Hello Ssmall_beutiful,
Factory costs of future FCVs would likely be 40-60% higher than
conventional vehicles but lower than battery EVs.
See page 32: Comparison vehicle costs for 11 different types of vehicles
(Also check out page 34 for Vehicle Ownership Costs)
http://www1.eere.energy.gov/hydrogenandfuelcells/pdfs/fuel_choice_fcvs.pdf
---------------------------------------------
See figure 2 page 6 for manufacturing costs.
http://www.efcf.com/reports/E19.pdf
?Though it is extremely difficult to project cost of future
technologies in mass-production, a number of careful studies suggest
(Figure 2) that, while the additional cost for advanced ICE and
ICE-hybrid technologies may be incremental(adding less than 10% in
high-volume production), the additional cost of H2FCVscould add about
$5,000 (or about 40%) to the cost of the vehicle. While there is
considerable uncertainty about the cost of H2FCVs (given that current
technology doesn?t yet provide all necessary functionality) the
detailed cost studies quoted here have relatively optimistic
assumptions about fuel cell performance (essentially assuming that
currently demonstrated peak performance can be sustained for the life
of the vehicle without cost or functionality compromises), leaving
little hope for significantly lower cost absent additional technology
breakthroughs.?
---------------------------------------------
"Mass produced, a fuel cell power system would cost about the same as
today's internal combustion engine."
http://www.iags.org/strategy.htm
---------------------------------------------
?The manufacturing cost of PolyFuel hydrocarbon membranes is already
significantly less than that of perfluorinated membranes, and will go
even lower with volume. Currently, it takes about $5000 worth of
perfluorinated membrane to make a single fuel cell for a 100 kilowatt
(134 horsepower) vehicle. Because the PolyFuel hydrocarbon membrane
has fundamental cost advantages over perfluorinated membranes,
critical automotive cost targets can be realized much sooner than
previously expected.?
http://www.polyfuel.com/pressroom/press_pr_100504.html
---------------------------------------------
"Typical FCV ownership cost would be $1,000 to $2,000 per year higher
than that of conventional ICEVs because of the high initial vehicle
cost."
"Typical mid-size FCV costs are projected to be around $1,200 to
$1,800 more than that of conventional vehicles."
http://www.emcwa.org/images/fuelcell.pdf
---------------------------------------------
I hope the information provided is helpful!
Best regards,
Bobbie7 |
Request for Answer Clarification by
small_beutiful-ga
on
28 Jun 2006 13:36 PDT
Excellent work Bobbie,
Before I rate this question, could you please explain what exactly
does the 'ownership cost' mean here?
Typical FCV ownership cost would be
$1,000 to $2,000 per year higher than
that of conventional ICEVs because of
the high initial vehicle cost.
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Clarification of Answer by
bobbie7-ga
on
28 Jun 2006 13:47 PDT
Vehicle Ownership Costs include fuel, maintenance and insurance.
Ownership costs also include state fees and taxes, finance charges,
and repair bills.
http://www.intellichoice.com/carBuying101/cost_of_ownership
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Request for Answer Clarification by
small_beutiful-ga
on
28 Jun 2006 14:07 PDT
Thanks for your quick response Bobbie but I was looking for
manufacturing costs rather than ownership costs. The first two
documents give the anticipated factory costs with no reference to how
much does the manufacturing cost today!
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Clarification of Answer by
bobbie7-ga
on
28 Jun 2006 14:35 PDT
There are two separate tables.
One table shows factory costs and the second table shows ownership costs.
The table with factory costs is on page 32 and the table with
ownership costs is on page 34.
Factory costs appear to be manufacturing costs.
Ownership costs are forfuel, maitenace and insurance and repair.
Factory costs of future FCVs would likely be 40-60% higher than
conventional vehicles but lower than battery EVs.
See page 32: Comparison vehicle costs for 11 different types of vehicles
http://www1.eere.energy.gov/hydrogenandfuelcells/pdfs/fuel_choice_fcvs.pdf
|
Request for Answer Clarification by
small_beutiful-ga
on
28 Jun 2006 14:39 PDT
Hello Bobbie,
Yeah I noticed that before. But these costs are forcasts for the
future. Is it possible to find estimates for the current 'factory
costs' ?
|
Clarification of Answer by
bobbie7-ga
on
28 Jun 2006 14:58 PDT
I'll see if there is anything more current available.
Thank you for your patience.
Bobbie7
|
Request for Answer Clarification by
small_beutiful-ga
on
28 Jun 2006 15:16 PDT
Thanks for trying Bobbie,
Here is one that examines the costs of typical gasoline cars but gives
no 'factory cost' for fuel cell cars.
http://repositories.cdlib.org/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1001&context=itsdavis
I would appreciate it if you put here anything you find even if it is
future forecasts
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Clarification of Answer by
bobbie7-ga
on
28 Jun 2006 15:31 PDT
NO problem, I will continue to search.
|
Clarification of Answer by
bobbie7-ga
on
28 Jun 2006 16:03 PDT
?Fuel-cell engine costs and performance. Phosphoric-acid, carbonate,
and alkaline fuel cells, all of which are an order of magnitude easier
to produce than PEMFCs, are available at prices under $3500/kW, but
they are far too massive for use in automobiles [7]. The only type of
hy-drogen fuel cell being pursued for automotive applications is the
PEMFC, also called PEFC (polymer electrolyte fuel cell). The cost of
PEMFC vehicle engines (fuel cells, power condition-ing, electric
motors, etc.) is often reported to be in the range of $3,000-8,000 per
kilowatt (100 times that of the common diesel engine), but available
data suggest otherwise.
Inspection of the sales and financial data over the past two years
from the largest current producer of PEMFCs for non-mobile use (Plug
Power) suggests costs of 5 kW PEMFC-based AC power sources (not
including R&D) are actually in the range of $15,000-$30,000/kW [28].
Larger PEMFCs with 30-35% HHV (higher heating value) electrical
efficiency may be available in the range of $3000-5500/kW for combined
heat and power (CHP) applications [7], but these FCs have inadequate
environmental and vibrational tolerance for vehicles, in addition to
being much too large and massive. (UTC secured DOE funding by
proposing to make CHP PEMFCs available for $1500/kW. They apparently
delivered some 75 kW demo units, partially subsidized by EPRI, for
$2600/kW, that are getting 31% efficiency [7].)
Over the past ten years, Ballard Power has probably furnished nearly
80% of all vehicle fuel-cell engines world wide. By some methods, one
could conclude that the manufacturing cost, not including true R&D, of
their latest fuel-cell engines (which still don't work reliably over
an ac-ceptable range of climates) has been over $1M each [29, 30].
Honda estimates the cost of their fuel-cell car will be $100K in mass
production, which is expected to begin in 2012; and Toyota is
projecting they?ll be selling an FCV for $50,000 in 2015. Similar cost
projections in the fuel-cell industry for the past decade have proven
overly optimistic by factors of 3 to 8. It is noteworthy that fuel
cells, including polymer types, have been in use and development for
over forty years, and costs have not yet begun to drop significantly ?
notwithstanding many assertions to the con-trary that use artificial
costs from heavily subsidized projects or cite costs of massive,
stationary fuel cells that are unsuitable for vehicles.?
(?)
?Ford is currently estimating the production cost of their 1600 kg
Focus FCV (with an 85 kW FC stack) will be about $350,000 each in
quantities of 30 units per year [44].?
http://www.dotynmr.com/PDF/Doty_FutureFuels.pdf
(Also check out figure 4 on page 5; Carbon tax is shown for 2002,
2008, 2015, 2025 and 2040)
I will continue to search.
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Clarification of Answer by
bobbie7-ga
on
28 Jun 2006 16:35 PDT
Cost of a fuel cell prototype remains high (~$3,000/kW), but the high
volume1production cost of today?s technology has been reduced to
$225/kW
?? Fuel cell vehicles will be affordable by the time they reach the marketplace.
? Hydrogen opponents look at the price of today?s hand-built
prototypes and today?s stationary power generation systems and leap to
the conclusion that fuel cell vehicles will not be cost-competitive.
They ignore that prototypes and first-generation systems are almost
always very expensive compared with mass produced units. Just like
gasoline powered cars, personal computers, digital cameras, and many
other innovative products, the price will come down.
? Costs have come down dramatically. The Department of Energy, based
on current best technology, projects cost of a fuel cell vehicle
engine at $225 per kilowatt in mass production. Industry?s ultimate
goal is $30 to $50.
? General Motors says it can achieve a competitive cost by 2010 and it
is investing hundreds of millions of dollars in the technology. They
would not be doing this if they did not expect to earn a profit.
? The California Air Resources Board sees mass production volumes by 2014.?
http://www.fuelcells.org/info/library/QuestionsandAnswers062404.pdf
An interesting article
http://www.fuelcelltoday.com/FuelCellToday/FCTFiles/FCTArticleFiles/Article_925_Issue_3.pdf
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Clarification of Answer by
bobbie7-ga
on
28 Jun 2006 17:08 PDT
Page 8
Estimation of costs and future trends
http://www.lbst.de/publications/studies__d/2004/LBST-study-IPTS_2004_21090-ExeSumm.pdf
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