According to Dennis Wheatley's autobio 'The Time Has Come ...
1919-1977 Drink and Ink', he met a woman at a pre-WWII party whom he
described as a 'little black haired Baroness'.
She was nicknamed 'The Black Baroness' and became the inspiration for
his 1940 novel 'The Black Baroness'.
My prime suspect (based on her known associates) is named in an MI5
file as Baroness Poncratz (but the actual spelling may have been
different).
I have already Gurgled Poncratz and Ponkratz ...
Now is the time for time for the Black Baroness to be unmasked ...
Who will have the honour?
Many thanks!
Bryan |
Clarification of Question by
probonopublico-ga
on
19 Sep 2006 11:48 PDT
Many thanks for looking ... Whoever you are!
A good friend has now advised me ...
It could be Pongratz (with "g") or Pongrácz (accent aigu on the "a").
Both these families are mentioned in the "Deutsches Adelslexikon".
And now is also the time for one of the times to be deleted. (Oops!)
Bryan
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Request for Question Clarification by
answerfinder-ga
on
20 Sep 2006 02:56 PDT
Bryan,
I tried this one last night without success, but your additional
information has now resulted in two possible suspects.
The first in one or two snippets from the Times. There seems to be
pre-war British connection with a Hungarian family by the name of
Pongracz / Pongrácz. I tried to cross check it with Deutsches
Adelslexikon, but my knowledge of German can be written on the back of
a very, very, small postage stamp.
The second is in the States and was married three times, and made an
attempt at suicide.
Perhaps some of this information may fit in with what you already have.
Did you have any clues re nationality? Have you the names of her known
associates? Does Wheatley say anymore about her? This may help in
further searches.
First the British Pongrácz.
This is a reference to a Baroness Hildegard Pongracz.
The Times, January 20, 1937
?J.H.J. Brooks and Baroness Hildegard Pongracz
The marriage between John Henry James only son of Mr Ernest J. P.
Brooks of Cygnent House, King?s Road, S.W.3., and Mrs Carboys
Walcott, 19, Washington House, Basil Street, S.W.3., and Baroness
Hildegard Pongracz, elder daughter of Herr Arthur and Frau Oesterheld,
Boma, Germany, will take place tomorrow in Budapest.?
This was possibly Brook?s second marriage. A person with exactly the
same name married in 1929.
The Times, April 25, 1929
No further mention until 1946. I do not know if this is the same person.
The Times, July 16, 1946
Court circular.
?Baroness Pongracz gave a farewell reception yesterday for Senhor
Paschoal Carlos Magno (of the Brazilian Embassy) who is returning to
Brazil.?
Going back in time, there are other references to the Pongrácz name.
Count von Pongraz was best man at a wedding in at Biddenden
The Times, July 09, 1938
Announcement of a marriage in Budapest.
The Times, August 04, 1939
Pongrácz : Gill
On July 29, 1939 at S. Christina?s Church, Budapest, Count Ferencz
Pongrácz, de St. Miklós et Ovár, Hungary to Bettine Mary Gill
They had a child in Budapest in 1941 and after the war Bettine re-married.
Obituary notice. Not known if this is connected.
The Times, December 12, 1939
Pongrácz. On Nov 23 1939, in Budapest, Count János Pongrácz, of Szent
Miklós and Ovár, only son of the late Count Edward Pongrácz, of Szent
Miklós and Ovár, and beloved husband of Muriel Pongrácz (nee Eyre).
Finally, there is one later reference to Countess Pongracz who
attended a funeral and later her jewellery was sold at Christies.
The Times, December 10, 1948
Funeral attendees
Countess Pongracz
There is one reference to her in the National Archives.
Covering dates: 1947
Scope and content:Application for naturalization by Countess Muriel Pongracz
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/search/quick_search.aspx?search_text=FO+372%2F5096&SearchButton.x=19&SearchButton.y=14
Now to the States Pongrácz.
A number of newspaper articles on the attempted suicide of Baroness
Irene Pongrácz. You will have to buy these articles to see if there is
more to the article ( I don?t know if my fellow researchers are
already subscribers). One appears to have a picture of the baroness
(Lowell Sun - 9 March). Note that the British connection to Cyril
Tolley is denied in one article.
I could not find her death in the Social Security death index
Lowell Sun, The
Tuesday, March 08, 1938
?Baroness Is Poison Victim
LOS ANGELES, March 8 Writhing in pain on an emergency hospital cot,
the Baroness Irene Pongracz, wife of a former Hollywood actor, was
treated today for the effects of self-administered poison, according
to police. Detectives who investigated said she Is the former wife of
Cyril Tolley, British golfer, and also of a Leo Palmer of Chicago. The
Baron PONGRACZ is in Budapest, Police said she has been working as a
dress model in a shop.?
http://www.newspaperarchive.com/LandingItems/GLP/LP9.aspx?search=pongracz&img=9cbxNIiVHYuKID/6NLMW2si99jeiyqdga/ScAz938QjgnPLBNzcajw==&site=google&fileType=jpg
Lowell Sun, The
Wednesday, March 09, 1938
?Recovering from Poison?
A woman identified by police as Baroness Irene PONGRACZ, wife of a
Hollywood actor, and a Leo Palmer of Chicago, is shown in an emergency
hospital at Los Angeles where she was recovering from the effects of
..?
http://www.newspaperarchive.com/LandingItems/GLP/LP9.aspx?search=pongracz&img=9cbxNIiVHYuKID/6NLMW2jS+wMVuVwCVZ82jEA890pahJGJLaX81Lw==&site=google&fileType=jpg
Daily Courier, The
Tuesday, March 08, 1938
?Baroness Attempts Suicide. LOS ANGELES, Mar.
Irene PONGRACZ, 45, thrice-married dress model and divorced wife of
Cyril Tolley, British Golf star, today attempted suicide by poison in
her hotel-room, police reported.?
http://www.newspaperarchive.com/LandingItems/GLP/LP9.aspx?search=pongracz&img=QHMdF73tEsiKID/6NLMW2vQXKGEfZNEfqQFTlQm0RGd+LZWbGVXpWg==&site=google&fileType=jpg
Evening State Journal
Tuesday, March 08, 1938
BARONESS TRIES POISON LOS ANGELES.
?Barones Irene PONGRACZ, 45, dress mode attempted suicide by poison in
he hotel room. Police said she was the divorced wife of Cyril Tolley
American amateur golf player an no relation to the British Cyril
Tolley.?
http://www.newspaperarchive.com/LandingItems/GLP/LP9.aspx?search=pongracz&img=j91JOupTOn+KID/6NLMW2u3fbCj8moHslqT/WzmBsRVmGAQtAe1oFA==&site=google&fileType=jpg
Another possible name which I tried is Pongraczde.
Any more information would be of great help!
answerfinder-ga
PS Did you see this news article?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2006/09/20/nphone20.xml
May be useful in tracing people. Trouble is, you need to pay for it.
|
Clarification of Question by
probonopublico-ga
on
20 Sep 2006 03:18 PDT
Hi Answerfinder
Well done!
As usual, you have exceeded my expectations.
You have rounded up a great list of suspects and I do like the
Hungarian and Brazilian angles.
Wheatley was very discreet and changed the names of the suspected spies.
I will now check things out and get back to you.
Incidentally, the reference to "Deutsches Adelslexikon" should have
been just "Adelslexikon". I have some German-speaking friends who can
do the necessary, if necessary.
All the Best
Bryan
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Clarification of Question by
probonopublico-ga
on
20 Sep 2006 07:52 PDT
Here's some more info and, at first glance, all the current suspects
are exonerated.
I have an MI5 report (May 1941?) which says that she is Hungarian and
is being kept (in London) by a man called Brock who is the brother of
'the firework king'. Being very wealthy, Brock would kick up a fuss if
she were interrogated.
Her first name probably begins with 'J'.
Will do some more digging later.
I guess that Baronesses were 10 a penny in pre-war Hungary.
Bryan
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Request for Question Clarification by
answerfinder-ga
on
20 Sep 2006 08:48 PDT
Still no luck. In 1932 the Times reported that Arthur Brock owned C.T.
Brock and Co., and had 5 sons. Two may have been Roland Benjamin Brock
and Christopher Dewdney Brock. There was also an Alan St Hill Brock
who in 1949 wrote a book on the history of fireworks. It appears he
organised many displays at Crystal Palace in the 30s. I am unable to
state if he was a son of Arthur or a brother.
Still doesn?t get me any nearer to the ?Black Baroness?.
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Clarification of Question by
probonopublico-ga
on
20 Sep 2006 09:33 PDT
Hi Again Answerfinder
I am worried that you have put in a stack of work without any luck so far.
I would like you to dig further (if you are up for it) but you have
already earned your $10 and more.
How to proceed?
I can up the price to reflect further effort on the understanding
that, even if you don't produce all that I require, I would happily
settle for an answer based on the work you've done.
C'mon live up to your name ...
And give me an answer to this question within a question.
All the Best
Bryan
I really do appreciate what you've done so far and I will not let it go unrewarded.
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Request for Question Clarification by
answerfinder-ga
on
21 Sep 2006 00:48 PDT
Bryan,
You have been a good customer for many years now and I am perfectly
happy to carry on researching this question. I know that you will `do
the ?right thing?. At the same time, you know from previous experience
that I don?t like to post an answer unless I actually have an answer
to post. Let me do some more digging and see what I come up with.
Freddy?s comments are also very helpful.
I have looked at ancestry.co.uk, and the recently released telephone
directories have a listing for Baroness C. Pongracz between the years
of 1948 - 1954, and 1959 - 1981. One directory has the name as
Baroness C. oh. D. Pongracz, and another one has Baroness G. Pongracz.
Would you like me to purchase copies of these entries to try and get
an address (costs Ł4.95)?
answerfinder-ga
|
Clarification of Question by
probonopublico-ga
on
21 Sep 2006 01:17 PDT
Hi Answerfinder
You are such a nice guy ... Many thanks!
However, as regards the telephone directories quoted, these are really
well outside the frame of reference, so I doubt if they will be very
helpful.
Maybe a search of the 1939/1940 era would be more productive. BT used
to have these available at their Research Unit in Holburn but I
suspect that this may have closed.
In the meantime, I've been ploughing through the MI5 files but, as you
would expect, the most interesting ones have been 'weeded'.
How do I know? Because there are references in The Minutes (a kind of
Index) but the actual docs have disappeared.
Still some way to go though!
All the Best
Bryan
|
Request for Question Clarification by
answerfinder-ga
on
21 Sep 2006 04:43 PDT
Bryan,
The search did include the 1939/1940 period and there was no entry for
Baroness. There was only an entry for A. Pongracz for 1939 and 1941.
I think I've exhausted everything. I'll wait to see if your review of
the files produces anything.
asnwerfinder-ga
|
Clarification of Question by
probonopublico-ga
on
21 Sep 2006 06:54 PDT
Hi A/F
I am about half-way through the stuff and I don't expect to finish
them today or tomorrow (when I'm out all day).
However, I am very hopeful so please don't go on holiday again, just yet.
Many thanks
Bryan
|
Clarification of Question by
probonopublico-ga
on
21 Sep 2006 07:25 PDT
I have now discovered a reference to Baroness Toddy Pongraft.
The baroness's surname appears in several different spellings, probably all wrong.
Bryan
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Request for Question Clarification by
answerfinder-ga
on
21 Sep 2006 08:11 PDT
Nothing on Toddy Pongraft. Looks to be a very bad spelling. The other
variations may be useful. They may appear as that in the Times, etc.
Earlier I made reference to Countess Pongracz. I've tied her
approximate d.o.b. to 1913 - in case that comes up.
answerfinder-ga
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Request for Question Clarification by
answerfinder-ga
on
21 Sep 2006 09:37 PDT
On further source I had forgotten: London Gazette.
Never know if these may come up at some time.
London Gazette 19 April 1921
ALIENS RESTRICTION ACT, 1919 S. 10 (2).
LIST OF FORMER ALIEN ENEMIES LANDED FROM
MARCH IST TO 31sT, 1921.
Pongracz, Muriel F. M.
London Gazette 22 March 1949
NATURALISATION.
LIST of ALIENS to whom Certificates of Naturalisation have 'been
granted by the Secretary of State, and whose Oaths of Allegiance have
been registered in the Home Office during the month of February, 1949.
The date shown in each case is the date on which the Oath of
Allegiance was taken.
Pongracz, Gertrude; Hungary; Independent;
14. Sussex Lodge,. Sussex Place, London, W.2.
8 February, 1949.
answerfinder-ga
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Clarification of Question by
probonopublico-ga
on
21 Sep 2006 10:52 PDT
Hi Again, A/F ...
Many thanks for the new info.
I've now found references to Tody and to Toddi Pongracz.
Also, on one occasion, the Baroness was accompanied by Jose Cochran de
Alencar of the Brazilian Embassy.
There is never any mention of the Baron and she seemed to like playing around.
Well, that's all for today.
I'm off to Kew tomorrow where I'll check with some of my mates to see
if they can suggest anything.
All the Best
Bryan
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Request for Question Clarification by
answerfinder-ga
on
21 Sep 2006 11:57 PDT
That may link in with the Brazilian reference further above.
Alencar was second secretary at the embassy in 1930, in charge of
commercial matters in 1942, and by 1961 was the Ambassador.
Hope you have a productive day.
answerfinder-ga
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Request for Question Clarification by
answerfinder-ga
on
21 Sep 2006 12:10 PDT
Final one for tonight.
Register of deaths.
Name: Gertrude Pongracz
Birth Date: 16 Jul 1898
Death Registration Month/Year: Jan 1997
Age at death (estimated): 98
Registration District: Kensington And Chelsea
Inferred County: London
Register Number: A54A Entry number: 67
Name: Elisabeth Pongracz
Birth Date: 15 Jul 1912
Death Registration Month/Year: Dec 1998
Age at death (estimated): 86
Registration District: Surrey Northern
Inferred County: Surrey
Register Number: NSD5 Entry number: 230
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Clarification of Question by
probonopublico-ga
on
21 Sep 2006 22:29 PDT
Wow!
This is amazing: a terrific example of one amazing Researcher and one
amazing Commenter (fp-ga) working together to ferret out an amazing
Answer.
I had wondered what Toddy could be short for but it's obvious, after
Freddy has pointed it out. Previously, I had only heard of Trudy.
I am now sure that Gertrude is The Black Baroness.
Please Answerfinder, Find me an Answer forthwith because I have yet
another related question that I want to throw at you ... and, with the
next one, we may have to enlist the help of Boquinha-ga ... but, at
this stage, NO CLUES!
All the Best
Bryan
|
Clarification of Question by
probonopublico-ga
on
22 Sep 2006 00:12 PDT
In a further search of the MI5 files, I've just found two addresses in
a book maintained by one of Toddy's associates:
Baroness Pongracz
19 Albion Street
REGENT 0761
(Crossed out)
30 Sussex Lodge
Sussex Gardens
Now, I'm off or I will miss my train.
Bryan
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Request for Question Clarification by
answerfinder-ga
on
22 Sep 2006 02:34 PDT
Bryan,
It?s looking good and we may be almost there, but there may be still a
little fly in the ointment. It may be useful to summarise what you
have so far.
The address of 30 Sussex Lodge, Sussex Gardens, appears in the London
Gazette entry referred above for list of aliens naturalised.
Pongracz, Gertrude; Hungary; Independent; 14. Sussex Lodge,. Sussex
Place, London, W.2. 8 February, 1949.
http://www.gazettes-online.co.uk/archiveViewFrameSetup.asp?webType=0&PageDuplicate=x0%20%20%20%20%20%20&issueNumber=38568&pageNumber=0&SearchFor=pongracz%20gertrude&selMedalType=&selHonourType=
And as indicated above, there is a death certificate available for a
Gertrude Pongracz who may be identical.
Name: Gertrude Pongracz
Birth Date: 16 Jul 1898
Death Registration Month/Year: Jan 1997
Age at death (estimated): 98
Registration District: Kensington And Chelsea
Inferred County: London
Register Number: A54A Entry number: 67
http://www.ancestry.co.uk/
Freddy has provided some useful information on Gertrud Gisella (Toddy)
and the connection with the day and date of birth. It is interesting
to note that the death registered above shows the age as estimated.
I decided to purchase images of the London phone book to confirm the
address. These are the results.
1949 and 1956 shows the following entry:
Pongracz Baroness C. CH. D., 14 Sussex lodge W.2. PADdngtn 8161
The same name appears in the Paddington area up to 1981.
The 1969 entry is interesting as it shows two person by that surname.
Pongracz Baroness C, ChD, 14 Sussex Ldg W2 01 723 8161
Pongracz Countess Elizabeth, 10/2 Strathearn Pl W2 01 723 0440
The Elizabeth Pongracz may be the same as the death certificate
referred to further above, but I will repeat again here.
Name: Elisabeth Pongracz
Birth Date: 15 Jul 1912
Death Registration Month/Year: Dec 1998
Age at death (estimated): 86
Registration District: Surrey Northern
Inferred County: Surrey
Register Number: NSD5 Entry number: 230
http://www.ancestry.co.uk/
The fly in the ointment is the listing for the Baroness is shown as
initial C. and then the intials CH. D. I do not know what these mean
or represent. Why C? should it not be G? Is there another Baroness
with the name C***?
I don?t know if Freddy has any ideas, seeing as he cracked the Toddy,
Trudy, Gertrude link.
Of course, we then have the Brazilian connections as additional evidence.
The telephone book images are available to you on this link for the
next 7 days. Let me know when you have them.
http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=download&ufid=212C0AD8388A8F87
http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=download&ufid=CBDF4882041C36D2
http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=download&ufid=4AE323916E547567
answerfinder-ga
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Clarification of Question by
probonopublico-ga
on
22 Sep 2006 11:20 PDT
Hi Answerfinder
It is a puzzlement!
I've downloaded the telephone directories. Many thanks. What's the damage?
Freddy has now found an expert on the Pongracz family ... Maybe he can
throw some light on this?
Over to you, please, Freddy.
Signing off for now ...
Bryan
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Request for Question Clarification by
answerfinder-ga
on
23 Sep 2006 01:10 PDT
Bryan,
It turned out to be only Ł1.50 for the lot.
I think I've exhausted every possible internet source now. Looks like
back to the physical archives.
answerfinder-ga
|
Clarification of Question by
probonopublico-ga
on
23 Sep 2006 02:30 PDT
Hi Answerfinder
Thanks for the outlay And your time - I will sort these out one way or another.
So far, I haven't found anything else that's relevant.
I'm now pinning my hopes on Freddy ...
Freddy?
All the Best
Bryan
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