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Subject:
UK shared driveway question
Category: Relationships and Society > Law Asked by: marshymoo-ga List Price: $15.00 |
Posted:
18 Apr 2005 03:12 PDT
Expires: 22 Apr 2005 02:40 PDT Question ID: 510725 |
Hi, Simply put, my garage is next to my neighbours garage. One cars length is my private drive and behind that is shared driveway (about another cars length). All this shows within my property boundary, and behind the shared driveway 'space' i have plants i tend for. Behind my neighbours private space, is shared driveway, and the entrance into the parking area for all our neighbours. Obviously he can't park his second car here, as it would block access to all our garages, and he accepts this. However my question is.... can he park on the shared driveway 'space' within my boundary? It doesn't 'block' access to my driveway, but can make it tricky to get in and out. It has been used as a parking space by visitors to my house before. I thought this to be fine, as it was within my boundary. (my property is on 3 sides of the shared driveway area, with the access into the garages from the road (behind my neighbours private space) being on the fourth side) My understanding of shared driveway is that is can be used for access? I.e. if he owned property on the far side on the shared driveway he can cross it to access his land? Also i thought it could be used for turning a car etc. Am i mistaken in thinking that shared driveway can't be used for parking a car unless it's within your property boundary? If anyone can clarify the UK law on this for me i'd be very grateful. |
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Subject:
Re: UK shared driveway question
From: answerfinder-ga on 18 Apr 2005 03:46 PDT |
Dear marshymoo-ga, I became rather confused with the layout of your property (that?s my fault). I assume you?ve checked your deeds to see if anything is defined in them. This web site on Boundary problems may assist you. http://www.boundary-problems.co.uk/ Shared drives. "Neither neighbour has a right to park their car on a shared driveway. The half of the car that is on the neighbour's land has no right of parking, and the half that is on its owner's land is obstructing the neighbour's right of way." http://www.boundary-problems.co.uk/maineasements.htm answerfinder-ga |
Subject:
Re: UK shared driveway question
From: marshymoo-ga on 18 Apr 2005 04:29 PDT |
Hi thanks for the comment, Yes i've seen that website, but it seemed to suggest neither neighbour has a right to park as it would block access. However, it is possible to gain access to my private space (albeit slightly tricky) with a car parked in the shared space. i have checked my deeds and all it states is i shouldn't block access to others property. i can find the exact blurb if it helps as it might mean more to someone in the know? I was wondering whether neither of us have a right to park there, or as long as there is room for a car to turn around whether i can park there as it's within my boundary? i've tried a layout diagram below: dropped curb]shared driveway1 <his private space>{ his garage} ------------| my shrubs |shared driveway2 <my private space >{ my garage} --- my shrubs ---|------------------ |my private fenced garden shared driveway 2 is the area in question as he can't park in shared driveway 1 without blocking access for everyone. So can neither of us park there, or can only i? the space doesn't block access to either property, but he also has no need to cross it (unless he decides to drive into my shrubs!) |
Subject:
Re: UK shared driveway question
From: frde-ga on 18 Apr 2005 05:21 PDT |
That diagram illustrates the problem perfectly. First, I suggest that you check out exactly to whom the land belongs. From my limited experience, it will belong to someone, with a right of way/access granted to the other person. My guess would be that your neighbour 'owns' the drive, and you 'own' the disputed bit, but have a right of way and have a covenant to pay for maintenance. The next step is to decide how nasty you want to get. A simple and practical technique is to buy an old wreck (de-register it - that is essential) and dump it in the disputed corner. You have (hypothetically) discovered the joys of car restoration. Basically he is parking on your second car shunt room, while his lass puts her motor in the garage. |
Subject:
Re: UK shared driveway question
From: marshymoo-ga on 18 Apr 2005 05:53 PDT |
Hi, You're right, the land belongs to me and my property boundary goea above shared driveway2 between the two private drives, round my garden and house and shrubs as per the # boundary shown below: dropped curb]shared driveway1 <his private space>{ his garage} ############################################################### #my shrubs |shared driveway2 <my private space >{ my garage} # # --- my shrubs ---|--------------------------------# # |my private fenced garden # ############################################################### so it 'belongs' to me, with rights for access etc granted to him. I could get a banger, but that's a bit of a red flag for him to start being narky. basically he's said if i can tell him he has no right to park there he'll stop. So i'm trying to find an amincable way of resolving the issue. if he has a right to park there i'll have to shut up and live with it (rather than hog it with a spare car). if neither of us have a right to park there, i'll propbably point this out to him, though i might have to keep quiet as my visitors occasionally park there. And i wouldn't want to cut off my nose to spite my face 9neither of us would be able to park there) my dream situation would be though that he has a right to pass over it or turn around in it/ access property via it. As he has no where over it to pass to, has no property to access using it, so that would leave using it for turning. If that is the legal definition of shared drive, i'd be jumping for joy. i'm looking for something like: the owner has a right to use the land as if it were there own as long as it does not block access to any other party that has a right to use it or something similar in legaleese any definitions that clarify one way or the other? |
Subject:
Re: UK shared driveway question
From: myoarin-ga on 18 Apr 2005 15:30 PDT |
Hi, Why can't he park his second car in his private space, in front of his garage? Sure, then if he want's to use the car in the garage, he has to jockey them around, but that should be his problem. The shared area was intended to let you make the swing to get in your garage or park a possible 2nd car on your private space. If you can drive into your garage when a car in on your side of the shared space, you can probably do it even more easily if his 2nd car is in front of his garage. Seems to me that this was what was intended when the deed was drawn up (probably not anticipating two-car residents, though), and tallies with answerfinder's site quotation. Good luck |
Subject:
Re: UK shared driveway question
From: frde-ga on 19 Apr 2005 00:02 PDT |
@marshymoo-ga, Parking problems can create really bad blood between neighbours. I know, I have a vaguely similar problem. Personally I would check out your house deeds very carefully, they should include a covenant that you grant him right of access. 'Right of access' is not the same as 'right to park'. You might even find that there is no such covenant, as it is quite clear that he does not need to drive over /any/ of your property - while you clearly need to pass over his property. |
Subject:
Re: UK shared driveway question
From: marshymoo-ga on 19 Apr 2005 02:23 PDT |
Hi I checked my title document which says it serves as a deed document (i take it therefore it is my deed document)?! It defines everything from private driveway to common ammenities (bin area, pathways etc). it shows the shared driveway on the plan but does NOT define it's purpose. The document mentions that easements should be adhered to, but doesn't list the easements in place. And it says that an easement shall be deemed to exist if it is used within 80 years of the property being built. Basically it doesn't specifically say i have to give him rights over my property, but it does show an area within my boundary as shared driveway, and makes reference to possibly existing easements. What can i do to clarify? does this mean he doesn't have rights to park on my property? Is there somewhere i can look to clarify? and THANKS to everyone for their comments so far! :-) |
Subject:
Re: UK shared driveway question
From: frde-ga on 19 Apr 2005 04:27 PDT |
Ok - the other guy is pulling your chain - that is obvious from the: <quote> basically he's said if i can tell him he has no right to park there he'll stop. </quote> Take a six pack round to his place (when his lass is out) and get him to explain exactly /why/ you should not park in front of his garage (in such a way as he might be able to get out). You could <G> just ask him exactly why he thinks he has a right to /park/ on your property. - if you are really evil, you could photocopy your deeds, give them to him, and tell him to get a legal opinion. I suspect that he is playing for time. However, it would be wise to set up a paper trail |
Subject:
Re: UK shared driveway question
From: marshymoo-ga on 19 Apr 2005 05:13 PDT |
Thanks Again for all your comments. I have the title plan from land registry and the register from land registry. There's stuff about covenants, which are i think basically to allow the company to look at pipes and electricity etc. i take it this is the same as a transfer deed? I have the adobe version here on my pc and can quite easily post here for you guys to scrutinise and see if you can spot something that says he has a right to use that piece of land? |
Subject:
Re: UK shared driveway question
From: marshymoo-ga on 19 Apr 2005 05:18 PDT |
2 (05.11.1999) The land has the benefit of the following rights granted by but is subject to the following rights reserved by the Transfer dated 14 October 1999 referred to in the Charges Register:- "The Property hereby transferred is transferred together with the following rights to benefit the whole of the Property and each and every part thereof and all buildings and roads which may be erected thereon within the Perpetuity Period. (1) A right of way at all times and for all purposes (in common with the Transferor and all others entitled to use the same) over and along the Distributor Road and the footpaths on either side thereof now or to be constructed within the Perpetuity Period. (2) A right in common with all other persons so entitled at all times to use all conduits within the Retained Land for the passage of surface water soil water gas electricity or any other forms of energy or power as then or are during the Perpetuity Period may be laid or constructed under or through any part of the Retained Land with the right to enter upon the Retained Land (upon giving previous notice to the Transferor or its successors in title the owners or occupiers for the time being of the Retained Land and consulting with such persons over the timing method and mode of such works with a view to causing as little inconvenience as possible) for the purpose of laying constructing cleansing maintaining inspecting repairing or making good so far as possible and with all due speed all damage thereby occasioned PROVIDED THAT this right shall only be exerciseable in respect of those parts of the Retained Land which are not (and which are not intended to be) the plots of Dwellinghouses and provided that the exercise of the rights referred to in this clause is subject to adequate capacity being available in such conduits after taking into account the capacity requirements of the Transferor and the Dwellinghouses constructed or to be constructed on the Retained Land provided that the routes and lines of such conduits shall be as reasonably specified by the Transferor (who shall not delay in specifying when asked to do so) and/or the relevant owners for the time being of the parts of the Retained Land affected thereby and in doing so the person or persons so entering shall cause as little damage and inconvenience as reasonably practicable to such owner and shall make good the surface of such parts of the Retained Land without any unnecessary delay. (3) Following the grant of all appropriate statutory consents the right to execute works and erections upon or to alter or rebuild any buildings upon and the right to erect or construct any new buildings upon the Property in such manner as the owner or occupier thereof shall think fit including the right to overhang eaves and/or gutters over the Retained This is a copy of the register of the title number set out immediately below, showing the entries in the register on 19 APR 2005 at 12:59:00. This copy does not take account of any application made after that time even if still pending in the Land Registry when this copy was issued. This copy is not an 'Official Copy' of the register. An official copy of the register is admissible in evidence in a court to the same extent as the original. A person is entitled to be indemnified by the registrar if he suffers loss by reason of a mistake in an official copy. If you want to obtain an official copy, the Land Registry web site explains how to do this. Page 2 of 8 Land notwithstanding that the access of light to the rear of the Retained Land may be affected or interfered with. (4) Such rights of support as may be necessary to maintain the stability of any building or walls which then or at any time within the Perpetuity Period may be erected upon the Property PROVIDED THAT such rights of support shall not be deemed to include the right to erect and maintain any structure or erection upon the Retained Land for the purpose of support. (5) The right from time to time at all reasonable hours in the day time or at any time in the case of emergency to enter upon the Retained Land so far as may be necessary (but not otherwise) for the purpose of inspecting cleansing repairing renewing and maintaining the roofs walls fences eaves spouts gutters and pipes of any buildings then or during the Perpetuity Period to be constructed on the Property upon giving previous notice to the Transferor or its successors in title the owners or occupiers for the time being of the Retained Land and consulting with such persons over the timing method and mode of such works with a view to causing as little inconvenience as possible subject to the person exercising such right being liable to the Transferor or its successors for any loss or damage thereby caused and (6) The right for the Transferee and its successors in title to connect into and take supplies of water electricity gas and telephone services from the conduits that are laid or are to be laid alongside the Distributor Road. The Property hereby transferred is transferred excepting and reserving to the Transferor and the Trust and their respective successors in title and the occupiers for the time being of the Affordable Housing Units the full and free rights (exerciseable in common with the Transferee and all others from time to time entitled to the like rights) of - 1. Connection to the said roads and footpaths and the Service Conduits with the roads and footpaths and the Service Conduits that have been or may be constructed on or in the Affordable Housing Land within the Perpetuity Period. 2. Way with or without vehicles and animals at all times and for all purposes over and along the said roads and footpaths until they become adopted highways. 3. Connection into within the Perpetuity Period and thereafter use of the Conduits and supply of Services through the same. 4. If the Transferee defaults in performing any of its obligations to the Transferor and the Trust then the Transferor and the Trust shall each have the right to enter the Property with all necessary Contractors workmen and equipment and construct the roads and footpaths and construct and/or install the Service Conduits and the cost of doing so shall be recoverable as a debt owing by the Transferee repayable on demand. The Property hereby transferred is transferred excepting and reserving for the benefit of the Retained Land and the owners and occupiers from time to time of the whole or any parts thereof:- (i) A right of way at all times and for all purposes (in common with the Transferee and all other entitled to use the same) over and along all roads or paths to be constructed on the Property within the Perpetuity Period provided that this right shall not apply to driveways and paths within the curtilage of individual Dwellinghouses which are not intended to be offered for adoption to the Highway Authority the person or persons exercising such rights causing as little damage as possible and making good any damage caused. (ii) A right in common with all other persons so entitled at all times to use all conduits within the Property for the passage of surface water soil water gas electricity or any other forms of energy or power as then are or during the Perpetuity Period may be laid or constructed under or through any part of the Property with the right to enter upon the Property (upon giving previous notice to the Purchaser or its successors in title the owners or occupiers for the time being of the Property and consulting with such persons over the timing method and mode of such works with a view to causing as little inconvenience as possible) for the purpose of laying constructing cleansing maintaining inspecting repairing or making connection with such conduits the person exercising such right making good so far as possible and with all due speed all damage occasioned provided that this right shall only be exerciseable in respect of those parts of the Property which are not (and which are not intended to be) the plots or Dwellinghouses and provided (but without prejudice to the Transferee's obligations to the Transferor) that the exercise of the rights referred to in this Clause is subject to adequate capacity being available in such Conduits after taking into account the capacity requirements of the Transferee and the Dwellinghouses constructed or to be constructed on the Property and provided that the routes and line of such Conduits shall be as reasonably specified by the Transferee (who shall not delay in so specifying when asked to do so) and/or the relevant owners for the time being of the parts to the Property affected thereby and in doing so the person or persons so entering shall cause as little damage and inconvenience as reasonably practicable to such owner and shall make good the surface of such parts of the Property without any unnecessary delay. (iii) Following the grant of all appropriate Statutory Consents the right to execute works and erections upon or to alter or rebuild any buildings upon and the right to erect or construct any new buildings upon the Retained Land in such manner as the owner or occupier shall think fit notwithstanding that the access of light or air to the Property may be affected or interfered with. (iv) Such rights of support as may be necessary to maintain the stability of any buildings or walls which then are or at any time within the Perpetuity Period may be erected upon the Retained Land provided that such rights of support shall not be deemed to include the right to erect and maintain any structure or erection upon the Property for the purpose of support. (v) The right from time to time at all reasonable hours in the day or at any time in the case of emergency to enter upon the Property so far as may be necessary (but not otherwise) for the purpose of inspecting cleansing repairing renewing and maintaining the roofs walls fences eaves spouts gutters and pipes of any buildings then or during the Perpetuity Period to be constructed on the Retained Land upon giving previous notice to the Transferee or its successors in title the owners or occupiers for the time being of the works with a view to causing as little inconvenience as possible subject to the persons exercising such right being liable to the Transferee or its successors for any loss or damage thereby caused and (vi) The right from time to time to have access through the Property to such of the planted and open space areas adjoining the Property for the purpose of laying out planting and maintaining the said planted and open space areas in performance of the Transferor's obligations under Section 106 Agreement provided that in the exercise of such right the Transferor shall first consult with the Transferee and exercise such access only over the route designated by the Transferee (who shall act reasonably in making such designations having regard to its routes of construction of its housing development on the Property). AFFORDABLE HOUSING Has the meaning ascribed to it by clauses 10.3-10.9 (inclusive) of the Section 106 Agreement (hereinafter defined). AFFORDABLE HOUSING LAND Means the land designated for the building on it of Affordable Housing and described by being edged green on Plan 2. AFFORDABLE HOUSING UNITS Means the Dwellinghouses that are to be built upon the Affordable Housing Land. CONDUITS Means pipes wires drains mains ducts conduits gutters watercourses wires cables channels subways flues and all other service conducting media including any fixings louvres cowls and other covers. THE DISTRIBUTOR ROAD Means the road to be constructed by the Transferor in the position shown coloured blue on the Plan 1. DWELLINGHOUSE Means a house flat maisonette or other single unit of dwelling accommodation to be constructed by the Transferee on the Property and shall include the curtilage and the garden thereof and a garage or garages as the case may be. THE LOCAL COUNCIL Means the Borough Council of ######. THE OUTLINE PLANNING PERMISSION Means the Outline Planning Permission for the devleopment of 800 houses on the land referred to in the Outline Planning Permission issued on the 16th day of August 1999 by the Local Council reference number BDB. THE PERPETUITY PERIOD Means the period of 80 years from the date hereof. PLAN 1 Means the plan annexed hereto and marked 1. PLAN 2 Means the plan annexed hereto and marked 2. THE PROPERTY Means all the land described above and transferred by this Transfer. THE RETAINED LAND Means the land situate in Basingstoke aforesaid and being the Development excluding the Property and all other parcels of land that have been sold by the Transferor or its predecessors in title prior to the date hereof and includes Affordable Housing Land. THE SECTION 106 AGREEMENT Means an Agreement relating to the Development purusant to the Outline Planning Permission and made pursuant to Section 106 of the Town and Country Planning Act 1990 and Section 33 of the Local Government (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 1982 dated 17th June 1999 and made between the Local Council (1) and the Transferor (2). THE SECTION 278 AGREEMENT Means the Agreement relating to the construction maintenance and adoption Page 5 of 8 of highways in connection with the said development pursuant to Section 278 of the Highways Act 1980 and Section 111 of the Local Government Act 1972 dated the 12th day of August 1999 made between the Hampshire County Council (1) and the Transferor (2). SERVICES Means water gas electricity and telecommunications supplies and signals and foul drainage. THE SUB-TRANSFEROR Means Thameswey Homes Limited (co Reg No 926028) of Shortlands London W6 8EZ. THE TRUST Means The Guiness Trust (London Fund) founded 1890 registered 1902 of 17 Mundy Street High Wycombe Barking Hampshire HP11 2NZ". 昧OTE: Copies of Transfer plans 1 and 2 in Certificate. Copy plans filed under HP######. 3 (05.11.1999) The Transfer dated 14 October 1999 referred to above contains the following provision:- "It is hereby agreed and declared that nothing in this transfer contained or implied by Law shall operate to confer upon the Transferee or its successors in title:- (i) Any easement or quasi-easement right or privilege whatsoever over or against the Transferor's adjoining or adjacent property or the Affordable Housing Land or any part or parts thereof other than any rights hereby granted and (ii) Any rights to light or air or any other easement right or privilege which would or might restrict or prejudicially affect the future rebuilding or alteration or development of such adjoining or adjacent property or the Affordable Housing Land or any part thereof and any other part or parts thereof other than any express right hereby granted provided that such future rebuilding or development shall not prejudice or interfere with the development of the Property as a private housing estate". 4 (06.03.2001) The land has the benefit of the rights granted by but is subject to the rights reserved by the Transfer of the land in this title dated 22 February 2001 referred to in the Charges Register. 5 (06.03.2001) The Transfer dated 22 February 2001 referred to above contains provisions as to light or air and boundary structures. END OF A REGISTER Page 6 of 8 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ TITLE NUMBER : ######## B PROPRIETORSHIP REGISTER This register specifies the class of title and identifies the owner. It contains any entries that affect the right of disposal. TITLE ABSOLUTE ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 1 (24.10.2003) PROPRIETOR: #########. 2 (24.10.2003) The price stated to have been paid ########. 3 (24.10.2003) The Transfer to the proprietor contains a covenant to observe and perform the covenants referred to in the Charges Register and of indemnity in respect thereof. END OF B REGISTER ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ TITLE NUMBER : ####### C CHARGES REGISTER This register contains any charges and other matters that affect the land. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 1 The land together with other land is subject to such liability if any as attaches thereto in respect of a quit rent or annual payment of 19s 6d payable to the Ecclesiastical Commissioners for England on account of the chapter of the Cathedral of Winchester and also to a quit rent or annual payment of 4s 6d payable to the Lord of The Manor of Steventon Hants. NOTE: The land has the benefit of a covenant of indemnity contained in transfers affecting the land in this title dated 1 February 1927, 24 January 1927 and 14 May 1927. 2 (05.11.1999) A Transfer of the land in this title and other land dated 14 October 1999 made between (1) ######## (Transferor) and (2) ########(Transferees) contains the following covenants:- "The Transferees to the intent and so as to bind not only it but all persons in whom the Property or any part thereof shall for the time being be vested and so as to run with and bind the Property and each and every part thereof and its successors in title and to benefit the parts of the Retained Land and each and every part thereof that are at the date hereof in the ownership of the Transferor:- (i) Not to build upon the Property any buildings other than land and not to build more than 69 dwellinghouses or electricity substations gas governor stations and such other buildings as may lawfully be required by any competent local or other authority as a condition of permitting the development of the Property for residential purposes and not to use or occupy any Dwellinghouse for any purpose other than the occupation of each such Dwellinghouse by one family only at a time. (ii) Not to do or permit or suffer to be done on the Property any act matter or thing which may be or grow to be a nuisance damage or annoyance to the Transferor or its successors in title or to the owners or occupiers of the Retained Land and in particular (but without prejudice to the generality of the foregoing) which might in any way interfere with or prevent or make more difficult or more expensive any development of the Retained Land provided that the construction of Dwellinghouses on the Property in accordance with the foregoing provisions shall not be deemed to be a breach of this covenant". 3 (06.03.2001) A Transfer of the land in this title dated 22 February 2001 made between (1) #######(2) ########## contains restrictive covenants. 昧OTE: Copy in Certificate. 4 (06.03.2001) The Transfer dated 22 February 2001 referred to above contains a covenant by the Transferee with the Transferor as to the grant of rights as therein mentioned. 5 (24.10.2003) REGISTERED CHARGE dated 10 October 2003. 6 (24.10.2003) Proprietor: ######################### END OF REGISTER NOTE: The date at the beginning of an entry is the date on which the entry was made in the Register. |
Subject:
Re: UK shared driveway question
From: frde-ga on 19 Apr 2005 23:41 PDT |
The Property hereby transferred is transferred excepting and reserving for the benefit of the Retained Land and the owners and occupiers from time to time of the whole or any parts thereof:- (i) A right of way at all times and for all purposes (in common with the Transferee and all other entitled to use the same) over and along all roads or paths to be constructed on the Property within the Perpetuity Period provided that this right shall not apply to driveways and paths within the curtilage of individual Dwellinghouses which are not intended to be offered for adoption to the Highway Authority the person or persons exercising such rights causing as little damage as possible and making good any damage caused. That looks like the bit we are after. Basically the Trust retains the right of way over driveways, for itself and all other owners and occupiers of 'the Retained Land' - except for driveways within the FENCED boundaries of INDIVIDUAL Dwellinghouses Very shaky - as the 'Retained Land' is NOT 'occupied' Although bits of it will later become 'occupied' - is your driveway 'adopted' ? "It is hereby agreed and declared that nothing in this transfer contained or implied by Law shall operate to confer upon the Transferee or its successors in title:- (i) Any easement or quasi-easement right or privilege whatsoever over or against the Transferor's adjoining or adjacent property or the Affordable Housing Land or any part or parts thereof other than any rights hereby granted and The above means your neighbour's rights over your property are limited to the ones set out. (Well in his contract it means that - in your contract it restricts you) It is pretty clear that you need to highlight the second (limiting) clause and then ask your neighbour to locate an EXPLICIT right to set up a barbeque on any part of your property. If your bit of the driveway is /not/ adopted then it is debateable whether it falls within your curtilage - if it does, then NOBODY has a right of way over it - since your pad is an /individual/ Dwellinghouse. Note: Curtilage means :- 'The enclosed area immediately surrounding a house or dwelling' I think that one also needs to look into 'Right of Way' It is right to pass over, or more specifically right to pass over /at will/ without being obstructed. If visitors park their car in your corner, are you /obstructing/ your neighbour ? Probably not, as passing over that bit of ground is not going to get him anywhere. ie: he can get from his property to the road without being obstructed. |
Subject:
Re: UK shared driveway question
From: marshymoo-ga on 20 Apr 2005 02:03 PDT |
Hi, thanks for your comments. All the driveway in question is within my property boundary, and i am responsible for it's upkeep, not the council etc. i guess that means it is adopted? You are correct, if i were to park on the shared driveway area in question, it would not affect my neighbour in anyway. he has no need to cross that are unless he wanted to cause mallice to my shrubs! So basically it says we all have rights over roads and paths around the estate, but not over driveways that fall within a property boundary where the owner is responsible for it's upkeep? Unless he has a specific covenant in his deeds granting him rights, he has no rights of access over my property, as he has no reason to access anything on the far side of the shared drive? Many thanks for your response, i think it's all becoming clearer. |
Subject:
Re: UK shared driveway question
From: marshymoo-ga on 20 Apr 2005 03:39 PDT |
this looks like a good part or the document to point out to him: 3 (05.11.1999) The Transfer dated 14 October 1999 referred to above contains the following provision:- "It is hereby agreed and declared that nothing in this transfer contained or implied by Law shall operate to confer upon the Transferee or its successors in title:- (i) Any easement or quasi-easement right or privilege whatsoever over or against the Transferor's adjoining or adjacent property or the Affordable Housing Land or any part or parts thereof other than any rights hereby granted and do the other sections quoted override this with regards to access to my property? The thing that throws me is that he has shared driveway within his property boundary too. But my deeds don't specifically say i have a right to cross his land either? I think he might pick up on this. So any ideas how i can point out that shared driveway is for access to YOUR land, and not for him to park on when it is within my boundary? i.e. i have a right to use the shared driveway at the roadside entrance (on his land) to get into my private driveway (as do many others in our cul-de-sac). but he has no need to use the shared driveway within my boundary to access his land, so he has no rights of access? This is the bit i'm just not seeing in the document. |
Subject:
Re: UK shared driveway question
From: marshymoo-ga on 20 Apr 2005 04:36 PDT |
and even if he spots the: The Property hereby transferred is transferred excepting and reserving for the benefit of the Retained Land and the owners and occupiers from time to time of the whole or any parts thereof:- (i) A right of way at all times and for all purposes (in common with the Transferee and all other entitled to use the same) over and along all roads or paths to be constructed on the Property within the Perpetuity Period provided that this right shall not apply to driveways and paths within the curtilage of individual Dwellinghouses which are not intended to be offered for adoption to the Highway Authority the person or persons exercising such rights causing as little damage as possible and making good any damage caused. part of the document, this (in the worst case scenario) is saying he has a right of way over the shared drive. (assuming in worst case scenario for whatever reason the shared driveway doesn't constitute part of my individual dwellinghouse curtilage). So assuming ALL these worst case scenarios, all it's saying is he's got a right of way over the shared drive. Which doesn't constitute a right to park? So a right of way can ONLY be used for access purposes? and he has no area to access using the shared drive, so has no need to utilise that space. Sorry to ask so many questions! I really want to know this so i don't get backed into a corner, and end up with him parking (almost in the hedge) all weekend every weekend! Thanks again everyone! |
Subject:
Re: UK shared driveway question
From: frde-ga on 20 Apr 2005 05:32 PDT |
Phew - if you have to maintain your own tarmac then it gets interesting. Here is a link to another definition of 'Curtilage' http://www.planningadvice.co.uk/FAQ/definitions_interpretation_7.htm Basically it says that it is /very/ flexible. I think that we are now getting into interpreting the intentions behind the contract rather than the contract itself. Since they are 'rights of access' to ones own property, it is fairly simple. Personally I would suggest talking to your neighbour, and asking /exactly/ who is going to pay for the upkeep of the 'common drive'. You almost certainly have 'an established right of way', since it was intended by the developers and unchallenged for years. I suggest that you and he draw up an additional covenenant stating that the cost of upkeep will be shared (be generous 50/50) - your 'patch' can be written in I am not a lawyer/solicitor, but I have humiliated a few in that profession in the past. You two need to sort out some additional covenants. You pay for half the road - and he stops obstructing you. |
Subject:
Re: UK shared driveway question
From: marshymoo-ga on 20 Apr 2005 07:21 PDT |
So do 'rights of access' not include parking rights? Any thoughts anyone? He's not obstructing me, as i can still get to my private driveway, it's just more difficult when he's parked there. It also makes doing any gardening on the shrub area impossible as his car overhangs the border, with his bumper practically touching the shrubs. From the deeds it seems at best (for him) he has rights of access. (if i have over the shared drive area within his boundary, then by default he has over the shared driveway within my boundary). This does not equate to a right to park? neither of us would be able to park in the shared driveway area within his boundary as it would block access to private driveways for 3 other properties, and the purpose of a shared driveway is to allow access. I however would not be obstructing any access rights by parking on the shared driveway within my property boundary. i think the: (i) A right of way at all times and for all purposes (in common with the Transferee and all other entitled to use the same) over and along all roads or paths to be constructed on the Property within the Perpetuity Period provided that this right shall not apply to driveways and paths within the curtilage of individual Dwellinghouses which are not intended to be offered for adoption to the Highway Authority the person or persons exercising such rights causing as little damage as possible and making good any damage caused. Covers the 'if you use it you're responsible for paying for it's upkeep' bit, so i don't think adding a covenant is necessary at this stage. I think if i can reasonable argue that the shared driveway is for access, and access rights only for him to the shared driveway within my boundary. or somehow show he hasn't even got access rights over that piece of land, he will stop parking there. if i can be certain access rights, do not equate to parking rights. And that these deeds seem to say that at best all he has is access rights. if i take this to him, i'm sure he'll stop parking there. I just want to be as clear as i can as he'll try and say the shared driveway is 'common land' or something, and that he has a right to park there. The more i hear from you guys the more i'm beginning to stand my ground that it IS my property, as it is shown within my boundary. and although it IS shared driveway on the developers plan, there are NO covenants within the deed specifying access to it. Even if the covenant referencing roads and paths etc, which doesn't mention shared driveway, were to be interpreted as including shared driveway, he'd only have access rights. So i guess what i'm asking is.... access rights... definitely not a right to park? |
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Re: UK shared driveway question
From: marshymoo-ga on 20 Apr 2005 08:08 PDT |
I found this on http://www.boundary-problems.co.uk/maineasements.htm: Private Right of Way Ideally, the owners of both the dominant and servient tenements should know exactly: ? where the right of way runs from and to; ? exactly what route the right of way follows between those two points; ? whether there are any width, weight or height restrictions on the traffic that uses the right of way; ? whether the traffic permitted to use the right of way includes motor vehicles, motor cycles, or is restricted to passage on foot; ? whether there are time restrictions in force, either as to time of day or day of the year, on which the right of way may be used; ? who is responsible for the maintenance of the right of way. Rarely are all, or even a fair proportion, of these things known. Generally: ? you may pass and repass along a right of way as long as you do not stop and linger on the right of way; ? if the right of way is obstructed then you may divert along another route provided that the diversion remains on land belonging to the servient tenement (otherwise you would be trespassing on a third party's land); ? a gate is not considered as an obstruction of the right of way provided that the users of the dominant tenement have the means of opening and/or unlocking the gate; ? ? the owner of the dominant tenement cannot expect the route to be widened, strengthened or given extra headroom just because his needs have changed: he is entitled only to the width, weight or headroom that was envisaged at the time of grant of the right of way. A private right of way on foot permits you to: ? pass and repass on foot between the dominant tenement and the public highway; ? with or without a load that one person might be expected to be capable of carrying; ? or pushing a small barrow or trolley or perambulator, or wheeling (not riding) a bicycle, provided that the wheeled device is not too wide to be accommodated by the footpath and by any gates along the path. A vehicular private right of way permits you to: ? drive vehicles of up to a permitted width, height and weight along the carriageway between the public highway and the dominant tenement; ? stop a vehicle on the right of way immediately adjacent to the dominant tenement for the purpose of loading and unloading that vehicle; ? perform other reasonable acts, such as pulling off the carriageway onto the verge in order to pass oncoming vehicles. A vehicular right of way is not a right of parking. If the width, height and weight limits of the right of way are not explicitly stated in the deed of grant then the courts will decide that these limits were set by naturally occurring restrictions that were in place at the time of the grant, such as the width of a gate at the entrance to the carriageway. It is quite common to find a carriageway that is much narrower than the defined width of the right of way, for example a 10 feet wide carriageway within a 40 feet wide right of way, with 15 feet wide verges on either side of the carriageway. In these circumstances it is perfectly acceptable to pull onto the verge in order to avoid a collision with oncoming traffic, but it is not acceptable to drive along the verge just because it falls within the stated width of the right of way. Repairing a private right of way If the right of way falls into disrepair, and if no-one can be identified as the party responsible for maintenance and if the owner of the servient tenement does not repair it, then the owner of the dominant tenement (who is inconvenienced by the poor condition of the way) may repair the way but must be careful not to improve the way (for it is not his land to develop). Thus a gravel drive may be re-graveled by the owner of the dominant tenement but must not improve it by concreting or tarmaccing the surface. Sometimes the owners of properties served by the same private road will form a club, often referred to as a road fund committee, charged with looking after the maintenance of the private right of way. They can do this if each property served by the road includes the portion of road (even if only up to the centre line) that fronts it. The costs of carriageway repair are met from funds raised through membership subscriptions. If the road fund committee decides to improve, rather than simply repair, the carriageway then each owner, being the servient owner of the road that fronts his property, is deemed to have given his permission for improvement of the road. the happy part of this is: A vehicular right of way is not a right of parking. :-))))))) |
Subject:
Re: UK shared driveway question
From: marshymoo-ga on 21 Apr 2005 07:32 PDT |
Thanks for all your comments, i've sent him a letter now saying at best he has a right of way, and that doesn't give him a right to park. Now i'll just wait and see whether he abides by his earlier comments that if i told him he has no rights he'll stop! watch this space......... |
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