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Q: BABY WAR BONDS ( Answered 5 out of 5 stars,   2 Comments )
Question  
Subject: BABY WAR BONDS
Category: Miscellaneous
Asked by: honestlibra-ga
List Price: $100.00
Posted: 10 Jan 2004 09:46 PST
Expires: 09 Feb 2004 09:46 PST
Question ID: 295052
How many baby war bonds were issued by the govt to military people
during ww1?  How many were not cashed in? My father's war bonds were
never cashed in and were lost after his death so i would like to get
them.

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 11 Jan 2004 07:27 PST
I'm not at all clear what you mean by "baby war bonds".  Can you
describe these in a bit more detail?  A link to a website that
discusses these type of bonds would be helpful as well, and would
enable researchers to better focus on how to best answer your
question.

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 11 Jan 2004 07:50 PST
There are services, such as this one here:

http://www.savingsbonds.com/salespagelb.cfm

that can walk customers through the process for identifying/recovering
lost savings bonds.

This particular firm charges $9.95 for their service.  I have no
familiarity with them, and cannot vouch for their capabilities or
integrity.  Proceed with caution!

Clarification of Question by honestlibra-ga on 11 Jan 2004 12:16 PST
ok, i will try to help you....my father was in the military in 1916
and 1917 during ww1.  The govt didnt have money to pay the soldiers so
they were paid with war bonds....my father lost his bonds and never
cashed them. I would like to know how to go about locating these
bonds.

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 11 Jan 2004 12:46 PST
One more question, if I may.  For what country did your father serve?  The U.S.?

Clarification of Question by honestlibra-ga on 11 Jan 2004 13:18 PST
yes, i am sorry! he served in the U.S. military.  I was told the bonds
were called baby war bonds but i am not sure even about that. they
could have been called something else...

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 11 Jan 2004 13:46 PST
Thanks again for the additional information.

I've done a bit of research on your question, and I have to confess my confusion.  

I've never heard of a situation where the US government ran out of
cash during WWI and had to pay it's soldiers in some form of
alternative currency like bonds.  Nor can I find any reference to this
in WWI histories.

War bonds were issued by the government for sale to the population in
order to raise funds to suport the war effort.

The government also issued a bonus to WWI veterans in the
1930's...could this be what your father was referring to:

=====

The World War Adjusted Compensation Act of 1924, popularly
known as the Bonus Act, offered payment to veterans for service
for the first time since the War for Independence. It was enacted
over President Coolidge?s veto.

The law provided a bonus that depended upon the number of
days the veteran served. The average bonus was $1,500. Small
bonuses were paid immediately. All veterans whose service
exceeded 50 days were given 20-year paid-up endowment life
insurance certificates, the principal of which was payable in 1945...

=====

Let me know if that rings a bell.

Clarification of Question by honestlibra-ga on 11 Jan 2004 19:34 PST
it might be the bonus you are mentioning........ok, just off the phone
with my dad.....he said his dad (this would be my grandfather) served
in the u.s. army in 1916 and 1917. He served in France....my dad is
saying you might be right, it might have been bonus's for services
rendered to the vets.  My dad is right now going to look for the
records of the military number etc....i dont know if this would be
confidential information?  i dont know if i can or should put my
grandfather's military numbers here? anyway, if for the sake of
argument, it was bonus bonds given to the ww1 vets, how could we find
them since they have been lost?

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 11 Jan 2004 19:40 PST
I think your instincts are on the mark here -- don't go posting your
grandfather's detailed information here in a public forum.  No sense
encouraging anyone else to try an unearth any of his missing funds.

Instead, give the researchers here (myself, of others) a few days to
look into some of the background on the bonus, and see if there's
anything of interest that we can tell you.

pafalafa-ga

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 11 Jan 2004 19:41 PST
Ooops, that should have been:  "...myself, OR others..."

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 11 Jan 2004 20:00 PST
OK, I got a hit that looks pretty good.

On the following Dept. of Treasury site:

http://www.publicdebt.treas.gov/sec/secasb.htm


they describe the "Adjusted Service Bonds" that were issued to WWI
vets as part of the Bonus program:

-----

Adjusted Service Bonds (ASBs) were issued in registered form to
veterans of World War I. They were issued for amounts due on Adjusted
Service Certificates that had not matured. (In effect, Adjusted
Service Certificates were 20-year endowment insurance policies
maturing in 20 years.)

Bondowners, their survivors, or their representatives can redeem an
ASB by completing the back of the certificate and submitting it to:

      Definitives Section
      Bureau of the Public Debt
      P.O. Box 426
      Parkersburg, WV 26106-0426 

If you submit a bond for redemption and we need more information or
documentation, we will contact you.

-----

My question to you is this. Do you want me to find out if there is a
procedure regarding lost bonds, and post the information I uncover as
an answer to your question?

Bear in mind that the answer may be "Here's what to do..." OR, it may
just as easily be "Sorry, there's no way to redeem missing
certificates...".

Let me know what you think.

paf

Clarification of Question by honestlibra-ga on 11 Jan 2004 20:07 PST
again just asked my dad and he said YES! please find out what the
proceedure is for lost bonds! thank you so much.

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 12 Jan 2004 06:51 PST
OK, I'm on it.  

While I'm doing my research, please do me a favor.  Go to this
Veteran's Administration site:

https://insurance.va.gov/inForceGliSite/liability/ufsearch.htm

and -- at the bottom of the page -- fill in your grandfather's name
and other information as best you can in the search fields provided. 
Hit "Submit Query" and let me know what sort of results you get.

Thanks.

Clarification of Question by honestlibra-ga on 12 Jan 2004 20:44 PST
i am waiting for my dad to give me day of death....

Clarification of Question by honestlibra-ga on 13 Jan 2004 10:50 PST
hello again, i just entered the information into
https://insurance.va.gov/inForceGliSite/liability/ufsearch.htm
and it came up NO MATCH FOUND, VA DOESNT OWE YOU MONEY.  But i think
this is for insurance money, not unclaimed war bonds....

Request for Question Clarification by pafalafa-ga on 13 Jan 2004 11:51 PST
Thanks for the update.

I didn't think anything would come up from that database, but I
figured it couldn't hurt to try.

The Adjusted Service Bonds actually are connected in a roundabout way
to government-issued life insurance, so it seemed doubly worthwhile to
try the search.

I'll explain a bit more when I post my answer.  I'm just waiting to
have a few phone calls and emails returned from two government
offices.

Thanks for your patience.  

pafalafa-ga
Answer  
Subject: Re: BABY WAR BONDS
Answered By: pafalafa-ga on 14 Jan 2004 07:06 PST
Rated:5 out of 5 stars
 
Hello again,

Well...it's been quite a journey through the bureaucratic maze of the
federal government.  But I must confess, the people I spoke with were
professional and service-oriented.  My gut feeling is that they will
do their best to help you out, although there is certainly no
assurance of success.

The documents known as "Adjusted Service Bonds" were issued to some
veterans of World War I as an adjunct to a life insurance program that
involved documents known as "Adjusted Service Certificates".  A brief
explanation of the Bonds and Certificates (often referred to as ASB's
and AFC's, respectively) can be found at a Treasury Department site,
here:

www.publicdebt.treas.gov/sec/secasb.htm

and the actual law pertaining to ASC's and ASB's can be found on a
Veteran's Affairs site, here:

www.warms.vba.va.gov/regs/38CFR/ BOOKE/PART11/S11_109.DOC


As the links above make clear, the two key government agencies
involved are the Treasury Department (which issued the bonds, and can
redeem them) and the Department of Veterans Affairs (which maintains
records of all U.S. veterans).

It is the Treasury Department that actually would provide the cash
value of any redeemable bonds your grandfather might have owned.  But
in order for that to occur, they absolutely, positively need to know
the certificate numbers on the bonds.  Once you have these numbers in
hand, you can contact the Treasury Department's "Definitives Section"
to inquire about redeeming the bonds.

The very helpful contact person there is Crystal, and she can be
reached at 304-480-7936 -- she is their in-house expert on ASB's.

You can also write to them at:

Definitives Section
Bureau of the Public Debt
P.O. Box 426
Parkersburg, WV 26106-0426 

==========

The VA *might* be able to tell you the numbers on any certificates or
bonds issued to your grandfather.  It's a long shot -- these are
obviously records from quite a long time ago -- but they seem
genuinely willing to give it their best effort.

The email contact for the right person at the VA is:

ISSCZARO@VBA.VA.GOV

Send him all the identifying information on your grandfather that you
have available:  full name,  address or addresses, dates of birth and
death, service record, etc.

Also include a clear request that you are looking for any information
about Adjusted Service Bonds, Adjusted Service Certificates, or any
other similar documents issued to your grandfather, and that you would
like certificate numbers and any other related information that would
allow you to redeem these documents.

You should get a pretty prompt reply from the VA acknowledging that
they have received your request.  I'm sure they will need a fair
amount of time, however, to actually process it, and get back to you
with whatever information is available.

==========

I wish you the best of luck in all this, and hope that the information
provided fully meets your needs.  However, if anything here is not
clear -- or if you need additional information -- just let me know by
posting a Request for Clarification, and I'll be happy to assist you
further.

pafalafa-ga


search strategy:

Google searches on -- 

WWI bonds
WWI "war bonds"
WWI bonds site:gov
"adjusted service bonds"
"adjusted service certificates"

Request for Answer Clarification by honestlibra-ga on 16 Jan 2004 22:31 PST
hi there, one of the links wont work...this one:
www.warms.vba.va.gov/regs/38CFR/ BOOKE/PART11/S11_109.DOC
can you find a work around for us???

Clarification of Answer by pafalafa-ga on 17 Jan 2004 05:06 PST
Links are a mysterious thing.  I don't know why an errant space showed
up in the link to the law --sometimes they just don't want to post
properly...!

Here's the link again (which works fine when I try it):

http://www.warms.vba.va.gov/regs/38CFR/BOOKE/PART11/S11_109.DOC

and here's the text of the page I linked to, in case it still won't
come up for you:

-----


Application for Payment of Adjusted Service 
Certificate under the Adjusted Compensation 
Payment Act, 1936 (Pub. L. 425, 74th Cong.)


11.109  Settlement of unmatured adjusted service certificates.

	Where an application for final settlement of an adjusted service
certificate is received in the Department of Veterans Affairs prior to
the maturity date of the certificate, payment will be made under the
terms of the Adjusted Compensation Payment Act, 1936. This act
provides for payment of the amount due on the certificate, after
deducting any unpaid loans with interest through September 30, 1931,
in adjusted service bonds. These bonds will be issued by the Treasury
Department in denominations of $50, in the name of the veteran only,
and will bear interest at the rate of 3 percent per annum from June
15, 1936, to June 15, 1945. Any excess amount not sufficient to
purchase a $50 bond will be paid by check.


	[19 FR 5087, Aug. 12, 1954]

-----

Please do let me know how things work out for you and your dad.
honestlibra-ga rated this answer:5 out of 5 stars
this person really worked hard to help my family. thank you so much.

Comments  
Subject: Re: BABY WAR BONDS
From: richard-ga on 11 Jan 2004 07:38 PST
 
Note to Researchers:
The Savings Bond Marketing Office (formerly the United States Savings
Bonds Division) promotes the sale and retention of United States
Savings Bonds. These activities originally were part of the War
Finance Division, that was established on March 19, 1941. Predecessors
of the government savings bond program were the Liberty Bonds in World
War I and the Baby Bonds of the late 1930's. The Savings Bond
Marketing Office is now a part of the Bureau of the Public Debt.
http://www.ustreas.gov/education/duties/bureaus/savingsbondmarketing.html
Subject: Re: BABY WAR BONDS
From: pafalafa-ga on 24 Jan 2004 13:33 PST
 
honestlibra-ga,

Thanks so much for the very generous rating.  I hope the information I
provided leads to something fruitful.

All the best...

pafalafa-ga

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