Ok, im asking this question just because I need an unbiased opinion on
something.  My girl and I fight a lot and much of the time it's
a misunderstanding or miscommunication.  Regardless of our problems,
and regardless of hurt feelings (I care about her, so im not
dismissing her feelings, just trying to get an opinion unrelated to
emotion)

If I said "go to hell"

she heard that as literally "drop dead" or "i wish you were dead" or
"i wish you harm physically"

Does her interpretation seem reasonable?  Ok, im a guy...  just
looking for an opinion maybe from some women.  I know it was mean... 
I know it wasn't nice...

Why would I ask this question?  Well, we fight about semantics like
this all of the time.  Take for granted, please, that its not
important what the cause/result of our fight is, I just want an
opinion as to if it makes any sense whatsoever to understand "go to
hell" literally as "drop dead" (like "i wish you were dead").  BTW,
we're both from the US if that makes a cultural difference.

---

Clarification of Question by koopered-ga on 20 Jun 2006 15:27 PDT

lol!  ok, semantics....  if one were to look at history, there are so
many references to "hell on earth"...  of course we can list a zillion
oppressions(religiously, politically, etc) and many works focus on
this "living through hell".

So, when i say "go to hell", can i not be saying "stay here"?

or even better, "stay here because i want to buy you something pretty"?

Hi koopered,

Thank you for accepting my comment as your official answer! Your
understanding my comment is the first step to leading an emotionally
healthy relationship with your girlfriend.

Here it is again in the answer box:

======================================================================

I understand your question, and the spirit in which you are wanting an explanation.

In your example, I believe her interpretation is reasonable, and here's why.

I was raised in a very "Beaver Cleaver-ish" household. My Dad and Mom
never argued, dinner was on the table at 6pm every night. They never
argued that I was *aware* of, but I'm certain there were
disagreements, I just never saw them. My point is, I am much like your
girlfriend. I never saw disrespect between my parents. There was never
a mean word spoken, let alone a "Go To Hell." If I heard my Dad say
that to my Mom, I would have thought the world was coming to an end. I
had no EXPOSURE to dysfunctional disagreements.

Later, I married a man that upon the day of the marriage, he thought
he could say anything to me he wanted, and upon my utter dismay as to
how a husband could TALK LIKE THAT TO SOMEONE HE LOVED, I was amazed
he would try to tell me:

1) I didn't mean it, it was only in anger.
2) You're taking *it* too literally.
3) You're blowing it out of proportion.
4) People only say mean things to people they love.
5) They're just words, I didn't hit you.
5) Other similiar "reasons" for his hurtful words.

This type of communication and interaction is UNACCEPTABLE to me
because I was not raised that way, I was not "desensitized" to hearing
disrespectful and derogatory comments between my parents as a child.

If you think telling your girlfriend (as in your example, I am not
judging you) to "Go To Hell" is okay to say in ANY circumstance, you
are wrong. I would suspect that somewhere in your early life, you had
been exposed to this type of dysfunctional interaction, learned it
because you had no emotionally healthy example, you had no other model
to learn from, and don't really think it's all that bad, after all,
it's just words, right?

WRONG. It's wrong, Wrong, WRONG.

Just because you don't mean it --in the way she receives it, does not
make it OK. Your explanations don't help because you are missing the
major point.

Quit arguing semantics and learn to communicate without being hurtful. 

Sorry if this came out wrong, --try to understand the message, it's important.

======================================================================

In addition to that, I did find a short 3 page report on emotional
abuse --what it is, how to recognize it, and how it impacts the
victim/recipient.

I'm not trying to say YOU are abusive, just that your example, if left
unchecked, will escalate from "go to hell" to "drop dead" to "I wish
you were dead" --etc.

Your girlfriend is trying to set boundries, telling you that her
hearing "go to hell" is verbally hurtful, and asking you to stop. You
in turn, have ignored her plea to stop and confused the issue with a
number of reasons why the phrase "go to hell" should not bother her.

If you continue, she will become desensitized to THAT PHRASE, --and to
get the same satisfaction (to your frustration), you'd naturally
escalate to something stronger in order for "the dance" to continue.

Read the 3 pages below, and ignore the things that seem too harsh for
your current behavior, but take note of the similiarities to my take
on your situation:

THE IMPACT OF DOMESTIC VIOLENCE ON EMOTIONAL WELL BEING
by Nancy Marshall, M.S., M.F.T.
http://www.celebratingfamilies.net/PDF/DomesticViolenceInfo.pdf
3 pages that describe and validate the premise of my comment/answer.

I urge you to show this question/answer to your girlfriend. Use it as
a starting point to discuss this in a new and open way. Ask her to
give you other examples of things that you say that give her the same
frustrated feeling... She will love you taking the steps to understand
why your behavior is hurtful to the relationship. When she does
explain, --LISTEN!!!  It's EVRY IMPORTANT to not attempt to defend
your actions, you need to find out what you are saying to her that is
hurtful, without trying to make them OK, remember, it's NOT OK.

Your first instinct will be to resume the dance and defend yourself at
each new disclosure from her. The important thing here is to recognize
the dance for what it is. Recognize the feeling to defend, --THAT's
the problem!

Talk about how you are feeling, make the new problem recognizing the
dysfunctional dance and learning to choose a new behavior!

Good luck koopered, and God Bless you for caring.

And to koopered's girlfriend:  Hon, be patient with him, but hold your
ground! No one deserves to be told to go to hell, or anything hurtful,
disrespectful or abusive, (and told why it should be "ok") --and now
he knows and acknowledges understanding.

~~Cynthia

---

Clarification of Answer by cynthia-ga on 21 Jun 2006 14:32 PDT

I found one more page that validates my premise:

Especially this section, although there are many relevant passages"
http://www.rickross.com/reference/abusive/abusive15.html
..."They might explain their behavior by saying, "I was just trying to
express myself; I was just blowing off steam; I was trying to motivate
people; or I was raised in a family where people talked that way all
the time,..."

Again, good luck! An update would be great, I'd love to hear how it
turns out with you talking to your girlfriend about what you learned.

Cynthia, you're a gem....   do you want to go on a date?  (GEEZ, just
kidding!!!!  Im going to show this answer to my girlfriend afterall)

Hello koopered-ga,

I'm sure you hold your girlfriend in high esteem and your telling her
to "go to hell" is meant with kindest regard. But, in light of your
pursuit of intellectual enlightenment about the semantics of the
expression, here are some resources to help you understand her
feelings.

~ czh ~

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=go+to+hell
go to hell

http://www.randomhouse.com/wotd/index.pperl?date=19960629
The expression to hell meaning 'to ruin or destruction; to an
unfortunate state of affairs' is found since the early nineteenth
century.

http://www.counterpunch.org/wise11082003.html
You see, when a person says "Go to hell," as I just did, we all
recognize it as a personal attack, a slur of sorts, an ad hominem
invective that is wholly inappropriate to rational discourse. It is
not a comment that invites discussion or debate, rather it shuts down
both. It is a period at the end of the sentence, not a comma or colon
leading to something more prosaic.

Thanks czh, that actually confused me more :)  really, it was very
interesting, thanks!

Well, maybe to be a bit more generic...  in the normal course of
life....  I guess im looking more for personal opinions if it were
said to any of you....

If I said "go to hell"...  other than be offended, would anyone think
the intention of the remark was "drop dead" ---  literally be dead? 
and then expect a response from her "Your wish is my command....  I am
dead to you!" and then drop off the face of the earth?

Im sure I will talk to her again...  we fight all of the time...  We
care about each other...  but I know we are going to argue this point
until i wish I were dead!  :)  (just kidding)

Thanks again :)

Well, you can't go to hell if you are alive, can you?

Well, in order to "go to hell" one would have to be dead, in the
physical sense at least.  So if she is taking your statement
literally, then yes you are telling her that you want her dead.

Nelson and I had a "brain meld" there at almost the same time.

lol!  ok, semantics....  if one were to look at history, there are so
many references to "hell on earth"...  of course we can list a zillion
oppressions(religiously, politically, etc) and many works focus on
this "living through hell".

So, when i say "go to hell", can i not be saying "stay here"?

or even better, "stay here because i want to buy you something pretty"?

koopered,

I understand your question, and the spirit in which you are wanting an explanation.

In your example, I believe her interpretation is reasonable, and here's why.

I was raised in a very "Beaver Cleaver-ish" household. My Dad and Mom
never argued, dinner was on the table at 6pm every night. They never
argued that I was *aware* of, but I'm certain there were
disagreements, I just never saw them. My point is, I am much like your
girlfriend. I never saw disrespect between my parents. There was never
a mean word spoken, let alone a "Go To Hell." If I heard my Dad say
that to my Mom, I would have thought the world was coming to an end. I
had no EXPOSURE to dysfunctional disagreements.

Later, I married a man that upon the day of the marriage, he thought
he could say anything to me he wanted, and upon my utter dismay as to
how a husband could TALK LIKE THAT TO SOMEONE HE LOVED, I was amazed
he would try to tell me:

1) I didn't mean it, it was only in anger.
2) You're taking *it* too literally.
3) You're blowing it out of proportion.
4) People only say mean things to people they love.
5) They're just words, I didn't hit you.
5) Other similiar "reasons" for his hurtful words.

This type of communication and interaction is UNACCEPTABLE to me
because I was not raised that way, I was not "desensitized" to hearing
disrespectful and derogatory comments between my parents as a child.

If you think telling your girlfriend (as in your example, I am not
judging you) to "Go To Hell" is okay to say in ANY circumstance, you
are wrong. I would suspect that somewhere in your early life, you had
been exposed to this type of dysfunctional interaction, learned it
because you had no emotionally healthy example, you had no other model
to learn from, and don't really think it's all that bad, after all,
it's just words, right?

WRONG. It's wrong, Wrong, WRONG.

Just because you don't mean it --in the way she receives it, does not
make it OK. Your explanations don't help because you are missing the
major point.

Quit arguing semantics and learn to communicate without being hurtful. 

Sorry if this came out wrong, --try to understand the message, it's important.

~~Cynthia

Take it from an older married guy:
If you tell her:  "Go to hell!" you ARE dismissing her feelings  - and
cutting off the discussion, dismissing her point of view, admitting
that you have no reply to what she has just said, "Bang!" slamming the
door.

"Drop dead!" may be a little stronger, but it doesn't make much difference.
And no, "go to hell" cannot mean "stay here."  You didn't say that,
rather just the opposite.  You can't reinterpret words to mean what
you like or excuse your choice of words by claiming that you meant
something else.

If you two "often fight about semantics like this," one or both of you
is/are not saying what you mean (or maybe you are, but regretting it).
 I don't think it is so much a fight about semantics but rather about
how you two communicate.  Blaming it on semantics is dishonest; the
language is not at fault.

Three frequent problems in close personal communication are
generalizations  ("You always ... , never ..."); questions in the form
of statements ("You didn't put out the garbage, did you?);  mind
reading ("I know what you're thinking," or "You think so-and-so.").
They all beg for immediate refutation, simply because no one likes to
be spoken to that way, regardless of whether the statement is right or
wrong, and with the second example (garbage), even stating the fact
that you already did take it out requires negating the other's
question.

If any of this rings a bell, it's not a question of semantics but of
poor communication habits (and can easily escalate to "go to hell").

But bad habits can be broken:  
don't generalize, keep to the immediate subject;
ask simple direct questions that don't infer what you think the answer will be;
don't tell someone else what they think.

Sorry, I got a little carried away and probably revealed more about
myself than provided something pertinent to your question,
but maybe not.  You asked for an opinion.

Good luck.

OMG, i really screwed up :(  well, thanks for the advice...  i love
her very much and would never want to wish anything bad on her,
regardless of how frustrated i am...  i just thought that she was
being a bit unreasonable by taking it so literally.  I guess im a bit
stubborn and forgot the important part of the whole conversation... 
that i hurt her feelings.

Anyway, thanks guys...  I really appreciated the advice of cynthia and
myoarin especially, so if either of you post it as an answer, i'll
give you your props...  sorry it cant be split :(

Greetings Koopered,
Glad you found my comment helpful.  Only G-A Researchers with blue
names can "answer" questions, so the prize is all Cynthia's.  :)

And, if I may say so, it's worth more than $2, just from the
investment of time to formulate her excellent comment.

(Now if I could just stop my wife from saying:  "You never do what I ask",  
even though it is usually true.  ;-)

Good luck!  Myoarin

Myoarin, tell your wife that if you have ever just once done one thing
she asked, her statement is false.

Thanks, Nelson.  My closing remark was only half serious, an attempt
to show understanding and maybe take the sting out of some of my
previous comment that could have seemed too "in-your-face".
Myo

Shoot, while you're at it, next time you fight with her, use my
personal favorite, "F* off and die!"