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Q: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST ( No Answer,   17 Comments )
Question  
Subject: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST
Category: Health
Asked by: rosebudd-ga
List Price: $20.00
Posted: 08 Sep 2005 19:36 PDT
Expires: 08 Oct 2005 19:36 PDT
Question ID: 565913
I recently underwent an abdominal/pelvic CT scan (diverticulosis). I
was pleased that the procedure lasted approximately 15-20 minutes...
San Francisco California Pacific Medical Center's fee + a very
reasonable radiologist fee totalled $7,604. I think I have gone insane
and now may need a cranial CT. Why is that I have researched/read that
this particular CT scan would average approximately 1/3 the cost of a
"one day stay" in the hospital, exclusive of any surgery, etc.  So
it's now approximately $22,800 for a one day stay in the hospital,
exclusive of surgery!?  I am aware that the CT scanners cost a couple
of million... but at this rate, they are paid for within 30 days. Can
anyone explain the exhorbitant cost for this procedure?
Answer  
There is no answer at this time.

Comments  
Subject: Re: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST
From: crabcakes-ga on 08 Sep 2005 20:07 PDT
 
I can't explain why fees vary, but a large part of your CT fees go to
the radiologist. Diagnostic radiologists must be medical doctors with
additional training in radiology. Their fees are quite high, but you
are getting a great deal of expertise.

" Technical fee: The technical fee covers the use of equipment, film,
supplies and technical personnel and is billed by the facility/
hospital.

Radiologist's fee: The radiologist's fee covers the reading of the
x-ray films and any written or oral consultation you may have with the
radiologist."
http://www.phs.org/facilities/patguide/service.shtml

Continuing education and licensing fees are also very expensive.
http://www.virtualcolonoscopy.net/training.html

http://www.healthsystem.virginia.edu/internet/radiology/educ-opps/resident-education.cfm
Subject: Re: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST
From: rosebudd-ga on 08 Sep 2005 20:58 PDT
 
The radiologist's fees were less than a 10% tip... $278 for the
abdominal CT and $253 for the pelvic CT. You are way off the mark on
this one.  I am continuing to do my own research on fee scheduling for
this type of procedure.
Subject: Re: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST
From: rosebudd-ga on 08 Sep 2005 21:12 PDT
 
holy cow! I sure as heck hope I didn't pay a $20 fee for the comment
regarding the high cost of radiologist fees. That doesn't wash.
Subject: Re: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST
From: pinkfreud-ga on 08 Sep 2005 21:15 PDT
 
rosebudd,

Comments are totally free. Other than the fifty-cent listing fee, your
account will only be charged if and when an official Answer is posted
by a Researcher.
Subject: Re: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST
From: rosebudd-ga on 09 Sep 2005 12:09 PDT
 
The renown Mayo Clinic in Rochester Minnesota charges $3210 for this procedure.
Subject: Re: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST
From: angy-ga on 10 Sep 2005 05:48 PDT
 
Silly question,maybe, but have you asked them if there's been an error ??

Here in Australia you're entitled to be given the list of fees up front.
Subject: Re: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST
From: rosebudd-ga on 10 Sep 2005 07:19 PDT
 
I'm afraid there is no error. I guess one doesn't think first off,
"what's this going to cost", especially if you are covered by
insurance? When I saw the  statement, I thought there was error, but
it is correct according to their billing office. It's outrageous and
that's why I decided to get a cost quote from the Mayo Clinic for
comparison.
Subject: Re: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST
From: welte-ga on 10 Sep 2005 07:25 PDT
 
Hey  rosebudd-ga, I agree with angy-ga.  I work in the medical field
and can say that there are instances where the wrong codes are entered
for a procedure, patients are mixed up, etc.  There could be another
patient with a similar name or medical record number with whom your
billing was mixed up.  Often when you inquire about these types of
things, you're talking with one of the billing admin assistants, who
will look in the computer and say, yeah you were billed for $7000, so
it's no mistake that you received a bill for that amount.  You
probably need to talk with one of the financial counselors at SF Cal
Pacific to get a real challange to your bill.  I'm an MD and I still
get bills for medical care that were improperly billed or not properly
payed by my insurance company from years ago that I haven't been able
to sort out.  It's a great system.

Another option is to contact your doctor, who will at least know who
to ask within the speficie SF Cal Pacific system about inquiring about
the bill.

            -welte-ga
Subject: Re: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST
From: babblemouth-ga on 11 Sep 2005 19:16 PDT
 
This does not answer your question specifically, but a very
interesting webpage concerning medical charges is:
<http://www.dhmc.org/webpage.cfm?site_id=2&org_id=564&morg_id=0&sec_id=0&gsec_id=29715&item_id=29715>

Dartmouth is a national leader in self-reporting of various hospital
facts, performance rates, and other information; the above link is a
list of charges (both professional fees and technical fees) for
various diagnostic tests.  If you snoop around a bit more at dhmc.org,
you can see what other things cost as well...

Also remember that while these are the fees charged, they are not the
amounts paid.  Insurance companies "buy in bulk" and so are able to
pay less than the charged fee, because there's simply nothing the
hospitals/physicians can do to force those big powerful companies to
pay more... but an individual who fails to pay can be sued, their home
and car taken away, or their wages garnished!  (I am not sure how
often this actually happens, I imagine it is quite rare).
Subject: Re: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST
From: rosebudd-ga on 11 Sep 2005 21:37 PDT
 
Thank you for your post welte! Following receipt of this billing
statement, I  contacted Pacific to get an "estimate" for this
procedure thinking that I would have some ammunition when I called the
their billing department to let them know an error had been made.
There was no mistake re: the "double in cost" for this particular
procedure. That is why I decided to contact U of M for their fee
schedule, which was virtually no different than the Mayo Clinic. 
Understand that this horrific fee charged by Pacific for this
procedure does not adversely affect my pocket book now, but in the
long run, it does affect insurance premiums, which are already are at
an all time high. Imagine if this procedure required a one day stay in
the hospital. Actually, at this cost, one would think it would have
been included.
Subject: Re: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST
From: ed777-ga on 12 Sep 2005 00:56 PDT
 
If you try other countries, as mentioned in medicalcountries.com, you
will find they have equal, better, or worse quality at up to 1/20 the
price. (Depending on the provided you chose in that country)
Subject: Re: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST
From: linezolid-ga on 12 Sep 2005 09:26 PDT
 
I think that y'all may have missed the most important information in
this question.  The cost of the exam and the doctor's fee for reading
it (which seem astonishingly high to me, but I am a doctor in a city
hospital: we specialize in the poor and medically underserved, and the
fee for such an exam would be about 1/10 of the price cited) are
irrelevant.  I quote: "I think I have gone insane
and now may need a cranial CT" -- my God, people!  This poor man
thinks he's losing his marbles!  Have some compassion, ferchrissakes!

Now, Rosebudd-ga, it may be a truism to say so, but in my experience,
people who are becoming mentally ill rarely say to themselves "I think
I have gone insane".  More often than not, they develop social
problems: difficulty dealing with spouse or family, losing friends,
substance abuse, losing their job, and so on.  In any case, a CT of
the brain is probably not indicated.  You should go to a good general
practitioner (an internist or family medicine specialist, for example)
and tell him or her what's bothering you.  He or she will evaluate
you, will order the appropriate tests or refer you to a specialist
(psychiatrist, endocrinologist, or neurologist, for example) as
appropriate.  Honestly, the last thing you should be doing is
researching the cost of a CT.

Good luck, and feel better.
Subject: Re: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST
From: rosebudd-ga on 12 Sep 2005 12:17 PDT
 
Linezolid, You have got to be kidding! The comment that I made "I
think I have gone insane and now I think I made need a cranial CT" was
said in total jest and you took that literally, ferrchrissakes? No, I
am not loosing my marbles as you suggest. My time belongs to me and if
I opt to spend 30 minutes to obtain a cost comparison of a CT scan
that I feel was performed at an outrageous cost, that is my choice to
do so. It is also my right to ask questions, no matter how ridiculous
you seem to think they are. And guess what? It is also my right to
choose and/or change my medical care provider.
Subject: Re: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST
From: linezolid-ga on 12 Sep 2005 15:26 PDT
 
Well, Rosebudd, I take it all back:  you have, indeed, gone a bit nuts.
Subject: Re: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST
From: rosebudd-ga on 12 Sep 2005 16:59 PDT
 
That's ok, I forgive you and your smug attitude. However, if indeed
you are a physician, I sympathize with the individual that might
encounter your medical service, i.e., diagnosis/prognosis and/or
advice based on your replies to this original posting. You might try
giving a good listen rather than drawing conclusions from what you
believe to be your ability to "read between the lines":)
Subject: Re: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST
From: jazzin-ga on 13 Sep 2005 18:26 PDT
 
The cranial CT scan fee seems terribly high.  I agree that there is a
radiologist fee which applies to any interpretation of a diagnostic
test, however, that fee seems grossly overstated.  Inpatient surgeries
don't even cost that much.  If you don't have insurance, perhaps
consider going to another state to have this done or see if there is a
charity sliding scale payment protocol
Subject: Re: ABDOMINAL PELVIC CT SCAN with CONTRAST
From: rosebudd-ga on 13 Sep 2005 19:30 PDT
 
thank you for your (kind) input Jazzin. The excessive fee of $7,604
was actually for an abdominal and pelvic CT scan. The radiologist's
fees were only $525 above and beyond that fee. I am covered by
insurance.  By the way, thanks to Babblemouth's suggestion to check
out Dartmouth's fees for healthcare services on the web... they
specifically outline their diagonostic test as $2,021 for abdominal
and $2,228 for pelvis CT scans. My curiousity got the better of me in
that I simply wanted to find out or get an answer to why a medical
establishment in SF could charge such an outrageous fee for this
specific exam, when other noted medical institutions in other parts of
the country charge substantially less.

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