations on
exactly what is (or is not) a saint, but each rather follows its own
teachings in that regard, although as you surmised, it is generally a
less formal matter in Protestantism than in the Roman Catholic Church.
Here are links to a few resources touching on this:

Presbyterian
http://www.opc.org/old/cce/QandA/144.html

Lutheran
http://www.orlutheran.com/html/saintlc.html

Methodist
http://www.unicorne.org/ORTHODOXY/articles/alex_roman/methodists.htm

Is this the type of information you're looking for? If not, what other
type of resouce would you like to see? If so, how many more Protestant
denominations would you want to see information for, and which ones?
Of your list, how many would answer your question if all are not
availble?

Thank you for your clarification.

Byrd-ga

Clarification of Question by goldenboy5230-ga on 12 Apr 2006 12:40 PDT
In response to the requests for clarification, I guess what I am
asking is to know what various protestant denominations say about
saints.  To pick a few, I will go with Episcopal, Methodist, Lutheran,
Presbyterian, and for good measure, one of the following: Southern
Baptist or Church of Christ.  I would prefer it coming from within the
organization itself rather than what someone else says about them, but
if that is all that is avialable, I will settle for that.

Also, in response to myorain, there are many examples of non-Anglican
churches named after saints.  With a quick search I found about 15
different saints who have Methodist churches named after them.

Clarification of Question by goldenboy5230-ga on 19 Apr 2006 12:14 PDT
I think $15 is ample for the question as clarified.  If no one picks
this up soon, I will just cancel it.
Answer  
There is no answer at this time.

Comments  
Subject: Re: How do protestant churches determine who is a "saint"?
From: techtor-ga on 05 Apr 2006 08:14 PDT
 
From what I know, the system of beatification of a saint, making that
person a patron of later believers, is used in the Catholic Church
only, and maybe other similar churches. I believe in modern
evangelical church doctrine, anyone who has received Christ and the
Holy Spirit and is living under this Spirit is a saint. I attend such
a church. They don't venerate special people to consider "saints,"
although notable people in the church are publicized and remembered.
Subject: Re: How do protestant churches determine who is a "saint"?
From: myoarin-ga on 05 Apr 2006 13:24 PDT
 
"There are many non-Catholic churches named after one saint or another."

I expect that most of these are Anglican (or Episcoplian) churches,
and that in America you will find that almost all of these are only
named after one of the Evangelists, Mary or Joseph, or one of the
Apostles  - a fairly understandable selection.
There may, of course, be several other names used:  Francis, Jude,
Anthony, Catherine and other well known martyrs.  Perhaps these names
were chosen in recollection of a church of the same name in Europe,
from whence the the founders of the parish came.
In England and on the Continent during the Reformation, many existing
Catholic churches named after other saints were converted to the
Lutheran or Anglican faith and continued with their existing names. 
In the 16th century, the break with the Roman Catholic church did not
repudiate all the Church's teachings and beliefs, including calendar
of saints, so there was no perceived need to change the names.
Remember, Henry VIII broke with the pope for political and personal
reasons; Luther wanted the reform the Catholic Church originally.
Subject: Re: How do protestant churches determine who is a "saint"?
From: amber00-ga on 05 Apr 2006 16:08 PDT
 
The Church of England has no formal canonisation process but can add
new names to the calendar of saints. For example, Josephine Butler was
added about 15 years ago. (G@@gle on her for more information.)

And the Oxford Book of Saints mentions that there are five English
churches decicated to King Charles I: presumably because of his
martyrdom. He has never been formally canonised.  I somehow doubt that
 the future King Charles II will be considered as living a life of
heroic virtue.
Subject: Re: How do protestant churches determine who is a "saint"?
From: pugwashjw65-ga on 08 Apr 2006 08:14 PDT
 
Making " Saints" out of good people is a man made idea and has no
basis in Bible scripture. The word or even the Hebrew equivalent, does
not occur in the Bible. Along with " Trinity". Just because a lot has
been written about the subject, does not make it 'right' in God's
eyes. Matthew 7; 21-23 "21 ?Not everyone saying to me, ?Lord, Lord,?
will enter into the kingdom of the heavens, but the one doing the will
of my Father who is in the heavens will. 22 Many will say to me in
that day, ?Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expel
demons in your name, and perform many powerful works in your name?? 23
And yet then I will confess to them: I never knew YOU! Get away from
me, YOU workers of lawlessness".
Subject: Re: How do protestant churches determine who is a "saint"?
From: tutuzdad-ga on 08 Apr 2006 08:29 PDT
 
pugwashjw65-ga said: "Making " Saints" out of good people is a man
made idea and has no basis in Bible scripture. The word or even the
Hebrew equivalent, does not occur in the Bible."

I don't what version of the Bible you use, but in mine the word
"saint" or "saints" appears more that 100 times. Here are a few that I
know of right off hand but in The Book of Psalms alone the reference
is made dozens of times:

Psalm 16:3
Psalm 106:16
Daniel 8:13
Philemon 4:21
Deu 33:2
Deu 33:3
1 Samuel 2:9 
2 Chronicles 6:41
Job 5:1
Job 15:15

tutuzdad-ga
Subject: Re: How do protestant churches determine who is a "saint"?
From: tutuzdad-ga on 08 Apr 2006 08:33 PDT
 
Ok, I counted them and in Psalms the word appears exactly 20 times -
not "dozens", but certainly a lot more than "none".
Subject: Re: How do protestant churches determine who is a "saint"?
From: myoarin-ga on 08 Apr 2006 17:39 PDT
 
I wonder what the Hebrew word in the Psalms is, and if it has anything
like the connotations the word "saint" has for Catholics?
Subject: Re: How do protestant churches determine who is a "saint"?
From: pugwashjw65-ga on 09 Apr 2006 18:31 PDT
 
Tutuz. It seems its all in the translation. When I said that the word
' Saint' does not appear, that particular word doesn't. The original
word is " Ha-gi'os" which in the New world translation ios rendered '
holy one' or 'holy ones'. Variations are ' ha-gi'on', ha-gi'os',
ha-gi'ous', 'ha-gi'ois'. Obviously all mean the same, singular or
plural. I hope this helps Myoarin.
Subject: Re: How do protestant churches determine who is a "saint"?
From: myoarin-ga on 09 Apr 2006 19:00 PDT
 
Yes, thanks, Pugwash.   
The word "Saint" is, of course, related to sanctify, make or made
holy, so as a translation it is appropriate.  One can have his own
opinion about the Catholic church's identifying persons as such.
Myoarin

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