cross of st joan - used as a symbol for the french resistance in
WWII...
looking for information and pictures ( there is a scene from the movie
Casablanca that has a resistance member who flashes the inside of his
ring which has the cross... double arm, etc)

Hi n3kgg:

Are you sure that the cross you saw isn't the "Lorraine Cross" instead
of the "Cross of St. Joan"?

The French Resistance Medal
http://users.skynet.be/hendrik/eng/F-Campaign.html

If so, a brief history of this cross can be found at 

What is The Lorraine-cross? 
http://www.lunge.dk/eng-Lorraine.htm

Please let me know if this is what you are looking for and I'll post
it as an answer. Otherwise, please provide further details.

Thanks. 

websearcher-ga

---

Clarification of Answer by websearcher-ga on 24 Oct 2002 18:53 PDT

Oops. Just noticed that I posted what was supposed to be my Request
for Clarification as an Answer. My mistake - my apologies.

Let me know if what I've found isn't sufficient for you and I'll
provide clarifications.

websearcher-ga

Search Strategy: 

symbol "french resistance" wwii
://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=ISO-8859-1&safe=off&q=symbol+%22french+resistance%22+wwii

"french resistance" wwii cross
://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=ISO-8859-1&safe=off&q=%22french+resistance%22+wwii+cross

"Lorraine Cross" history
://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=ISO-8859-1&safe=off&q=%22Lorraine+Cross%22+history

---

Request for Answer Clarification by n3kgg-ga on 25 Oct 2002 05:31 PDT

Dear websearcher-ga,

thank you for the quick answer... I think the Lorraine Cross is
probably the appropriate name. I have however, already found the site
you suggested...
I guess what I'm looking for is more, in depth..? Also, the symbol
they list on that site is a somewhat bare-bones version of what I'm
looking for (it's the symbol that was used for lung cancer or
tuberculosis I think).. the version that I'm looking for I have only
seen one  other time, it's a more ornate version... w/ the ends of the
double arms having a more roman catholic look to them (like 3 leaf
clovers - best way I can describe it!)
So, if there might be any other sites that cover this and have photos,
that would be fantastic. If not or this is pushing the limits of my
5.00, I apologize and thank you very much for your help!!!

D

---

Clarification of Answer by websearcher-ga on 25 Oct 2002 07:59 PDT

Hi n3kgg:

I've done some more searching and come up with the following sites
that detail the history (or contain appropriate images) of this
interesting cross.

The Cross of Lorraine: Emblem of the Royal Secret
URL: http://www.dagobertsrevenge.com/index.html?articles/crosslorraine
Quote: "When various members of the House of Anjou plotted to topple
the Valois dynasty of France, the symbol of the conspirators was the
Cross of Lorraine, the heraldic emblem of René d'Anjou, said by
Charles Peguy to represent the "arms of Christ", "the arms of Satan",
and, strangely, the blood of both."
Picture: Some "club-like" ornation

The Team Ring: Magnum PI Cross of Lorraine
URL: http://www.artist2.com/mpi.html
Quote: "This project began with a customer who approached me with the
idea of duplicating a ring he had seen in the 1980's television
series, Magnum, P.I."
Pictures: Many images with the "club-like" ornation you are looking
for.

Rosamond du Cross of Lorraine 
URL: http://www.geocities.com/prosemont/Rosamond-Cross-Lorraine.html
Quote: "Jeanne 'd Arc was clutching the Cross of Lorraine when she was
tried as a witch. Scholars now believe the House of Lorraine was
behind her vision, as they were behind all the major players -
including her brother, Jean de Rougemont?"
Pictures: None

Charles du Gaulle
http://www.charles-de-gaulle.org/en/books_art/fiches_t/croixdelorraine.htm
Quote: "Often referred to as the cross of Anjou or cross of
Anjou-Lorraine, it was one of the emblems used by the Dukes of Anjou
who became Dukes of Lorraine from 1473 onwards [René II (1451-1508),
son of Yolande of Anjou]."
Pictures: None

I hope this additional information helps!

websearcher-ga


Search Strategy:

"Lorraine Cross" OR "cross of Lorraine"
://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=ISO-8859-1&safe=off&q=%22Lorraine+Cross%22+OR+%22cross+of+Lorraine%22

Fantastic! This was the additional info I was looking for on this
topic.
I had found a few more tid bits on my own but these additional
listings you came up w/ perfect. Thanks again for your help!

Hi n3kgg!

I'm very glad I was able to help. Thanks so much for the generous tip
- it is my first one. (This tipping is a brand new feature.) :-)

websearcher-ga

As a researcher who has translated many of the documents associated
with Joan of Arc's history, I would like to comment - especially
regarding the following link that was suggested, which is bafflingly
erroneous on almost every point (full quote from websearcher's
suggestion, below):
"Rosamond du Cross of Lorraine  
URL: http://www.geocities.com/prosemont/Rosamond-Cross-Lorraine.html 
Quote: "Jeanne 'd Arc was clutching the Cross of Lorraine when she was
tried as a witch. Scholars now believe the House of Lorraine was
behind her vision, as they were behind all the major players -
including her brother, Jean de Rougemont?" "

 First of all, Joan was not "clutching the cross of Lorraine" when she
died: an English soldier made a cross out of a "baston" (commander's
staff of authority or "baton"), and one of the clergy brought her a
crucifix from the nearby church.
Secondly, she did not have a brother named "Jean de Rougemont". Her
three brothers were named Jacquemin, Jean, and Pierre, the latter two
taking the surname "du Lys" or "d'Arc du Lys" after the family's
ennoblement by Charles VII on December 29, 1429.
Thirdly, the site's claims about the Anjou family's alleged
involvement (which, the author gravely informs us, has been accepted
by "scholars") is fictional, and I know of no reputable "scholar" who
supports it. The conspiracy theory promoted by the  site is
essentially the historical equivalent of a National Enquirer article,
not a legitimate theory.
The only known involvement of the Anjou family was the brief presence
of René d'Anjou in Joan's army after the coronation of Charles VII (he
was merely one of countless numbers of nobles in that army, and served
in it more briefly than many of the others). Additionally, there is no
record of Joan ever having used a Lorraine Cross at any point.

http://archive.joan-of-arc.org